beatlebee 

I am registering for my first Crit and see that Cat 5 is split into two groups. Each race is 30 min long with 5 min between.

Any reason that I can’t race both? Or rather shouldn’t? Its $10 extra dollars to add the race. Or I could sign up for the 30+ Cat4/Cat5 which is about an hour before the Cat 5.

Thanks.

johnybutts

In my experience, 5 minutes isn't quite enough time to turn around and "race" again - sure you can ride until you get dropped but typically I need about 30min-1hr to recover from the last 5 min of the previous race.

If you think you'll get dropped in the first one anyways - it won't matter.

beatlebee 

Okay, so I signed up for the 30+ Cat4/5 which is at 8:20 and then the Cat 5 which is at 9:45. Both 30 min races. I am stoked!

Tips on what to do between the two races? I will have about 30 min. or so. If anything, I am hoping to use the first race to warm up and “learn” the course etc.

Homebrew01

Many of us do back-to-back races. Sit down, stay out of the sun and get a drink. 2 30 minute races isn't very much.
I usually pin the 2nd race number on first with it's own set of pins, then the first race # on top. After the first race, you just remove the first # without having to mess with the second #. If you only have a few minutes between races, try to have someone ready ahead of time to remove the first race # to save time.

beatlebee 

Cool idea. Thanks!

jsutkeepspining

my advice is just never get off the bike. Right after your first race just go and roll around the course, and lie up a little late. This will help recovery, even if i have 3 hours between races i try to stay on the bike. It keeps you loose and fresh.

shovelhd

I pin two jerseys, one with each number, and swap out. 5 minutes between races at certain venues is normal, i.e. Ninigret. In that case, I bring a cooler to the start line with a set of bottles for the second race and my second jersey in the cooler. Just let an official know it's your cooler so that they don't think someone forgot it. I've cut things pretty close doing this. I have had to chase onto the back of the group if the races were running behind schedule.

MrTuner1970

Two 30 minute races might not be that much to some. But for me as a 41 y.o. first-time racer, my first crit last year pretty much demolished me. It was a great experience, but I wouldn't have been ready to repeat that in less than two hours, let alone five minutes.

Might not be that way for the younger amongst us.

I think it's a good suggestion to keep riding between races to stay loose.

Homebrew01

I wish ... but I do have plenty of experience of getting wiped out in multiple races.

Racer Ex 

Or the older.

grolby

I know you ended up signing up for Cat 5 and Cat 4/5, but for future reference: generally if there are two separate races for the exact same category, it is because it is likely that the number of people who are interested in racing that category exceeds the field limit. This is most likely to happen with Cat 5, thanks to a low field limit of 50, rather than 100 (or more). So signing up for both Cat 5 races wouldn't be a good idea, since the promoters are holding two races to allow a maximum of 100 Cat 5 entrants rather than 50.

That said, it seems very strange to me that this promoter then goes and also runs a Cat 4/5 race, but I'm sure they have their reasons.

TMonk

my answer is "C":

all of the above.

Cleave

Hi robabeatle, the problem with doing the Cat 4/5 race first is that, since it's your first crit, you might be too tired to hang in the Cat 5 race. Of course you won't know unless you try.

I don't like back-to-back races. When I do them I pin both numbers on top of each other. Then I give a pair of scissors to someone who is watching or waiting to race and ask them to be at the start for the following race. They cut off the top number and I'm ready to roll.

When you become proficient at sucking wheels, it's possible to do three races in a day like I regularly do: Masters 55+, Masters 50+, and Masters 45+. I race in the 55+, try to race in the 50+, and hang on for dear life (and training) in the 45+. Several SoCal promoters have figured out they can maximize their income with people like me if they put other races in between the aforementioned races. The benefits of being old.

caloso

If I'm going to double up crits, 1hr is my preferred break. Back to back isn't enough recovery, more than an hour and I need to warm back up. I prefer pinning up two jerseys if possible.

carpediemracing 

As a promoter (I do race too) this was my first thought. There are two Cat 5 races because more than 50 Cat 5s show up and the rules limit the field of a Cat 5 race to 50. Likewise, a mixed field containing Cat 5s is limited to 75, again by the rules.

What I find curious is that the Cat 5 only race is scheduled second. If I were a Cat 5 I'd want to be fresh for my "target" race and then use the second race for training. As a Cat 3 I'd do a 3-4 race to try and do well and then the P-1-2-3 race for training. On the other hand a Masters Cat 4 could target that M30 4-5 race and then do the regular Masters race later.

Depending on where "space" is it may be chilly when you race. If so then you need to stay warm. I think everyone is assuming you're in a warm place, but even a San Diego can be chilly at this time of year. If it's less than, say, 65 deg F, then keeping warm may be more important than staying cool.

Some other thoughts - you should be able to do two 30 minute races without eating food (or drinking calories). However I find that a Coke is really refreshing if I'm doing a second race. You may find something similar, maybe for you it's a coffee or something.

In 30 minutes you'll get a bit dehydrated. Don't go crazy with hydration but just keep it in mind.

Bring everything you think you'll need - it may be that it's supposed to be chilly and it's warm, or it's really hot, or you end up hot after the race even though it's chilly, etc. For early season races the actual temperature may be off by a lot, and with wind and sun effects my clothing requirements vary wildly. Therefore I show up with everything from shorts to wind proof tights and everything in between.

Finally, unless you've been doing some hard core group rides, your first race will be, by far, the hardest ride you've ever done in your life. Just be prepared for this. When the pace cranks up it'll feel like the toughest ride you've ever done - it's because most new racers have trained with average speed in mind, maybe some wattage numbers. However racing is about responding to the other people's pace - if you can't hang on your race is over. Therefore peak speed becomes critical for new racers - if someone launches at 35 or 38 mph will you be able to follow? In a Cat 3 race this is normal. In a Cat 5 race there will be many racers that can't respond. This is especially true in early season Cat 5 races when fitness is all over the board, everyone is inexperienced with drafting etc, and there are some ringers in the field (like maybe a really strong triathlete or runner or other-cycling-discipline rider). Once you've done a few races you'll realize that these maximum efforts are normal (and actually not that hard if you're drafting properly) but the first time it happens it's usually quite a shock.

As an example of some maximal efforts check out a clip of a race I did. This race in particular was very interesting because there were points where I was going as hard as I remember in the recent past, yet other parts where we were going flat out and I was recovering.

When I respond to a couple attacks it seems okay - the first one, on the first lap, happened to be my fastest speed of the race and the highest power, but I felt okay at the end of the lap - I actually jumped in order to warm up (I started the race with basically no warm up). The guy that counters ("The rider that won Cat 4s solo") will be a Cat 1 by the end of the year, and he started as a Cat 5 - in an interview with a magazine he names Bethel as his first ever win. That's that ringer type rider I mentioned, naturally talented and just working his way up the ladder. Guido is another - due to a limited racing schedule he couldn't upgrade out of Cat 5 for a long time even though he was a semi/pro triathlete (and doctor to boot). Now he's a 3 and always a break threat - he's kind of like a Cancellara of the area.

Another jump, responding to my teammate's move to bridge to a break, killed me. I couldn't even get on the wheel in front of me.

Then trying to respond to a rival's move (Stephen) also almost killed me - I don't remember suffering like that in forever. The move itself was okay since it was anaerobic but the next two laps, sitting on my friend Mike's wheel, were just agonizing - I didn't want to turn around because I was so dizzy I was having a hard time holding a line.

Finally the leadout was almost easy. On the last lap I sat behind my teammate Cliff going 35 mph into a headwind and my heart rate dropped 5 bpm in about 20 seconds. This recovery gave me the legs to do a good sprint at the end. Incidentally he averaged almost 200w higher than I did in the race, more than double my average wattage. He worked for me because, get this, he does crits just for training. Later he'd get 3rd at Nationals in a Masters Cross race.


Good luck with your racing. I hope this helps.

cdr

topflightpro

For our summer Tuesday night race series, I frequently do two races back to back. Last year it was a 30 min race, 10 min off, then a 40 min race. Sometimes, if the weather wasn't looking good, they'd try to get the second race going as soon as possible - there were times where I had not even caught my breath from my sprint when the whistle blew on the second race.

In between races, I would frequently just grab a gel and swap bottles - mostly I used the water to cool me down because it was hot out there.

And in less than three weeks, I'll be doing three races in one day. That should be fun.

kensuf

I'd do both. Pop a gel in between. You should be fully warmed up for the second race!

Go get them tiger.

Psimet2001 

Do both. Always. You're a cat 5. What are you saving it for?

Pin the second number on your jersey then pin the first race's number on top using only. A few pins. Roll around back to the linup after the first race and ask someone to pull your pins/number from the first race.

If the two are back to back you will not be the only one doubling. Most of us make a sport out of how many we can do in a day.

Homebrew01

I did 3 a few years ago. Worked out to about 60 miles total, but pretty pooped in the third and I think I dropped out half way. Makes for a long day too, so I usually just do 2 if they are close together.

HMF

Those numbers don't tear off so easy. 2 jerseys is the way to go if you're short on time.

waterrockets 

I have just safety pinned them both in place, in the order of racing. Then, after the first race, I swing by the medical tent and ask them to cut the pins off the first number (so some shrapnel stays pinned). They have big scissors.

shovelhd

You have a medical tent.

caloso

One of the benefits (?) of being a 45+ Cat 3 is being eligible to race 3 or even 4 times in a single day. Haven't done the triple yet, but probably will soon.

topflightpro

Your races use different numbers for different fields? Around here, they give us one number for the day - sometimes for the entire series.

shovelhd

Training races do that. USAC races have different number sequences for each field most of the time.