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Bike computers are worthless. Change my mind.

Old 06-24-20, 05:54 AM
  #151  
63rickert
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Stopwatch secured to handlebar with a Terry’s watch clip. No concerns about battery life as device is powered by winding the stem.
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Old 06-24-20, 03:23 PM
  #152  
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Yeah, the darn things don't even hold up well after being run over by a car(s).

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Old 06-25-20, 05:56 PM
  #153  
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Smart phones are worthless. Change my mind.

I make do with a free flip phone. I don't need mr Google tracking me wherever I go. I don't need some high buck data plan just to call in an emergency. Plus my house is an Apple-free zone.

scott s.
.
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Old 06-25-20, 05:58 PM
  #154  
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Cool story, boomers.
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Old 06-26-20, 01:02 AM
  #155  
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agree with the op. send me your garmins, wahoos, cateyes, etc, et al so that i may dispose of them properly.
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Old 06-26-20, 03:01 AM
  #156  
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Originally Posted by Ross520
Cool story, boomers.

Maybe the least effective use of that ever. Boomers on both sides of the "argument."

Having a separate device for everything seems kind of 2003 to me, but what do I know?
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Old 06-26-20, 07:15 AM
  #157  
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Bike computers are useful. Change my mind. VBEG LOL

Cheers
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Old 06-26-20, 08:08 AM
  #158  
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While it's a bit extreme to say cycling computers are worthless, I somewhat agree that one can easily live a happy cycling life using just a mobile phone app, provided that you're not training.

I have the Garmin Edge 530 that connects to Ultegra Di2 via the wireless module and also controls my bike lights... and the combo is really amazing. However, when I ride I also run the Strava app on my phone as a "back-up" of sorts in case the Garmin flakes-out (which it does on occasion). Because I'm not training for anything and cycling is mostly done for fitness and enjoyment, I find I glance down at the Garmin on occasion to see my cadence, speed, gearing, etc., but it's not like I change anything once I read the metrics. What I typically care about most is my "post ride report"... i.e., how many miles did I go, what was my average speed, etc. As such, I can and sometimes do ride w/o the Garmin at all and just enjoy the ride, knowing that my phone will tell me what I did with "close enough" accuracy.

Phone Battery Saving Tip: If you use your phone to track your ride using an app like Strava, turn off your WiFi and BlueTooth antennas (or just use "airplane mode") prior to your ride to save your phone's battery. When you're out riding, especially in remote locations, your phone will suck-up a lot of juice hunting for network connectivity that you don't care about. As long as your phone's GPS antenna is enabled, Strava can figure-out your speed and distance. I also keep my mobile data enabled so that my phone sends my location data so my wife knows where I am in case of emergency. If you don't have someone "watching out for you", then I'd suggest turning off mobile data as well and just sync Strava when your ride is done. Also note that on Android, there is a toggle for "Automatically turn on WiFi" which you'll want to turn off or else you'll find your WiFi antenna magically turns itself on.
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Old 06-26-20, 08:13 AM
  #159  
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Originally Posted by PoorInRichfield
While it's a bit extreme to say cycling computers are worthless, I somewhat agree that one can easily live a happy cycling life using just a mobile phone app, provided that you're not training.

I have the Garmin Edge 530 that connects to Ultegra Di2 via the wireless module and also controls my bike lights... and the combo is really amazing. However, when I ride I also run the Strava app on my phone as a "back-up" of sorts in case the Garmin flakes-out (which it does on occasion). Because I'm not training for anything and cycling is mostly done for fitness and enjoyment, I find I glance down at the Garmin on occasion to see my cadence, speed, gearing, etc., but it's not like I change anything once I read the metrics. What I typically care about most is my "post ride report"... i.e., how many miles did I go, what was my average speed, etc. As such, I can and sometimes do ride w/o the Garmin at all and just enjoy the ride, knowing that my phone will tell me what I did with "close enough" accuracy.

Phone Battery Saving Tip: If you use your phone to track your ride using an app like Strava, turn off your WiFi and BlueTooth antennas (or just use "airplane mode") prior to your ride to save your phone's battery. When you're out riding, especially in remote locations, your phone will suck-up a lot of juice hunting for network connectivity that you don't care about. As long as your phone's GPS antenna is enabled, Strava can figure-out your speed and distance. I also keep my mobile data enabled so that my phone sends my location data so my wife knows where I am in case of emergency. If you don't have someone "watching out for you", then I'd suggest turning off mobile data as well and just sync Strava when your ride is done. Also note that on Android, there is a toggle for "Automatically turn on WiFi" which you'll want to turn off or else you'll find your WiFi antenna magically turns itself on.
If all you're doing is logging data, you can also turn off the screen to save the battery as well.
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Old 06-27-20, 12:54 PM
  #160  
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Originally Posted by Ross520
Cool story, boomers.
how do you have time to ride in between tiktoks and waiting for social media to tell you what issue to be outraged about next )))))
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Old 06-27-20, 06:12 PM
  #161  
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I'm surprised at the issues some above have had with the 520. I have a 520 Plus (admittedly a slightly different unit) that's been reliable since I bought it last year. I've updated the firmware and maps a couple of times without issue. The battery life has been fine for me, a couple of weeks ago I returned from a 8 hour ride with about 35% left. I rarely use it for navigation but I've loaded routes probably ten times without issue and the unit has guided me accurately. The default screen setup is fine for me. It works reliably with my power meter, HRM, speed sensor and phone. The more recent versions of the Garmin Connect app have been very stable as well, rides upload almost instantly to my phone without fail. Physically, it's a durable little unit with a solid mount design, good buttons, good waterproofing and a tough case.

Not sure what there is to complain about, at least from my experience.

Last edited by Hiro11; 06-27-20 at 06:16 PM.
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Old 06-27-20, 11:13 PM
  #162  
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those are the technology from the time android phones and watches didn't exist and i agree that your phone can do everything it can do but with a phone you have to take it out of your pocked and unlock it an etc and you cant just let it stay there ! you have to be carefull about someone stealing it. on the cheap bike computer though you worry not !
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Old 06-27-20, 11:49 PM
  #163  
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Originally Posted by njkayaker
The 520 was always a weak choice for navigation.

​​​​​If navigation is important, the 520 wasn't the correct choice.
I agree, and I didn't buy the 520 for navigation. However With mapping being an option I downloaded an open source map for my area, and it is super cool to have and super cool to have a map with all of the roads showing! Unlike Garmins preloaded halfassed maps. (I really did look for a more professional word, and none of them really describe Garmins stock maps on the 520.) so basically everytime I go somewhere I just DL the open source map and then Install a different map on the 520.

I've been recently riding and not recording, so beating this horse, is well almost dead. The Last time I rode, I had dropped my van off for some custom work and then just rode. The State route I was on didn't have much of a shoulder and had way too much boating traffic. I pulled out my phone, looked at map, found an alternate route, and off I went. I had 6 hours to go waste Exploring is fun. IF I was using the 520, I could have done it all with the 520. so basically Now that I have the Phone.... the map loading on the 520 has taken a backseat.

MY hang up with garmin turn by turn is Well I want advanced cues. To pay for an upgraded RidewithGPS account to use advanced cues, I might as well just use the RidewithGPS app.

at the end of the day all things have short shortcomings. Phones, and apps get better, and well Garmin, they are still holding out on us. yeah yeah yeah, I bought a Kenwood indash Gamin GPS unit. so sue me for bashing on Garmin.

But hey can you blame me for not wanting a 1030 plus a Phone??? at mean at a certain point redundancy is a problem. and with my 520 already being tethered to the phone for weather, text,/calls/rideuploads... why not tether the mapping too? Garmin can, they just don't!!!

Maybe it is time for google to drop a Bicycle computer?
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Old 06-28-20, 11:08 AM
  #164  
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Originally Posted by Metieval
I agree, and I didn't buy the 520 for navigation. However With mapping being an option I downloaded an open source map for my area, and it is super cool to have and super cool to have a map with all of the roads showing! Unlike Garmins preloaded halfassed maps. (I really did look for a more professional word, and none of them really describe Garmins stock maps on the 520.) so basically everytime I go somewhere I just DL the open source map and then Install a different map on the 520.
The maps that come with the 520 don't have much detail. They are there to make the display of the "breadcrumb" track a little bit better. Downloading more detailed maps to the 520 is a bit of a hack. It wasn't intended that people would use the 520 that way. There isn't enough space on the 520 to have maps that cover enough of a region. Again, it's the wrong unit for this sort of use.

Originally Posted by Metieval
MY hang up with garmin turn by turn is Well I want advanced cues. To pay for an upgraded RidewithGPS account to use advanced cues, I might as well just use the RidewithGPS app.
There are a few things that you don't really know how they work.

You only need the "advanced cue" feature of RWGPS for units that don't use maps. This feature modifies how "course points" (Garmin's term) are displayed. Course points are intended to be used on units that don't use maps.

For units that use maps, the unit itself calculates the turn instructions. You get the cues 0.1 miles before the turn and they count down. (There's no extra cost for this.)

Originally Posted by Metieval
But hey can you blame me for not wanting a 1030 plus a Phone??? at mean at a certain point redundancy is a problem....
There's no reason a phone can't work reasonably well for navigation. Lack of redundancy has its own problems.

Originally Posted by Metieval
... and with my 520 already being tethered to the phone for weather, text,/calls/rideuploads... why not tether the mapping too? Garmin can, they just don't!!!
If the network access drops, you can live for a while without the weather (which I don't think is that useful) or texts/calls. One big advantage of the Garmins is that they work for navigation by themselves. I can use it in places where my phone doesn't work (and there are lots of those places) and on trips where I have no phone access at all.

Originally Posted by Metieval
Maybe it is time for google to drop a Bicycle computer?
Google has enough trouble selling phones. The market for bicycle computers is too small for Google to want to sell to. Google also wants to use "the cloud", which isn't ideal for cycling because you don't always have an internet connection.

Last edited by njkayaker; 06-28-20 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 06-28-20, 11:22 AM
  #165  
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Originally Posted by njkayaker

For units that use maps, the unit itself calculates the turn instructions. You get the cues 0.1 miles before the turn and they count down. (There's no extra cost for this.)
My 520 couldn't keep up in town with too many turns at 20+ mph. I've never used turn by turn again, and went back to RL cue cheat sheets taped to the top tube. I do use the Maps for Visual confirmation though. Because well street signs are often missing.


Originally Posted by njkayaker
Google has enough trouble selling phones. The market for bicycle computers is too small for Google to want to sell to. Google also wants to use "the cloud", which isn't ideal for cycling because you don't always have an internet connection.
Well That's not even apples to oranges, because Android rocks! Google can't sell phones because they have to compete with android/Apple.

But in the bike computer mapping Industry even Playskool could give Garmin a run for their money, because well Garmin sucks. For the Money Garmin could step up their game. it's the year 2020 Memory is CHEAP, yet charges arm/leg ! quit being stingy!
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Old 06-28-20, 11:27 AM
  #166  
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Originally Posted by Metieval
My 520 couldn't keep up in town with too many turns at 20+ mph. I've never used turn by turn again, and went back to RL cue cheat sheets taped to the top tube. I do use the Maps for Visual confirmation though. Because well street signs are often missing!
It's the wrong tool for that job. I was able to use an ancient 800 to do 600k rides (at times, in the dark) faster than using cuesheets. And people get lost using cuesheets regularly.

Originally Posted by Metieval
Well That's not even apples to oranges, because Android rocks! Google can't sell phones because they have to compete with android/Apple.
???

Outside of Apple and, maybe, Samsung, is hard to make money selling hardware.

Google doesn't need to sell phones. They get all they need providing Android to hardware manufacturers without the headache of producing hardware.
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Old 06-28-20, 01:14 PM
  #167  
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njkayaker,

You are 100% correct100% of the time when you take things out of context. Congrats on being 100% correct in "your world".

the truth is Manufactures don't even need to make a bicycle unit that sits on the bars, they (Garmin) are already losing sales to people that opt to use their phones (Andorid/Apple), "as is".
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Old 06-28-20, 02:34 PM
  #168  
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Originally Posted by Metieval
You are 100% correct100% of the time when you take things out of context. Congrats on being 100% correct in "your world".
You aren't making sense. That's your problem. Sheesh.
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Old 06-28-20, 07:05 PM
  #169  
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Originally Posted by FiftySix
Don't worry. All that facial recognition infrastructure tells us exactly where you've been. Mask or no mask.



It's all right; we know where you've been...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=lt-udg9zQSE

(Yes, replying to old post on thread. It's always a good time for Pink Floyd, though...)
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Old 06-28-20, 09:02 PM
  #170  
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You're overthinking this.

Originally Posted by Toespeas
the only use for a garmin or wahoo would be a hard ride or race , as far as functions go , a 30 dollar android phone can do everything you need while cycling , and if strava brought back heart rate i might be tempted to pay and use my phone to record races .

i guess dedicated computers can be a bit more accurate with gps , maybe cyclocross or MTB races would be best recorded with a watch ( a few cx racers in the pros had those watches ) , some are kind of more compact than a phone , BUT compare a 30 to 200 phone to a 100 to 400 dollar cycling computer and over all the phone wins every time . reply with any reason to choose a gps computer over a phone .



RANT : i mean does the 400 dollar wahoo roam even have a sd card slot to store and load maps and routes , i personally bought a garmin 520 because ti was in my price range, i thought it would be great for nav and routes but this thing sucks the battery only lasts 8 hours and it cant even hold 100 MBs of map data , doesn't have official functionality for map loading , i have to make separate folders and swap out my map sections just to get a map on screen and there is still no real time navigation , it cant play music or do turn by turn as well as my phone can but on my 30 dollar phone i have a full gps for free , why do these gps computers even exist , it would be beyond easy to add an SD card slot and expand storage , ok rant over , i still feel i should have spent the 150 on a new phone dedicated to my bikes

Raced and trained for many years with a "wired" computer starting with Cateye Solars. When the last Solar died (mountain bike), I bought a Garmin C20, refurbished for about $80.00 and it gives me a whole new dimension to my rides. The elevation feature is especially good, and I could do away with the wheel sensor. And the C20 is as small and unobtrusive as any wired computer I had. It's easy for me to read while on the bike (I have readers in my XXI sunglasses). The other thing is that I can review my rides on-line and see the differences among the three bikes (race, touring and mountain) over similar terrain. Personally, I think a cell phone mounted a bike is way too obtrusive and tempts one to concentrate more on the phone than riding the bike. I carry a phone on my bike, but ignore it if it rings. I'm riding. Mounted in front of you, you're tempted to answer it.Then your ride is interrupted. Maybe it's just me, but I started riding a bike when the only way to make contact was from a pay phone and I still like it that way. If I really needed a map, I'd throw one of my old Garmin $100 GPS's in my jersey and consult it when needed. Or just pull out my cellphone from the frame pack. Then mess with it for a while, when I should be riding. Usually, I know the route in advance.

If you really hate GPS's, I'll send you one of my old wired computers, maybe an Avocet or Nashbar. you'll need to furnish batteries.
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Old 06-29-20, 06:29 AM
  #171  
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Originally Posted by Kat12
It's all right; we know where you've been...

www.youtube.com/watch?v=lt-udg9zQSE

(Yes, replying to old post on thread. It's always a good time for Pink Floyd, though...)
Indeed.
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Old 08-24-20, 05:32 PM
  #172  
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Originally Posted by shelbyfv
Has anyone figured why OP wanted to change his mind? He seemed pretty content with his viewpoint
The OP may be a troll, but it has been a good discussion
at times
Sensoring up , GPS and maps , and training apps can be interesting, and you may or may not find them useful.
Sometimes you use the data, sometimes the game of chasing data.
there really isn't a good alternative to just trying things to see if they make a difference.
They may. They may not.
but sometimes the question is fun

DEC2020 edit:
Still a fan of minimalism.
Sensors easy to find for BT, can be found for ˜$15, and phones work pretty well,
Perceived exertion scales correlate pretty well with power meters for a great many
I think the bike computer is still not a matured product

Last edited by bikebikebike; 12-26-20 at 04:25 PM.
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