wphamilton

Technically "roadway" is the portion of the road used for normal vehicular traffic, and the shoulder is not part of that.

In practice, if the shoulder is clear I'd be riding on it and glad of it.

Iride01 

We have them here too. Ever so slowly adding more.

Iride01 

If a vehicle is moving on the shoulder, motorized or not, what are it's right-of-way considerations? Leaves a vague area IMO.

One example will be who is in the right when the person on the shoulder goes straight, and the person in the traffic lane wants to turn right.

Generally, shoulders are for emergency or other times when a vehicle must stop to check on something.

indyfabz

The real fun was last year in Montana. Over two days I rode two separate stretches of I-90 that were closed to auto traffic and possibly bikes.

wphamilton

Not an area of expertise for me but I'm inclined to agree with you. When you're not on the roadway (technically) it's not the same as regular traffic. But that's where bicycles normally are so I expect that is taken into account. Also I'm not sure that "in the roadway" is a requirement for right of way, at least in some cases.

For example, even involving only automobiles if you are stopped at an intersection and leave room at the right for someone to pull up beside you - even including the shoulder - and someone does and you hit it, you are held at fault. I've heard this from cops, seen tickets, and it's held up in court as far as I know. So apparently it doesn't totally eliminate right of way factors. I'd expect with involving a bicycle it would be even less so because it's more normal and expected for a bike to be there.

Riveting

The nastiest stuff is always on the far right (as seen on BF somewhere)

colnago62

It is incumbent on the person turning, changing lanes, following another vehicle to do so in a safe manner.

Maelochs

The best thing to do here is to contest the ticket. Likely the cop will not even show up in court, and if so, one can make the reasonable arguments suggested here.

Pretty obviously it is stupid to argue with a cop on the roadside, but in court, you can bring reams of research and catch the prosecutor off guard---if the cop shows at all.

You still might have to pay the ticket, but you would have had to pay that anyway. You might get assessed court costs .... but you have the option.

MinnMan

Typical bf thread. Newbie OP posts a question that answers itself and doesn't reappear in the thread at all; regulars sidetrack onto something totally different, get into arguments.

gargle, rinse, repeat.

Iride01 

So? You don't like conversation that has diverse opinion and strays from OP topic?

Paul Barnard

"The shoulder" is much like "the MUP." They are not all created equally. Some shoulders are fantastic places to ride bicycles. Some are not. When practicable, I'll take a shoulder over a travel lane 100% of the time.

MinnMan

As a general proposition, I do, though some are more interesting than others.

It's Easter Sunday and snowing in Minneapolis. I'd like to be out riding but I already mothballed my winter gear and took the studs off the two bikes that have 'em. I'll get on the trainer later.

But I'm healthy and have plenty of food in the house, so I guess I have no business butting in to make snide comments.

Iride01 

No harm, no foul! I certainly can't say that I'm not guilty of the same on thread topics I don't like or understand. We've had quite warm weather for over a month and I've gotten a few hundred miles behind me here. I've had to take to the open roads and highways (state highways), as the multi-purpose paths are way too full for safe riding or safe social distancing. <grin>

seypat

It might be white line fever.

phillman5

I guess there is many different kinds limited-access streets. Here in Albuquerque on the far east side of town is a divided four-lane street that is somewhat limited access, meaning the only way on it is at major streets, no residential streets connect with it. You have three choices, taking it, a MUP that parallels it, or residential streets. The street is NOT signed against bikes. Going the 5 miles to get out of town, since its downhill I take it and almost flow with the traffic, there is a pretty good shoulder that doesn't have much debri for 3 - 4 feet right of the white line. Coming back, uphill I take the residential streets. The MUP I would say is more dangerous as often people are walking/running with their dogs and the leash often spans the MUP, there are often groups of walkers taking up the whole MUP, and little kids on bikes that are unpredictable and all over the place.

BengalCat

It varies or depends entirely upon the circumstances. How wide is the shoulder between the line and the curb and what condition is the surface of the shoulder.

Sometimes it can be an unintended mental mistake by the cyclist. For instance on westbound PCH between Santa Monica/Pacific Palisades: width between the white line and the shoulder varies hugely by location. There are many spots where there is little or no shoulder, so you ride the line itself or just inside it. You have to stay intently focused on that task. After you have done that long enough and often enough on PCH sometimes when you are riding that white line and then the shoulder suddenly reappears and begins and is wide. However, your mind just doesn't register it and you stay focused on the white line.

glennwegner

I am clearly a minority here. When I'm on any highway near where I live, there is typically a rumble strip about a foot from the white line. I ride just outside the rumble strip. This keeps me in a reasonably clean part of the shoulder. My big disappointment is when trucks move left when they pass. I prefer that they come by within a couple of feet so that I can catch that awesome draft. In the city, I ride as close to the curb as possible and expect people to squeeze past. I don't care how close they get as long as we don't make contact. I take what I believe is every sensible precaution, but I also ride assuming that one day I will get hit. Hopefully I'm wrong, but I still believe it's worth the risk to ride instead of driving everywhere.

Belgarath

In TX the law states “A person operating a bicycle on a roadway who is moving slower than the other traffic on the roadway shall ride as near as practicable to the right curb or edge of the roadway.” This doesn’t mean riding at the edge of the shoulder or near the curb. It’s about safety. As has already been said crap on the shoulder, lack of maneuvering room, obstacles, etc. are all safety considerations. Also here in TX, if there are 2 lanes in each direction, you are entitled to the entire right lane. One of my commutes had 3 lanes in each direction and a curb with no shoulder. I had to take an entire lane for safety. In this case I ride just left of the center of the lane. You have to force them to pass you in the lane to your left. Otherwise they will try to squeeze by.

Also some white lines are painted with heavy paint the can be slick when wet. Again, safety is the priority. TX has a lot of rednecks that believe bikes shouldn’t be on the road at all. They don’t even realize it can be illegal to ride on the sidewalk. In the end ride as safely and predictively as possible while being considerate of those you share the road with.

Maelochs

Lol, this is the post least related t the OP's topic in the entire thread.

I assume you did that intentionally as an ironic gesture, and I applaud you.

es1bkacsur

many years ago when I was braver/dumber I rode on shoulder of US 40, a 4 lane hi-way. The air coming off any passing vehicle is much like the wake of a boat & when a semi-truck at 60 mph went by it was a big wake. The initial wave of air coming off the front of the truck pushes you forward & then as the truck goes by you're in still draft air. Pedal harder while this is going on & you can upshift 1 or 2 gears & pick up an extra 10 mph for a while. The closer you get to the side of the passing vehicle the greater the effect, & the greater chance of getting plastered which is why I don't do it anymore.