Hoopdriver

I realize that this is only peripherally bike related, but nevertheless thought it brings up some important issues related to responsibility. Guy on the scooter was going a bit fast on the sidewalk, however the driver appears to exit the garage without much caution. Scooter guy is in the wind and the incensed driver is seeking compensation from Bird. In my opinion this is yet another incident that could have been easily prevented by both parties operating their vehicles prudently. Raleigh was blindsided by the appearance of the scooter company, but in response to the huge number of complaints (as well as injuries) recently passed an ordinance prohibiting use on sidewalks. They are allowed to use bike lanes. In this instance, it seems likely that had the scooter operator been on the street the crash would have still been likely.

Scooter crashes into car

jon c. 

Seems like scooter rider would have had right of way in that instance.

rumrunn6

no one expects a pedestrian to be moving at 15mph. for all we know the car driver was being cautious, looked left then looked right, but while looking right the scooter flew at him. in my opinion these things should be in the roadway & should have to abide by motorized vehicle laws or at least bicycle laws with reflectors, lights, helmets, etc

TimothyH

A person riding a scooter isn't a pedestrian.


-Tim-

Paul Barnard

I have had one close call with a bicyclist in all my years of driving and it happened right around the corner from my house about a year ago. As I pull out of my subdivision onto the main road, there's a tall privacy fence and a hedge row in the yard to my left. The fence and hedges run right beside a sidewalk. In order to see far enough down the street to make sure it's safe to pull out, I have to move well into the area where the sidewalk intersects the street. If any pedestrians were coming, They's be within my field of view before I drove into that space. One day a bicyclist was ripping down the sidewalk. He had to swerve to avoid me and swerved into the road I was going to enter. I am thankful there were no cars coming, because they may have hit him. My point is that you are right in that we commit to crossing sidewalks based on visually clearing pedestrian speed swaths of real estate. We are not anticipating and should not have to anticipate 15MPH traffic. That completely changes the dynamic.

This is the intersection and a view to the left.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.9932...7i13312!8i6656

jon c. 

https://kdvr.com/2018/12/05/e-scoote...across-denver/

rumrunn6

precisely why biking on the sidewalk is not legal

Flip Flop Rider

don't like scooters on the bike path because they are not bikes, but mechanized transportation devices

rumrunn6

italktocats

if you dont look, you wont see

another idiot that gotten their license with a 6pack

italktocats

you are aware of this and just keep going wow

noisebeam

that varies by country, state, city

squirtdad

Scooters in California are required to be on the road (not sidewalk), operated by 18 year olds an up and operator wear a helmet. almost none of these are observed.in actual use

I think the answer is that laws should be changed so it is the scooter company that gets the citation and the fine, not the operator. That would incentivise scooter companies to put better controls in place as to location, verification of rider age, and providing helmets

Paul Barnard

You can't comprehend a post and yet you comment anyway? Wow!

Milton Keynes

Uh, no. If you watch the video, the car is ready to pull out of traffic, and begins to do so when the scooter rider rams right into the back driver's side door. The car was already across the sidewalk in the driveway from the parking garage. The guy riding the scooter wasn't paying attention at all, then left the scene of the accident.

livedarklions

This isn't really a bicycling issue, but those things are just too fast and poorly controlled to be on a sidewalk. That car is not going fast and has already pulled out 3/4 of its length when the scooter hit it in the rear door. That means the scooter had several seconds to stop, and yet still ran smack into the car.

Having watched people slalom around pedestrians on a crowded sidewalk on these things, they're just a major accident waiting to happen. Either they need to be operated in the streets or not at all.

Paul Barnard

And from what I see the driver needed to commit to straddling the sidewalk crossing to be able to see well enough to safely enter the roadway. There are a lot of sidewalks situations that are similar. I described one earlier in this thread. While you are right that this is not a bicycling issue, the lessons certainly apply well to bicyclists.

livedarklions

Agree with all of that--there are very few situations in which I will ride on a sidewalk, and I would never do so at speed.

I forget that there are actually adults who consider riding on the sidewalk normal and/or safer than the street. It's a terrible idea in large part because of driveways, and even worse than the situation you're describing are driveways where the driver has no choice but to back out. It's bad enough dealing with that in the street, being on the sidewalk just cuts down the time you have to anticipate it.

CB HI

The parking garage is likely the most liable for this collision.

Line of sight is blocked leaving the garage for both drivers and sidewalk users. The garage has not compensated for that by either putting up a mirror and/or visual/audio warning system that a car is leaving the garage.

Boston may prohibit bicycles from sidewalks, but many cities/states do not or just limit the area to the center of downtown. Many cops would ticket a scooter if they used the road.

Sounds like the city only has rules and not laws/ordinances for the scooters. There will likely be several legal battles between cities and scooter companies because of this.

Scooter rider may have some liability if the sidewalk has a 10 mph limit and it can be proven the scooter was going 15 mph or over. Lots of runners travel at 12 mph.

wingless

wingless

wingless

Maelochs

JanMM

Similar incident in Indy earlier in the year. https://fox59.com/2018/09/20/downtow...ould-be-filed/
Here, too, e-scooters are not to be ridden on sidewalks. But, of course, folks ride them on sidewalks.

JoeyBike

They should change the name from Lime and Bird to Darwin Scooters. Hey, he's not on the sidewalk!