Ged117 

Hi all,

I'm taking a few days to ride from Toronto to Kingston along Lake Ontario's Waterfront Trail. I'm going to ride my '90 Schwinn Voyageur. I've got front and rear low-rider racks - one is a Jandd, the other is a Topeak. I'll be camping at least one of the nights in Presquile Provincial Park. I've got good camp gear and I'm a minimalist by nature, so for a few days' journey I will carry the minimal clothes needed, tools, my cook set, food, spare tubes, tent, sleep pad, rain jacket, toiletries. Right now, I've got regular yellow sticker Panaracer Pasela 27 inch tires mounted on the Araya alloys, which are in great shape. The bike has been completely rebuilt and re-greased. I'm just not sure about those tires on longer journeys. The trail is mostly paved paths and quiet secondary roads, but the regular Pasela tires can be sensitive. I can patch or change out a tube, but I want to avoid doing it too often, or during inclement weather. Do you think the 27 inch Pasela Protite tires or Schwalbe Marathons would be worth purchasing for extended weekend trips, or journeys lasting a few weeks on paved roads or paths, with occasional dirt / debris / pavement in rough shape? Anybody ridden that section of the Lake Ontario Waterfront Trail before?

This will be my first extended weekend trip. I've found some older Canada-made Serratus/Mountain Equipment Co-Op panniers, which should do the job nicely. I'd rather not pay the $80 to upgrade the tires if I don't need to (Panaracer Protites are about $45 each here). I'm just worried about the additional weight from my gear and the thin sidewalls / soft read of the regular Pasela tires.

Pic for clicks:

gerryl

27 inch tires are a real pain in the ass: limited supply and poor selection, as you have no doubt noticed. You would be much better off with 700C. That being said, 27" is what you have so you have to work with that. Your up coming ride isn't that far, the roads are good and you're traveling fairly light. As someone who has toured on similar tires, I would say you should be ok. Note that the rear tire will wear out a lot faster than the front, so try to keep an eye on that.

lax

I ride the 1000 islands parkway just about every week! I use exclusively regular wire bead paselas, and have only had 1 flat this year, on a pair that was just at the end of its life, and on a city street. I think unless you are on the heavy side, you should be fine, just make sure to bring something to boot your tires with... you might have a hard time finding a replacement on the road for 27".

djb

Im not familiar with Paselas, but I can say that just yesterday in a bike store here in Mtl, I saw good quality 27in tires. I wasnt looking for 27s, but noticed Gatorskin 27x1 1/4 and some regular marathons.
Good tires are never a waste of money, so if you have doubts about the condition of your tires, get some good ones like the ones Ive mentioned, and they will remain in great shape for numerous seasons.

as always comes up with tire discussions--a great deal of common sense and observation comes into play here. Be attentive, dont run over glass and stuff, if you do, immediately stop and check your tires, rubbing the surface with your finger to check if any teeny tiny bits are stuck in; and keep an eye out for potholes and stuff and simply dont bash into them.

heck, today on a ride I ran over some glass and took the 45 seconds to check both tires---its a heck of a lot faster than changing a flat.....

and dont let pressures get too low.

all common sense stuff.

have a fun ride, Ive thought of doing this ride sometime. Toronto to Montreal.

ps, hope its not like last week, hotter than Hades....

MarcusT

Marathons can give you sticker shock, but they are puncture proof and last a long, long, long time. If this trip is a one time thing, then maybe the investment does not balance out, but if you bike regularly, go for the Marathons

Ged117 

Thanks for the replies all. The Panaracer tires on it now only have about 1000km or a bit less on them at this point, and the wear is minimal. For this trip I'll carry some tire boots and my usual repair kit. I wish folding 27" tires were available. I have Schwalbe Marathon (regulator marathon) tires in 700c that were mounted on a hybrid I commuted on - they are waiting for me to finish building the 700c wheelset for my Peugeot. They are very good tires, if dull or dead feeling. Once the original Suntour hubs or Araya wheelset on the Schwinn wear out, I'll switch to 700c. There are still many good options in 27" like the Panaracer line, Gatorskins, etc. I was surprised at how many options were available at my LBS.

I'll post photos of the trip. Lax, I really enjoy the 1000 islands trail. I plan to use it for some tour training.

djb

again, if they are in good shape, keep pressures at a good level, and just look where you ride and use common sense, it will be fine.

Wilfred Laurier

I started a tour with Paselas last year. 8 days, ~12 flats, and two damaged casings later (mostly on the rear) I bought a Specialized BlackBelt tire... slower than spit compared to the Paselas, but my frequency of flats dropped off sharply.

If you find your tires are causing problems, you can replace with a cheapie from Canadian Tire on the way, or, as mentioned, find something better in a bike shop when convenient.

Wilfred Laurier

This was generally my experience - I got a few punctures with my Paselas, but the tires were otherwise tough enough, except when I hid a the edge of patch of torn up ashphalt at 40km/h in the dark.
Don't be an idiot like I was and there should be no problems.

djb

Well ged, You're just going to have to make the judgement call.
And WL, I don't know what to say about all your flats.
Over the years I've done maybe 10 self supported trips, and maybe 6 or7 week long supported trips, and had one flat on an unloaded supported trip.
Touch wood
And my first trips were in 89 to mid 90s and the tires were ok but they've improved flat protection over the years.

acantor

If the tires are in good shape and not too worn, you should be fine for this relatively short trip. I've biked from Toronto to Kingston twice. The trip takes me four days, not counting extra time I spend in Prince Edward County, which is a cycling paradise. That works out to about 50 miles / 80 km per day.

If you are hoping to stay at a B+B in Prince Edward County, call ahead, several days before if possible. The County has become very popular during the past 10 or 15 years. Contact me privately if you'd looking for a recommendation in Picton or Bloomfield.

My only suggestion about your route is to skip biking out of Toronto. It's not that pleasant. Instead, take the Go Train to Rogue Hill, or even to Oshawa. You can grab the Go Train at Union Station, or at Danforth Station (at Main). You may not be able to bring a bicycle on board during certain hours, so check ahead.

djb

nice suggestion about train.

dont forget camping at Sandbanks, Im fairly certain that they now accept cyclists no matter, but check. Used to family car camp there for about 15 years, and I think there is an overflow area they can stick cyclists.
I have biked from Sandbanks to Kingston, taking that small ferry and following route whatever , its a not bad ride, about 80km, a bit noisy into Kingston, but nothing horrible. Nice enough for the rest of it.

Ged117 

I can't promise that I won't be an idiot, but I'll try. I don't plan on cycling in the dark, but everybody misses a step sometimes.

I've had a good experience with these regular Paselas so far, I think only two flats in two years. I think that as I get into longer trips or touring more often, I will upgrade.

Thank you for your suggestions. I plan to stay in Sandbanks Park, a beach campground near Cobourg, and Newcastle where I have some family after leaving Toronto. I did some finagling with Google and found that if I take the route through Scarborough's parks network to the Waterfront Trail where it meets Highland Creek, I can follow the park trails along the creek downstream through Danforth, Morningside, and Thomson Parks from my origin in Scarborough. This should be a neat experience. Did you ride the Waterfront Trail the whole way? There is a section of the recommended path that follows near St. Mary's Cement just east of the nuclear station at Darlington. I'm not sure about road access there - Google maps indicates that it is private.

Thanks for the responses all. Now I've gotta figure out which weekend I go. Things are getting hot...

I've camped at Sandbanks a fair amount. I did consider ending at Picton, but I would like to ride right to my door. If I leave Sandbanks early enough I think the Highway 33 traffic would be tolerable near the city.

acantor

Yes, I biked the entire way to Kingston, but I started at Rouge Hill (on one trip) and Oshawa (on the other trip).

I don't recall a problem getting around Darlington, although the route was different both times. So bring an up-to-date map or the electronic equivalent! (Confession: I'm a bit of an evangelist for paper maps for bike touring.)

And speaking of Darlington and things nuclear, keep your eyes open for the nuclear waste storage facility along the Waterfront Trail. Someone tried to cut holes in the chain link fence that borders the facility, and apparently, they succeeded! Signs of the repair to the fence are easy to spot!

I found Scarborough or Oshawa to Newcastle to be about right for Day 1.

Newcastle to Port Hope is reasonable for Day 2. If you are feeling energetic, you might reach Cobourg.

Cobourg (or Port Hope) to Sandbanks will be a long day of riding, but it's do-able. I've done it twice.

Until you arrive at the outskirts of Kingston, Sandbanks to Kingston is a pleasant ride. Make sure to stop at Lake on the Mountain. If you need bike services, pass through Bloomfield, where there is an awesome bike store. The ferry ride from Glenora is special, and free. When you disembark at Adolphustown, you can either stay on Highway 33, or follow the myriad of backroads (which will add distance). One time I rode east along Highway 33 into a strong headwind and arrived in Kingston totally wiped and unable to pedal another minute. The other time, I made it to Kingston within a few hours, met a friend for lunch downtown, and then continued on to Sydenham.

Ged117 

Thanks. I have the Waterfront Trail map book, and I'm also a little old fashioned and prefer paper maps with my phone and data plan as back up. I've taken a good look along this route. I was thinking Scarborough > Newcastle > Presquile Park > Sandbanks Park > Picton for a big breakfast and then home to Kingston. I think Newcastle to Presquile Provincial Park (about 80km) is do-able, and I'll make a few stops for food and water in Port Hope and Cobourg. Presquile to Sandbanks is 60km so that'll be a nice ride into the county with the rest of the day to swim and enjoy the park. I noticed the bike shop in Bloomfield - there is also Slickers' Ice Cream I'll stop at the bike shop too just to check it out or if I need a tube or tire. I figured Highway 33 would be busy as I approach Kingston, especially east of Millhaven. The Lakeshore Road looks like a really nice section, along with the Waterfront Trail itself. I'll keep an eye out for the nuclear storage facility..I don't know why anyone would want to pay it a visit. They're decommissioning Darlington Station starting in '24, the work is projected to take a few decades. This should be fun and a great learning experience for future, longer rides, especially with my camp gear along.

djb

heard this song immediately in my head reading of Darlington
still have the cd