Post your Centurion Ironman.. For the love of 80s paint jobs!
01-25-19, 10:41 AM
#5976
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So you acquired your fine vintage steed, but you need more gearing. There are plenty of options/ways you can go. Let's talk about cranks. The best thing you can do is get a 110/74 BCD. Then you can go compact or triple route. All of the companies made them. There are other sizes available, but 110/74 is the best option. Here are some examples.
Look at the bottom photo. When searching for a replacement crank, you don't even need to include triple in your search. Just look for a 110 or 110/74 crank. Then look at the back side and look for the threaded 74 holes. As you can see, they came with different thread hole sizes. A compact will use your existing BB spindle. A triple will use a longer one. Most of the triples use a 121-121.5 BB. If you are not particular, there are inexpensive 121.5 spindles on Amazon. If unsure of the size, you can check on Velobase. There is also Sheldon Brown's BB spindle chart. You can also type your question into a search engine and the answer will usually come up. As for crank bolts, I prefer the Allen headed with dust cover ones. Most multi tools have a Allen wrench that fits the bolts. Handy if you have problems on the road.
Sugino makes basic chainrings in various sizes. They are sold from many suppliers for decent prices.
Last edited by seypat; 01-25-19 at 10:49 AM.
01-25-19, 11:24 AM
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You got that crank now. You have to decide between triple or compact/Big A cogs/long cage RD. If you are like me, you opt for the third option. Triple and Big A cogs/long cage RD. 
The following discussion is specific to the systems that came on the IMs.
If you are using index shifting that is an issue as well. I only use friction. Someone else will need to explain indexed as it pertains to derailleurs. Triple vs compact comes down to how much gearing you want. Over the years I have compared the weights of the options within the same level.(examples 105, 600) With a 30t cog on the back, the weight is about the same between the 2. If the compact goes to a 32t+/long cage RD in back, the triple is the lighter system. The compact will also have larger jumps between cogs. The IM 105 RD will shift a 28 cog. The 600 looks the same, so it probably will also. They will not do a 30t. If a 34t front 28t back gives you enough gearing, that is your least expensive, easiest option. If not you have to change something.
The following discussion is specific to the systems that came on the IMs.
If you are using index shifting that is an issue as well. I only use friction. Someone else will need to explain indexed as it pertains to derailleurs. Triple vs compact comes down to how much gearing you want. Over the years I have compared the weights of the options within the same level.(examples 105, 600) With a 30t cog on the back, the weight is about the same between the 2. If the compact goes to a 32t+/long cage RD in back, the triple is the lighter system. The compact will also have larger jumps between cogs. The IM 105 RD will shift a 28 cog. The 600 looks the same, so it probably will also. They will not do a 30t. If a 34t front 28t back gives you enough gearing, that is your least expensive, easiest option. If not you have to change something.
01-25-19, 11:39 AM
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You decided you have to change something. If you go triple, you will need a new BB spindle, but maybe nothing else. The IM 105 FD will not shift a triple. The 2 IM 600s I have will. I do not know about the Suntour GPX derailleurs. If you need a new FD just get a MTB FD from that period. Shimano Deerhead or Deore. Suntour Mountech works. Or something shiny/generic with very little graphics. It's a FD, it doesn't make much difference. RD is in the next post.
01-25-19, 11:41 AM
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Great info @seypat maybe you should also post that on the Centurion Info thread.
01-25-19, 11:56 AM
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You decided you have to change something. If you go triple, you will need a new BB spindle, but maybe nothing else. The IM 105 FD will not shift a triple. The 2 IM 600s I have will. I do not know about the Suntour GPX derailleurs. If you need a new FD just get a MTB FD from that period. Shimano Deerhead or Deore. Suntour Mountech works. Or something shiny/generic with very little graphics. It's a FD, it doesn't make much difference. RD is in the next post.
The RD-1050 on the Experts will handle a 52/40ish/30 or 50/40ish/28 front and a 12 low 28t cog setup. That's what's on my MV. I don't know about the 6400 or the Suntours. If you need something more, get a MTB RD from that period. If you look hard, you can find a decent price. Make sure they work with your shifters. rccardr and Robbie can help you with that. If anything needs to be changed or added, let me know.
The one on the left I bought with some 600 brake levers/FD for $10. Parts only. It had the pivot limit screw broke off. I removed the broken old one and replaced it. It took about an hour.
Last edited by seypat; 01-25-19 at 12:02 PM.
01-25-19, 12:08 PM
#5982
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Nice info, Pat. A few things to add:
A Shimano CX70 FD is a good derailleur for compact or triple shifting. Also come in braze on style, which can be convenient for some frames. Deore FD's are indeed the bomb but can be hard to find in 28.6, seem to be more common in 31.8. Shimano and a few other companies make shims to bring that down to 28.6 for an IM.
Do some research on FD/crankset combinations before jumping right in. Some FD's, notably the Deore style, really prefer to shift a 48/36/24 (old timers call this a 'classic' MTB ring setup), while road type FD's like Ultegra prefer a 53/39/30. Friction shifting up front helps, as you can make almost anything work most of the time, but if you appreciate the difference between some ring skating and nice, crisp chain movement from ring to ring, homework helps.
If using a triple, install a chain keeper to prevent the chain from overshifting past the small chainring. You can be as careful as you want withh limit screws and chain tension, but sooner or later, that chain will wind up sitting on the bottom bracket. And it will be at the worst possible time. Guaranteed.
If using STI shifters instead of downtube ones, best to find the ones that can be used with either triple or double cranks. Not an STI guy myself, much, but especially whe pairing STI's with a non-indexing FD like a 6207 or earlier Deore, having multiple movement and trim options gives you a better chance of having nice, reliable front shifting.
Speaking of which, if anyone is looking for an 8 speed Shimano option, I have a pair of like new RS500 shifters (look like DA7700) that came on a bike I bought for the frameset. Triple/double capable, work wth any indexing 6-7-8-9-10 speed Shimano RD except DA 740X and 10 speed MTB stuff.
A Shimano CX70 FD is a good derailleur for compact or triple shifting. Also come in braze on style, which can be convenient for some frames. Deore FD's are indeed the bomb but can be hard to find in 28.6, seem to be more common in 31.8. Shimano and a few other companies make shims to bring that down to 28.6 for an IM.
Do some research on FD/crankset combinations before jumping right in. Some FD's, notably the Deore style, really prefer to shift a 48/36/24 (old timers call this a 'classic' MTB ring setup), while road type FD's like Ultegra prefer a 53/39/30. Friction shifting up front helps, as you can make almost anything work most of the time, but if you appreciate the difference between some ring skating and nice, crisp chain movement from ring to ring, homework helps.
If using a triple, install a chain keeper to prevent the chain from overshifting past the small chainring. You can be as careful as you want withh limit screws and chain tension, but sooner or later, that chain will wind up sitting on the bottom bracket. And it will be at the worst possible time. Guaranteed.
If using STI shifters instead of downtube ones, best to find the ones that can be used with either triple or double cranks. Not an STI guy myself, much, but especially whe pairing STI's with a non-indexing FD like a 6207 or earlier Deore, having multiple movement and trim options gives you a better chance of having nice, reliable front shifting.
Speaking of which, if anyone is looking for an 8 speed Shimano option, I have a pair of like new RS500 shifters (look like DA7700) that came on a bike I bought for the frameset. Triple/double capable, work wth any indexing 6-7-8-9-10 speed Shimano RD except DA 740X and 10 speed MTB stuff.
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01-25-19, 12:21 PM
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Nice info, Pat. A few things to add:
A Shimano CX70 FD is a good derailleur for compact or triple shifting. Also come in braze on style, which can be convenient for some frames. Deore FD's are indeed the bomb but can be hard to find in 28.6, seem to be more common in 31.8. Shimano and a few other companies make shims to bring that down to 28.6 for an IM.
Do some research on FD/crankset combinations before jumping right in. Some FD's, notably the Deore style, really prefer to shift a 48/36/24 (old timers call this a 'classic' MTB ring setup), while road type FD's like Ultegra prefer a 53/39/30. Friction shifting up front helps, as you can make almost anything work most of the time, but if you appreciate the difference between some ring skating and nice, crisp chain movement from ring to ring, homework helps.
If using a triple, install a chain keeper to prevent the chain from overshifting past the small chainring. You can be as careful as you want withh limit screws and chain tension, but sooner or later, that chain will wind up sitting on the bottom bracket. And it will be at the worst possible time. Guaranteed.
If using STI shifters instead of downtube ones, best to find the ones that can be used with either triple or double cranks. Not an STI guy myself, much, but especially whe pairing STI's with a non-indexing FD like a 6207 or earlier Deore, having multiple movement and trim options gives you a better chance of having nice, reliable front shifting.
Speaking of which, if anyone is looking for an 8 speed Shimano option, I have a pair of like new RS500 shifters (look like DA7700) that came on a bike I bought for the frameset. Triple/double capable, work wth any indexing 6-7-8-9-10 speed Shimano RD except DA 740X and 10 speed MTB stuff.
A Shimano CX70 FD is a good derailleur for compact or triple shifting. Also come in braze on style, which can be convenient for some frames. Deore FD's are indeed the bomb but can be hard to find in 28.6, seem to be more common in 31.8. Shimano and a few other companies make shims to bring that down to 28.6 for an IM.
Do some research on FD/crankset combinations before jumping right in. Some FD's, notably the Deore style, really prefer to shift a 48/36/24 (old timers call this a 'classic' MTB ring setup), while road type FD's like Ultegra prefer a 53/39/30. Friction shifting up front helps, as you can make almost anything work most of the time, but if you appreciate the difference between some ring skating and nice, crisp chain movement from ring to ring, homework helps.
If using a triple, install a chain keeper to prevent the chain from overshifting past the small chainring. You can be as careful as you want withh limit screws and chain tension, but sooner or later, that chain will wind up sitting on the bottom bracket. And it will be at the worst possible time. Guaranteed.
If using STI shifters instead of downtube ones, best to find the ones that can be used with either triple or double cranks. Not an STI guy myself, much, but especially whe pairing STI's with a non-indexing FD like a 6207 or earlier Deore, having multiple movement and trim options gives you a better chance of having nice, reliable front shifting.
Speaking of which, if anyone is looking for an 8 speed Shimano option, I have a pair of like new RS500 shifters (look like DA7700) that came on a bike I bought for the frameset. Triple/double capable, work wth any indexing 6-7-8-9-10 speed Shimano RD except DA 740X and 10 speed MTB stuff.
01-25-19, 02:52 PM
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Hmm, triple. I can only add that Doc is completely right, some FD's prefer a compact setup, some prefer a larger triple. The only road triple FDs (Shimano) I've seen that like compacts are the RSX (from the 7sp era) and the 7730, which actually came with a lot of 3x10 hybrids. I don't know the limit, ring-wise on the RSX, but it came with a 48/38/28 crankset. The 7730 is 10-speed, but has a warning label on the back "50T max).
An RSX-era triple crankset will work on a symmetrical double BB. That's the only one I know of in that regard. The FSA Vero comes in a square taper compact, as well, in silver or black. It's cheap. I can't remember if this Truvativ/Bontrager crankset used a different BB or not.
Until the MTB's went to 135, most of the RD's for them will work with the corresponding road speeds, DA excluded in that 8-sp menagerie Shimano created.
Oh, and an Ironman can be tripled, it just cries a lot. Definitely a climber, though.
An RSX-era triple crankset will work on a symmetrical double BB. That's the only one I know of in that regard. The FSA Vero comes in a square taper compact, as well, in silver or black. It's cheap. I can't remember if this Truvativ/Bontrager crankset used a different BB or not.
Until the MTB's went to 135, most of the RD's for them will work with the corresponding road speeds, DA excluded in that 8-sp menagerie Shimano created.
Oh, and an Ironman can be tripled, it just cries a lot. Definitely a climber, though.
01-25-19, 08:34 PM
#5985
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Not mine and I don't know the owner . To me this bike is a little iffy , that is it looks like the carbon has UV damage . Is that a problem ? Or is it just sun damaged clear coat ? Other than that why is it sportin' non aero brake levers ? Who cares it's only $200.
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sf...792304268.html
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sf...792304268.html
Last edited by markwesti; 01-25-19 at 08:43 PM.
01-26-19, 09:28 AM
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The clear coat can get smoky or hazy, mainly due to UV exposure over time.
That's a project, but would be a good one. That model has the higher, rounded shoulder on the fork, identical to the Ironman Carbon. Same frame, just 600 tricolor kit vs. the Ironman's OEM Dura Ace.
A lot can be done with that.
That's a project, but would be a good one. That model has the higher, rounded shoulder on the fork, identical to the Ironman Carbon. Same frame, just 600 tricolor kit vs. the Ironman's OEM Dura Ace.
A lot can be done with that.
it looks like the carbon has UV damage .
Is that a problem ? No
Or is it just sun damaged clear coat ? Yes
Other than that why is it sportin' non aero brake levers ? History
Who cares it's only $200. Right. Offer 150 and get it outta there. Looks 56cm.
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sf...792304268.html
Is that a problem ? No
Or is it just sun damaged clear coat ? Yes
Other than that why is it sportin' non aero brake levers ? History
Who cares it's only $200. Right. Offer 150 and get it outta there. Looks 56cm.
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sf...792304268.html
01-26-19, 03:52 PM
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1985 Ironman
New to me 1985 Ironman
New poster, and new to me last fall 1985 Ironman. It was in nearly stock configuration when I got it, but I have changed a few things. Perhaps more pics in a day or two.
Steve
01-26-19, 04:17 PM
#5988
Senior Member
Yay a picture! Nice one too.
I'm Envious.
I'm Envious.
01-27-19, 12:25 PM
#5991
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So if you're looking for an Ironman where's the best place to look?
I try craigslist first, Austin, Dallas, then Houston. Next craigslist San diego Los Angeles, then the sf bayarea. Finally the eebay.
Seems California CL has the most and Texas CL next but I'm not sure. Where else can I search?
I try craigslist first, Austin, Dallas, then Houston. Next craigslist San diego Los Angeles, then the sf bayarea. Finally the eebay.
Seems California CL has the most and Texas CL next but I'm not sure. Where else can I search?
01-27-19, 01:53 PM
#5992
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01-27-19, 05:22 PM
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Now that the 84' Comp is finished (at least for right now) I started messing around with the 86' IM . I bought this chrome fork a few years back , it has the Cinelli slope crown that I love , but It's a little wonky , the dropout center to the bottom of crown measurement is about 3/16 more then the stock IM fork . I think if I don't tell anybody they won't notice , ooops I just told everybody .
Next embellishment , when I first got the bike it had Shimano 6207 600 pedals . They are nice pedals but they have this big bearing cap on the outside of the pedal , because I'm fairly new to the party I'm discovering new to me wonderful bits that will screw right on . Namely these beautiful 105 pedals that do not have the unsightly bearing bulge .
IMG_0191 by mark westi, on Flickr
IMG_0197 by mark westi, on Flickr
IMG_0211 by mark westi, on Flickr
IMG_0209 by mark westi, on Flickr
Next embellishment , when I first got the bike it had Shimano 6207 600 pedals . They are nice pedals but they have this big bearing cap on the outside of the pedal , because I'm fairly new to the party I'm discovering new to me wonderful bits that will screw right on . Namely these beautiful 105 pedals that do not have the unsightly bearing bulge .
IMG_0191 by mark westi, on Flickr
IMG_0197 by mark westi, on Flickr
IMG_0211 by mark westi, on Flickr
IMG_0209 by mark westi, on Flickr
Last edited by markwesti; 01-27-19 at 05:37 PM.
01-27-19, 08:14 PM
#5994
Senior Member
Mark, your '86 is in really nice shape, Much better than my '86. What tires are you running and tell me about that double ended crescent (adjustable) wrench, I don't think I've ever seen one quite like that.
01-27-19, 09:55 PM
#5995
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Thanks for the thumbs up Tony , the tires on the 86' are Continental Giro's (tubulars) , for the price I can't say enough , the ride is really something that has to be experienced . You noticed my little double ender , it is pretty cool , wrench heads like us dig that stuff right . To the best of my knowledge that was made by Cresent as a promo type thing advertisement . For the life of me I don't remember where I got it but it is a favorite tool , I use it in tandem with a cone wrench , cone wrench on the inside skinny nut and the Cresent on the out side fat nut .
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CRESCENT-6-...SJ1h:rk:7:pf:0
I see on this one the pins for the thumb wheel are missing , that happened to mine too , easy fix . mw
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CRESCENT-6-...SJ1h:rk:7:pf:0
I see on this one the pins for the thumb wheel are missing , that happened to mine too , easy fix . mw
01-28-19, 07:09 AM
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6 speed to 7 speed on an 1985 ??
Just looking at the pics on Brians nice 86 IM and I got to wondering if the Shimano 14-28 would work on my 85. I believe I even may have one I got from a bike co-op when I was converting my old Schwinn Super Sport to a 6 speed cluster. I wanted to see if a 7 would fit but it didn't. I have already switched out the front ring to a 39t low on my 85 IM.
Steve
Steve
01-28-19, 07:15 AM
#5997
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Sure will. In fact, a 130 OLD rear hub will snuggle right in there, and the stock 6207 RD and shifters will happily shift all 10 cogs out back if you let them.
My (now sold) '85, with a Tiagra hub laced into the stock Araya rear rim and a 10 speed cassette:
My (now sold) '85, with a Tiagra hub laced into the stock Araya rear rim and a 10 speed cassette:
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01-28-19, 07:50 AM
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Thanks, 126 mm I think
Steve
01-28-19, 08:09 AM
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Great looking bike! You can't go wrong with that color combo. I really like the style of the 85 DT decals.
Last edited by seypat; 01-28-19 at 08:26 AM.