CrimsonEclipse

It's kind of an odd ask, but I'm looking for a 14-15" MTB frame, steel or aluminum, with 68 BSA BB, tapered headset preferred (but can work with straight) and disk brake mounts (ISIS or post but ISIS preferred), and vertical dropout.

I'm searching the standard sales sites with some success, but sometimes folks here have really cool and obscure sources that I seem to miss.

Thanks

14-15" frame, i guess.

Kapusta

There are countless possibilities. It would help to narrow things down.

What wheel size?

By vertical dropout, do you specifically mean for 135mm QR wheel?

Hardtail or full suspension? (I assume the former, but you never know).

What Are you using this for? XC, All Mountain, bike packng, or is this a frame for a commuter?

How long of a fork (how much travel) do you plan to run?

Finally, regarding size: most companies do not size MTBs by seat tube length any more. Are you simply looking for a “small”frame?

CrimsonEclipse

26" wheel (though I posted that.... this is why I shouldn't post while tired)
MTB frame with a 100-120mm fork travel.

Yeah, looking for a small frame but the sizes are all screwed up now, so I'm kind of guessing now.

Kapusta

If you want my recs, answer the rest of my questions.

What I can say is that finding a new 26” frame on real mtb these days will be tough. I’d most likely be looking used.

CrimsonEclipse

Hard tail... for... mountain biking?

yeah, a 135 QR

Kapusta

OK, then I would absolutely be looking used. Not to save money, but to get better quality. Outside of going custom, the only place you are likely to see new 26” QR mtb frames are on low end BSOs. 26” has been dead for real MTBs for about a decade. And QR has become uncommon.

But if you go back 10+ years you’ll find a few decent 26ers still made, and going back 15 even more.

What you will be missing out on are the improvements of modern geometry that have taken over in the past 5 years, but outside of custom I just don’t think you are going to find that on a 26” QR frame.

CrimsonEclipse

What is this "modern geometry" you speak of?

Kapusta

Google it. Also referred to as progressive geometry. Steeper seat tube angles, longer frame reach, slacker head tube angles. For trail riding it has made a big difference. Game changer, iMO.

Unless you are looking for an XC race HT… geo on those has not changed as much.

CrimsonEclipse

I'm not impressed by the newer geometry.

But thanks anyhow. I can now put a technical term to the upselling the bike shops have been trying on me.

Kapusta

That is what I used to think before I spent a few days riding one.

prj71

What doesn't impress you about it? Have you actually taken a ride on a newer bike? Or you just shooting from the hip here with an uneducated opinion?

Newer geometry results in more efficient pedaling on the flats and uphill and less likely that you go over the bars. Unless for some reason you like inefficient pedaling and increased chance of going over the bars...then by all means buy an old outdate 26" MTB with QR135 axles.

CrimsonEclipse

Better in climbs, worse in turns.

Everything engineering is compromise.

Kapusta

That is so not true.

MTB geo up until the late 2010’s was fundamentally being held back by the assumption that a ~73 deg STA was the optimum angle that could not really be violated without bad repercussions. The saddle-to-bb angle was considered sacrosanct. You pretty much wanted the same saddle setback on your road bike as your MTB.

Turns out that for most MTB riding, it is simply not true. Steepening it dramatically (like 76+ degrees) not only makes climbing steeps easier, but also by putting your weight more forward it allows a much longer front end (through both a longer frame reach and slacker HTA) while still being able to weight the front end… the key to good cornering. If anything, it actually encourages better cornering technique.

Are there compromises? Yes. One is that it makes it harder to get behind the saddle. But dropper posts ended up making that a moot point.

The other compromise is when pedaling on relatively flat and non-technical stretches where you are mostly just in the saddle cranking along…. Like Road and Gravel riding, and some XC race applications… though even a lot of XC bikes are turning towards modern geo with steeper STAs. I also find that I like the more traditional geo on my Fat Bike, as I ride lot of flat and non-tech stuff.

This is why I asked you what specifically you were using the bike for.

prj71

Not sure you'll convince the OP unless he makes the move from 1995 to 2023.