livedarklions

I would think the more relevant question is whether the new owners are really operating Niner or did they just buy the name to slap on a line of bikes they were already planning? Ultimately, all that really matters is whether you like the particular bike, so if they are making good bikes with the Niner label, buy them, and if not, don't.

Koyote

Hell, Donald Trump has gone bankrupt a half-dozen times and he's president of the US. I suspect Niner will survive.

ogmtb

ogmtb

JonathanGennick 

The bankruptcy was a ploy to help sell the company. A ploy that was needed due to, if memory serves, a lot of debt. There's a good discussion over in the Niner forum on MTBR. The _interesting_ part is that there was even a specific buyer in mind. The plan was to go bankrupt and sell to a so-called "stalking horse" buyer. That plan didn't play out, the stalking horse buyer walked away, and some other company ended up buying Niner. So there was uncertainty during the process, and the result was not at all what Niner had wanted going in to the process. It's all history now, of course. Niner is a new company with new owners, and one can buy or not buy with that in mind.

livedarklions

Thanks, good info.
They're certainly saying the right things.
Of course, there's always the question as to whether the new ownership will stick to this arrangement, but that kind of uncertainty is true for any corporate entity.

jefnvk

No, just befuddled as to your notion why someone who would ask about the ramifications of a bankruptcy on a planned purchase is somehow the product of a poorly educated system, and quite frankly a rather condescending response to my pointing out that some significant portion of companies do in fact never recover from a filing didn't help.

So, I'll leave it at my remark before that response: no, a bankruptcy would probably not affect my decision, because I do my own service and the only thing of use to me a warranty would really cover is any unlikely frame defect, but to someone who is counting on after-sales service and support from a manufacturer and their dealer network, a bankruptcy would definitely play a considerable role in my decision.

ogmtb

The answer to your question is right there in my first response. I'll highlight it for you.

"So many folks cant grasp that bankruptcy does not always equal out of business, a shaky future, etc. It really speaks to the poor job we do as a society in educating our citizens about basic financial principles."

SteelThisBike

Actually, this sounds like a good outcome. The company was held back by debt. Chapter 11 processes can be drawn out and painful or short and sweet. This was the latter. The company had multiple suitors.

From the Bicycle Retailer piece:

"Niner filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy in late November, listing assets of $9.8 million and liabilities of $7.9 million and with plans to sell its assets to a Colorado investment group."

Ha, ha, they were in better shape than many companies that aren't seeking Chapter 11 protection.

Ultimately the BK court ordered that the buyer pay the principal creditors in full. Now, hidden in this are usually myriad "little guys" who get the screw. But if you read the announcement they claim to be using the same vendors. Hopefully no one got screwed and there's no ill will. From what I can see the company went for $10-12 million. Now they are pre-assembling bikes in their US facility to make things easier on dealers, and opening a Dutch distribution hub to increase business in Europe. Good things.

Here's what the new owner said to Bicycle Retailer:

"“Our investment puts those money problems behind them, freeing them to push their vision forward. While we want them to be efficient (and) frugal, we are investing heavily in R&D to get them back into the market with new product as quickly as possible. We also feel Niner has untapped potential in many global markets that they were unable to enter because of cash flow. With our investment and logistical support, Chris and team can now expand internationally.

“Other than our cash infusion, we are keeping our hands off," he said. "There will not be any personnel changes, they will continue using the same vendors they always had, and no one is moving."

m2244

An interesting article that reminded me of some of the (completely irrelevant) responses to the original question.

theglobeandmail ** DOT ** com/report-on-business/condescending-jerk-or-just-an-insecure-shy-person/article668231/

TimothyH

Again, more ignorance.

Selling a business under Chapter 11 is not a ploy.

It is perfectly legal and done all over the US every day.

https://www.frostbrowntodd.com/resources-1562.html


-Tim-

surlyprof

JonathanGennick 

It's legal. And it's a ploy. Perfectly possible to be both at the same time.

TimothyH

They were going bankrupt.

They would not have been able to pay their creditors without a buyer. They would have been in default and would have closed.


-Tim-

JonathanGennick 

We agree on that. I thought from your earlier post that you were saying otherwise. Yes, I agree. They were in trouble, clearly. It actually seems to me that they were looking far enough out to see the trouble early enough to find a way out of it, which they've done. Good for them.

livedarklions

So basically, to sum up--if you like the bike, buy it. There will definitely be a corporate entity called Niner to honor warranties, etc. Any questions of corporate stability boil down to whether the new owners will continue to let the current leadership of the company develop and make bikes in the same way they have been. That's irrelevant if your concern is just with a particular bike you want that's available now.

In other words, the only question the bankruptcy and sale raise is whether Niner will continue to make good bikes, and that's an open question for any company making bikes.

Sy Reene

Whether or not Niner continues as a company under new ownership, all should realize that that warranty coverage and handling can vary a lot after change of hands. Anyone can feel free to google results on Litespeed/merlin changes in ownership and warranty coverage as they went from independent to ABG, and then (in Merlin's case) to Competitive Cyclist and then to somewhere else now (now the same factory/owners as Dean I think).

TimothyH

I'm more worried about warranty on American Classic wheels than the Niner bike.

Feeling like this is a good time to post a random photo.

This is the RLT 9 RDO in single-day epic mode.

Bnystrom

I'm not convinced that the Niner frame warranty means much anyway. When I pointed out to them that the dropout and derailleur hanger design on the 2015 BSB9 RDO I own guarantees that the dropout will be damaged if the derailleur hanger fails as designed, their response was basically "Oh well..." They were unwilling to do anything about my damaged frame despite the fact that this is an obvious design flaw. It's not likely that I'll be buying anything from them again or recommending them to anyone else. There are a lot of comparable or better choices available now.

TimothyH

Niner Warranty Kudos one week ago.

https://forums.mtbr.com/niner-bikes/...s-1093340.html


-Tim-

autonomy

Garfield Cat

Good thing that in any bike, the frameset is the centerpiece and that everything else on that build may cost as much or more.

We will eventually adjust to the other new thing.