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On being SEEN - NOTICED- LOOK!

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On being SEEN - NOTICED- LOOK!

Old 07-09-19, 05:25 AM
  #101  
jon c. 
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm
Start thinking like a driver! You after all are one! Most drivers aren't cyclists, but all cyclists with only fractional percent exceptions are also drivers. You know what you can see and what you can't and therefore much of what goes on in these threads shouldn't.
That makes sense. I drive on the same roads I cycle on. When cyclists have lights and ride in the center of the lane, I see them much sooner. Eliminates surprises. As a driver, I appreciate that so as a cyclist, that's what I do.
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Old 07-09-19, 05:26 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by Jaackil
In Germany a country with more registered bicycles than people bicycles are required by law to be fitted with lights front and back that work and must be on from sunset to sunrise if not there are hefty fines.
I work with Germans, many of which cycle. If their lights do not work, they walk their bikes. If their lights stop for any reason, they walk their bikes. They are quite the oddity. The joke here at work is that America has laws telling you what you can't do while Germany has laws telling you what you can do.

Not having lights or wearing visible clothing is a sure recipe for disaster. We had a cyclist hit and killed a couple of years ago on a busy highway doing just that.
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Old 07-09-19, 08:59 AM
  #103  
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Originally Posted by njkayaker
No one made this claim.


This is silly.

No one (in this thread) is doing this.
I wish you wouldn't continually characterize my intellectual property as 'silly' or 'unhinged' or whatever dismissive term you can come up with. Stop stalking me. What would a kayaker know about any of it anyway. Every poster listing the several kinds of lights they use in the daytime to enhance visibility is putting an importance on the driver seeing them! My argument is that beyond a bare minimum, a practical minimum, there is no need to spend multiple hundreds of dollars to be safe IN DAYLIGHT. Either you is or you ain't. If a driver is texting they aren't going to see you no matter what you are flashing at them. Given that all drivers are texting while driving I am not sure why people are making such an effort to be seen.
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Old 07-09-19, 09:32 AM
  #104  
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People texting do look up from there phones at intersections and in between or they would wrap their car around a tree, pole or a car. Flashing lights do work. Getting someones attention with noise and light at in intersection does work. Complaining about others who use lights is not a point of interest for me or other rational people.
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Old 07-09-19, 09:48 AM
  #105  
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Originally Posted by Rick
Complaining about others who use lights is not a point of interest for me or other rational people.
Guess you managed to miss the all caps in my post. But no, I'm not complaining about what anyone else does. Rock on. I'm complaining about the shaming that goes on of those who don't want to go along with the paranoia culture. Or those who present paranoia as a rational response to the daily crap that happens when you are out among the heathen IN DAYLIGHT!!!
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Old 07-09-19, 01:15 PM
  #106  
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Unlike many European countries. The US does not require distracted drivers to be responsible for their actions especially when the injured party is a bicyclist. If someone knew they were going to end up in court and loose their right to drive they would be more attentive. The I didn't see them excuse holds no water there. The insurance lobbyists are in control of our morals in the US. Motorists have very little incentive to drive with care because their are little or no consequences for their actions in many cases. You see a few cases were a drunk or someone on drugs gets a lengthy jail sentence but most collisions involving bicyclists are deemed the bicyclists fault.
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Old 07-10-19, 04:13 AM
  #107  
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm
I wish you wouldn't continually characterize my intellectual property as 'silly' or 'unhinged' or whatever dismissive term you can come up with.
Stop saying them.

Originally Posted by Leisesturm
Stop stalking me.
???

Originally Posted by Leisesturm
My argument is that beyond a bare minimum, a practical minimum, there is no need to spend multiple hundreds of dollars to be safe IN DAYLIGHT.
Who does this?

You are fond of straw man arguments.

Originally Posted by Leisesturm
Seriously, do you think only cyclists that were riding ninja get creamed?
Straw man argument. No one thinks this.

Originally Posted by Leisesturm
All this emphasis on putting the responsibility for a good outcome on the driver is wasted energy IMO.
Straw man argument. No one does this.

Originally Posted by Leisesturm
Every poster listing the several kinds of lights they use in the daytime to enhance visibility is putting an importance on the driver seeing them! My argument is that beyond a bare minimum, a practical minimum, there is no need to spend multiple hundreds of dollars to be safe IN DAYLIGHT. Either you is or you ain't.
This makes no sense.

Last edited by njkayaker; 07-10-19 at 04:29 AM.
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Old 07-15-19, 12:12 AM
  #108  
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Well I have almost creamed a few bicyclists that ride without lights at night. It is why they have a law that require lights on your bike. Really its common sense. Like wearing bright colors help during the day does. To not do so, is dangerous and stupid.
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Old 07-15-19, 09:23 AM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by mtb_addict
This tells me your were driving too fast or not paying enough attention to the road.
Do you want everyone to drive at walking speed? I've witnessed an accident where one driver was driving a delivery truck without lights on and another one broadsided him. The car with the lights just seemed to explode in front of me. I was going in the opposite direction so the car without lights crossed in front of me after hitting the other car. I still couldn't see him. Do you honestly think that the guy whose car exploded should have been driving slower?

And if you can miss a delivery truck in the middle of the night, what chance do you have of seeing a bicycle.

Originally Posted by mtb_addict
Lights are not required by law. Only reflectors.
This is incorrect. Every state in the US requires active lighting for the operation of a bicycle at night. The requirement may be for only a front light like my state but all states have at least that requirement. The Consumer Product Safety Commission requires that all bikes be sold with reflectors only but all states require active lighting on either the bike or the rider.

Originally Posted by mtb_addict
I never have any problems with bike ninjas. I have good headlights on my car, and can see them. If the road is very dark, then I slow down and be on high alert.
I've had problems with bike ninjas while on a bicycle and I have extremely good lighting on my bicycle. That said, I don't expect people to slow to a crawl everywhere they drive because an unlighted (and illegal) bicyclist may be riding in the area. That's just silly.
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Old 07-15-19, 12:09 PM
  #110  
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Originally Posted by cyccommute
Do you want everyone to drive at walking speed?
Probably the answer from some of our more dogmatic A&S (and LCF) friends would be yes.
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