PeteHski

1x11/12 MTB drivetrains were a game-changer for me. I ride a lot of technical singletrack that was often an unwelcome challenge shifting with a traditional 3x and it’s not like I was an inexperienced rider. It is no surprise to me that the entire modern MTB world has chosen 1x12. They work flawlessly with zero chance of dropping a chain.

RH Clark

The faster part of friction is that it's not necessary to click and rotate through 10 gears to get back to the lowest. Just a lever throw and one rotation gets you from highest to lowest.

noimagination

????
The OP was 5/31/23
My reply was 6/1/23
(\confused)

Koyote

​​​​​If you need to get from one end of the cassette to the other in one shift, you're doing it wrong.

Kapusta

Only reason I would go back to friction would be…. shoot, I’m coming up empty here.

Maybe if I were spending a long time cycling through a remote part of the world? But
i’ve got no plans to do that.

RH Clark

When you drive a stick shift car fast and come to a full stop, you don't shift down through the gears to get back to first. When I ride fast down a hill to a stop, I don't have to shift through 10 gears to get back to first. I just change into first like you would in a car.

Maybe you are doing it wrong.

Breadfan

I built my first downtube friction shifter bike yesterday. First, setting up was a breeze, so easy to do with no worries of a barrel adjuster. I used Suntour Ratchet shifters with a 2x on the front and Shimano 9sp cassette on the rear. The shifting is easy. Now for the type of riding I do, It really does not matter what shifter I have as it's all flat and easy riding, gravel or pavement. Now if I were racing, there is no way in he** I'd choose downtube over STI's. No way. I'm sure I'd get better at it but just the movement to change gears is so much more, taking one hand off the bars every time you need to change. It does make you think ahead, however. Now for just having the downtube shifters for the vintage ride, these things are a gas and I almost prefer them over the STI's. They both have their place and I embrace them all!

Koyote

​​​​​​Your analogy to a car's stick shift isn't very apt, as the car can be shifted while stationary -- unlike a bike. But I'll play along: when I drove a stick shift, I quite often DID downshift before stopping fully, especially when descending a hill, as in your example. That's far better for the vehicle than riding the brakes the whole way down.

I don't often ride down a hill and then come to a complete stop...But if I do, then I shift gears just like you do -- before coming to a complete stop. There's no other way to do it with a derailleur system. It's probably easier with the indexed shifting in an STI (or similar SRAM) system, which easily allows one to shift while braking while maintaining complete control of the handlebar. And with Di2, the shifter can be programmed to shift the entire cassette at the mere touch of a lever. I can't imagine anything easier.

Have you tried STIs, especially Di2?

L134 

Indexed shifting - the player piano of cycling.

big john

Most indexing systems can downshift multiple cogs with one stab at the lever. Upshifting requires individual clicks on some, not on others.

If I was in the smallest cog and wanted to go to the largest it might take 2 or 3 pushes of the lever. Not a big deal and not a reason to use friction.

I have nothing against friction shifters, have had them on several bikes. But there is no advantage to them for my purposes. Indexing is better in about every way that I can think of.

big john

wut

Sierra_rider

My first proper XC race bike was a 1x11, replaced a 3x10 bike. It was a massive improvement...if one was just cruising fire roads, probably not a big deal. However, for everything else it was an improvement. I liked that 1x11 as a racing setup, not having the bail-out gear was perfectly fine for racing scenarios.

My new XC bike is an electronic 12 speed. Before this bike, I didn't really understand the big deal about electronic shifting, but now I understand. Light, easy shifts and the ability to program special shift functions. I have mine set up to shift 3 cogs if I press and hold the shifter...and you don't have to hold it for long. I just used this to great effect at an XC race this weekend. I had it in a tall gear to grab the holeshot on a flat, wide start, and then wait until the last possible second to downshift a few gears, once the course funneled into a sharp incline.

Eric F 

You're making things up to support your prejudice. We all know bikes don't work like that, and so do you.

13ollocks

DT friction shifting was perfectly fine when it was all there was. Then came indexed DT shifting, which was an advance, and perfectly fine when it was all there was. And then came "brifters", which were a significant (one might say "game-changing") advance, and remain perfectly fine. Electronic, wireless, 1X - nothing wrong with them, but incremental variations on a theme.

PeteHski

Really fast cars and racing cars have sequential gearboxes, which is what a modern bike shift effectively is. Shifting across the cassette is fast enough to never be an issue.

seypat

There are these things out there called barend shifters, both friction and indexed. Why is it when friction shifting comes up people always assume it's DT?

Atlas Shrugged

13 pages and counting. Ah, the glorious resistance to progress – a hallmark of the staunch luddites in the world of cycling. While the rest of us revel in the wonders of indexed shifting, there's a special breed who proudly cling to their friction shifters as if the very thought of a smooth, predictable gear change is an affront to their sense of nostalgia.Why bother with the convenience of modern technology when you can revel in the sheer delight of being a cycling time traveler, transported back to an era where precision and efficiency were mere afterthoughts? Friction shifting enthusiasts are the true guardians of a bygone era, valiantly resisting the siren call of progress.

In a world where bikes are lighter, more aerodynamic, and equipped with state-of-the-art components, these cycling Luddites proudly declare, "Give me the clunky, uncertain feel of friction, or give me a single speed!" Because who needs the luxury of smooth gear changes when you can embrace the rough-and-tumble charm of yesteryear?

So, here's to the defenders of friction shifting – the true purists, standing defiantly against the tides of progress, pedaling proudly into a world where the past is always present, and efficiency is but a distant memory. May your rides be filled with the gritty satisfaction of saying, "I'll stick with what worked in the good old days!"

13ollocks

because bar-end shifters, friction or indexed, are niche products compared to DT anything. I used to use friction bar-ends - they were fine, but they’re not the first thing people think about when we’re talking about shifting.

3alarmer 

...“Workers Cyclists of the World, Unite. You have nothing to lose but your chains!”, he said, little realizing that drive shaft bicycles are still a niche market.

tomato coupe

Actually you do ... downshifting and engine braking is a basic skill.

3alarmer 

...??? indexed bar ends are (or at least were for a while) readily available for those who find brifters to be uncomfortable in certain situations. I have some on a couple of bicycles...mostly more touring and utility setups, where I don't plan on standing on the pedals very much. The downside with bar ends is if you hit one with your knee. I guess they might be viewed as niche products in the age of "take my brifters from my cold, dead hands." But I have never experienced them as such.

Just another way to shift the chain without stopping and doing it by hand.

big john

Not in normal driving. Maybe performance driving or when hauling. Driving a stick in traffic you just slow in the gear you are in and go to neutral when you stop.

I did watch the guy in the Camaro set a record at Nürburgring and his shifting was a thing of beauty.

tomato coupe

Again, downshifting is a basic skill -- even when driving in traffic.

big john

Meh, a lot of people can't even drive a stick these days.

Here is the video I referenced. It's pretty cool on a big monitor.

tomato coupe

Yes, that's true.

The real issue is that shifting a manual transmission has nothing to do with friction shifters on a bike.