DMC707

I have been wanting to dip my toe into the park riding aspect of MTB'ing and have a trip to Angel Fire and Keystone planned in 2 weeks for some ski lift runs

I am taking my Yeti (SB-95 29'er with 5.5" of bounce) , but it is more of a all mountain, or a XC bike on steroids type of machine
The only mods i have made to it for the trip are to install 203mm front disc


That said --- the bike should survive a trip or 2 ------ but

I have encountered an Airborne Toxin bike online for $1350 complete --- seems like a smokin' deal
Mountain Bike Action Magazine | Park Bike Testing: The Airborne Toxin

Airborne Bicycles . Toxin

I could have that bike at my door and built up before i leave .......... or .......... just ride some of the less technical runs on my Yeti to see if i like this aspect of the sport ---and if the bug bites me hard enough, there are plenty of used DH rigs all over craigslist, ebay and the like in areas where that type of riding is more popular

I have no need for a gravity rig back home in Oklahoma, but Angel Fire is just a few hours away --- just up in the air over whether to pick up something new and ready to rip, --- or something a few years old, but a bit more high end that may need some more TLC and $$$ thrown at it to whip it back into shape --

Im a Clyde too, so anything i do will need new springs at minimum

I <3 Robots

If you can...I would go for a long travel bike for riding parks. I've got a 150mm (Pivot Mach 5) and a 180mm (Kona Operator) bike. I've used both bikes at my local ski resort. The Kona wins all the time.

Besides the increased travel...the other thing to look at is the head tube angle. The Toxin is more slack than the SB95. The slack head angle will typically have more stability going down steep and chunky terrain at speed.

With a "big" bike...you'll have more control and with that more fun riding at a bike park.

FrozenK

Can you rent a bike? The local ski area rents Kona Operators for $100 a day with a full face helmet, pads, etc... If you really get into it, you'll want to buy a bike but for just trying it out renting may be a good alternative.

DMC707

Guys' -- thanks for the comments -- it does sound like a big bike is the way to go ------ That Airborne sale is tempting

I didnt provide enough info --- i mentioned being in the Clydesdale category, but i left out the fact that i am close to "SuperClyde" territory --- (280 pounds of solid steel) ---

The dilemma that brings is most park rental bikes if they are coil sprung, wont have nearly enough adjustment with standard springs to get me there with the right amount of sag ---- that is why i was considering just biting the bullet and buying something along with the heavy duty springs i need right off the bat

It took me a month of trial and error to get the ride right on my Yeti (300 psi in the rear Fox CTD shock )

Given the fact that its August and these places start closing down at the end of September, my upcoming trip may be the only time i hit the slopes until they open up again next spring ---

Half the battle in life is showing up --- i am a tad leery of buying used on such a rough use machine as a downhill bike, -- but i have also been told that 1/2 the folks who buy these are well meaning (like myself) - but after dragging the brakes down the side of a few ski slopes , they get hung on the wall and gather dust until they get sold

I <3 Robots

If at all possible you can try calling the shop that has the rentals to see if they have a heavier spring they can swap on.

Out of the three mountain bikes I have...I spend the majority of my time on my 29er HT. Even with no rear suspension...it feels much more fun to ride compared to the two FS bikes on the local terrain. The Kona is pretty much DH use only. The bike just plain sucks to pedal...but in its element...nothing can really beat it.

What you can do is take your 95 and ride it one day and rent a 180/200mm bike the next. See what works better for you.

dminor 

You will not have fun on your SB95 - - well...not near as much fun as you should have at a bike park. As you said, your 95 is a trail bike with an XC-ish leanings. It's nimble for a 29er but the big hoops, small travel and less-than-forgiving head angle are not suited to park fun. I have an SB66 - - which is slack, nimble, flickable, fun and would be much more suitable - - but I leave it parked at the condo to save for 'trail days' and ride the big bike. You will get so much more out of the experience on the right tool for the job.

DMC707

Yes -- was trying NOT to buy a new bike -- LOL, but there are numerous used ones in the Denver area on CL that might be better suited with some suspension set up.

Funny, i never looked at a 5.5" bike as a short travel rig, -- most of my riding buddies scoff because i got such a "burly and heavy" machine (29 lbs )

If i could use it 3 or 4 times a year, a big bike is worth the investment --- heck i have a couple of velodrome bikes that are used less than that

I know i cant spend $4500 + on a new rig, --- but on the flip side, buying a $1500 bike from a 150 # kid all jacked up on mountain dew is nerve wracking too as i would be leery of stress fractures on such a hard use machine unless it just looked showroom

dminor 

As other people have suggested, a rental at the park might be a better option. Depending on the park, the rental fleets can be pretty impressive. Whistler is using Giant Glorys this year; one year recently, Panorama had Norco Aurums. You may be pleasantly surprised.

ColinL

Keystone has Kona Operators. Most other parks in that area have Trek Sessions.

Speaking from very recent personal experience - your SB95 would be fun on greens and most blues. I rode my Blur TR on them a month ago. The Yeti wouldn't be fun at all on black and double black, and chunky blues. If you have never ridden lift service before, your skills may not be up to black, anyway. Consider a half-day class, on a big bike, it would be well worth it. You could either do that right off the get-go, or take your Yeti down the Keystone green/blue runs and then rent a big bike.

I would not buy a bike now. Yes, it's seemingly a good deal for $1500 - but that's not a good deal if you later realize you hate everything about the bike. Just rent.

DMC707

As i said earlier , too big a weight discrepancy --- coil sprung suspension with medium duty springs will never work --- but i'd love to rent just to go enjoy a couple of weekends cheap

I have resigned myself to biting the bullet on a used rig and having some springs custom wound --- the FOX "purple" springs even are not designed to overcome 275 lbs of mass for the forks and 500 is the max commercially available on the back from Fox for say, a DHX 5.0 -- pretty common procedure from my motocross days ----

It is good to hear some input on trails other than the gnarly stuff though --- big bike, little bike - or anywhere in between, i dont intend on putting myself in the hospital (but then again, nobody ever does ) - i'm content to ride at 85-90% , i try not to tiptoe too close to the edge of my comfort zones
Im an A level motocrosser and have mediocre bmx skills, so i am not afraid of jumps and turns ---- but admittedly turning it downhill and hitting "chunky stuff" is a new ball game and i will most likely be treading very lightly

ColinL

eh, I don't know. I had fun on the stuff I could ride on a 5" bike. definitely do something.

OH- in frisco you can rent a kona process 153, a 6" air sprung bike with relaxed geometry. $60ish a full day. I can't recall the name of the shop, but it's on main street near the moosejaw, a dive... I mean, fine establishment that we used for many a post-ride brew.

DMC707

Yes -- totally agree! Poop or get off the pot, as they say.

Post ride brews are one of the many reasons i ride too!


Jenson USa has shock springs up to 650 and fork springs for up to 300 lbs for Fox DHX 5.0/ 40 fork combo--- the leverage rate for bike i am interested in recommends a 450 spring for riders up to 215- trying to do the math on what i would need but was guessing 550 or maybe 600 - that would get something rideable without having to crank the preload down all the way

DMC707

Epilogue -- i bought a big travel bike from a Winter Park local --- but used my SB-95 on WP's "Greenworld" trail anyway

That was a ripping good time !

I noticed in places i crossed over to the black trails though that the berms were full of chatter and braking bumps from the big hit 8" travel bikes that abound around there that it was really doing a number on my Yeti.

The greens and blues are a nice challenge for a guy who is not from the high country for sure --- but i am looking forward to getting this secondhand DH bike (a Yeti 303 R DH ) up to speed with proper springs to see what i am missing out on

I let my height/weight compliant cousin use the DH bike but he was pretty green and did not have a good run at all -- (crash with breakage )

ColinL

Ouch! Your cousin broke a bone, something on the new-to-you Yeti, or both?

DMC707

Ha - thankfully it was the bike --- evidently somehow as he was going over the bars, he said his foot hooked on the brake lever and tore it loose from the master cylinder assembly

He caught a ride down thankfully with a trail maintenance truck

Not a great introduction to downhilling for him --- and a sobering experience for me too, ---- but we had put in several laps on a smalller "checkout trail" -- just a short downhill run with some whoops, berms and small jumps - and he was good there, ---- the gap between the bunny slope and the green trail was just a little too much for his experience level though evidently - we will rectify that though

I have to say -- at least at this park -- the full bore lift assisted green trails are no joke -- They were mad fun on my 5" 29'er though and i cant wait to go back --- but the next time i have the downhill rig sorted out i am hitting blacks (well - maybe)

ColinL

You both should do an instructor-lead course your next visit. You'll have a lot more fun, safer!

EastCoastDHer

Good call. I did that back in 1997. Went well.
From time to time I run into less experienced riders on the trails. Normally I don't offer to tag along or give advice unless asked. It's energizing to know there are passionate people out there who will continue to keep the sport and community alive. Even after I'm long gone.

Many resorts and parks have rentals. That's a good way to test a design and figure out if you like it or not before you buy one like it.

dminor 

303R is a fine bike that will serve you well

That's what my DH rig still happens to be; a little long in the tooth as DH hardware goes but it still holds its own. Whistler earlier this year:



https://vimeo.com/129697963

DMC707

Nice Go Pro footage --- i was tempted to outfit myself with one as well, but will do it next time - what model are you guys' using?


I guess pics of the new whip would be good since the genesis of the thread was my decision to go new or used

--- these bike's were intro'ed in '09 and production just ceased recently (when Yeti shifted focus to enduro type events and bikes) --- other than being a 26'er and not having a direct mount stem, i thought it was still pretty current --- but admittedly , my knowledge on the DH stuff is limited

Bike needs some new rims (hubs are nice Hadley units though ) and springs, but i was happy the forks had kashima coated stanchions --- i will be changing out the SRAM /Avid components for Shimano stuff i have in personal inventory -- but i may run a GripShift on this bike - seems like a good fit for a gravity rig

---- Overall, when done , i should only have a little more cash tied up into this than i would in the Airborne (due to using some old spares i already have) ---- in the short run i cant imagine needing anything more




For posterity i'll throw in a pic of both rigs ready to go down --- the only concession i made to the SB-95 for a downhill run was to lower the seat (so much for preparation) -- i left the cageless XC oriented SPD's on and everything

---- i know an 8" travel rig will soak up more abuse and break fewer parts, - but my respect for the capabilities of that SB-95 jumped way up too

dminor 

Very nice. Tribal X 2 .

Clean the rail and car after every weekend's-worth or so of riding. You don't have to take the car off - -just wipe off the outer surfaces and drag a rag under the bottom of each side (where all the dirty grease is smeared). Then pump the zerk with white lithium grease until it gooshes out from under the car and cycle the rear susp through to recoat the rail. Hopefully the former owner gave you the little grease syringe with the hose.

Be regular and somewhat anal about this - - your rail and car will last much longer that way.

Bikernator

Out of curiosity, what exactly are you talking about? What's a rail and car?

ColinL

It's how the lower rear mount moves in strictly linear fashion, so there is no rotation of the mounts at all.

Pics and explanation here: Yeti 303R DH - Linear Rail Technology! - Pinkbike

It does look like it would be sensitive to mud and dust so I can see why dminor mentioned that.

Bikernator

That... is cool. Thanks for the link.

dminor 

Oh good - - bless Yeti Cycles' heart: they still have the 303R owner's manual PDF online.

https://www.yeticycles.com/static/pdf...ual_303RDH.pdf

Page 14 has the details on lubing the rail/car. BTW, it also has an excellent setup guide for the RC4 shock. That is one thing I have always loved about Yeti - - so much R&D goes into their designs that, by the time product is ready for the consumer market, they have recommended settings completely dialed. Takes all the guesswork and trial-and-error out of initial suspension setup. I've run the factory settings pretty much untouched for 5 years with the exception of swapping the original 450# spring for a 400#.

Colin, as far as sensitivity to grime: yes and no. Good care goes a long way ("cleanliness is next to godliness" has always been my guide ); but I've also subjected it to a week of slop and grime at races or the bike park and have never experienced it dragging or seizing up. The car has a good wiper system to keep the rail track relatively clean. Side note: last winter, I partially disassembled the car to really flush it out good and thoroughly clean it - - which went well. But still I stopped short of a complete disassembly when I saw the "endless chain" bearing loop setup. Holy crap, how intricate! I left it all in the car body, cleaned its reachable surfaces and called it good. Maybe next winter . . . .

DMC707

For those not familiar with this linkage design --- which is more or less an improved single pivot design - which i like - here's a close up

YEs thankfully i got a grease injector and some other tools from the previous owner

In the close up, you can also see the concentric shock mount that allows you to modify the head angle -- good stuff - but yes , that rail will demand a little bit of attention ---

The PO definitely rode this thing , and the flat spots in the wheels attest to that , but he seemed like a bike nerd like me who tried to take care of his equipment