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#5226
Senior Member
I've got the BLS straps. The pedal axle version works well with my Speedplay pedals, which do not have a good way for attaching straps. But they are not quality straps. I've had them less than a year and do not use them all the time, but they are showing significant signs of wear, to the point that I could see them snapping soon.
I'm not sure what my next plan will be. I could certainly buy something like the Cruz Components adapter for my Speedplays to run different straps, but that adds a few more mm below my pedals, and with my 170 cranks, I already experience pedal rub on 250 tracks when going at a moderate pace.
I'd prefer not to switch to another pedal system, but I may have to.
(Also, BP, I ordered a pair of those Lakes, but in black with white stripes. Not sure when they'll be here - my LBS says Lakes are slow to get in, but my season is over, so no rush.)
I'm not sure what my next plan will be. I could certainly buy something like the Cruz Components adapter for my Speedplays to run different straps, but that adds a few more mm below my pedals, and with my 170 cranks, I already experience pedal rub on 250 tracks when going at a moderate pace.
I'd prefer not to switch to another pedal system, but I may have to.
(Also, BP, I ordered a pair of those Lakes, but in black with white stripes. Not sure when they'll be here - my LBS says Lakes are slow to get in, but my season is over, so no rush.)
#5227
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#5228
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Thanks. I'll look into that.
I think the BLS I have are too far forward (they're not the axle ones)
I think the BLS I have are too far forward (they're not the axle ones)
Last edited by southernfox; 10-05-18 at 06:46 AM.
#5229
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We use these, seem to work well, https://www.purecycles.com/products/g-race-track-straps
#5230
Senior Member
I suppose if people are super paranoid about pulling out, they could go back to the first clipless pedals ever made (Cinelli?) that required you to be screwed into the pedal. Part of the reason for pulling out isn't just about power: I think some riders just have a starting pedaling action that tends to clip out more easily than others. Historically, I think many find riders find Shimano pedals SPD SL and SPD R to be more secure -- it's not just the spring tension but something about the cleat design and how it interfaces with the pedal that makes it more difficult to accidentally unclip. Add in a Hoy type retention system as shown in Carleton's pic and you've got a really good system for standing starts. The Modern Look system seems similar to Shimano, but it just doesn't work as well for standing starts.
I think any first year track rider learns that pulling out on a pedal isn't a legitimate mishap -- it's considered within the category of "rider error equipment malfunction". Pretty similar to dropping a chain in a criterium or rolling a tire. Now I've seen riders finagle a free lap by claiming, "I struck a pedal and the tire rolled when the bike came back down..." but that's pushing the envelope of the definition of an equipment malfunction.
I think any first year track rider learns that pulling out on a pedal isn't a legitimate mishap -- it's considered within the category of "rider error equipment malfunction". Pretty similar to dropping a chain in a criterium or rolling a tire. Now I've seen riders finagle a free lap by claiming, "I struck a pedal and the tire rolled when the bike came back down..." but that's pushing the envelope of the definition of an equipment malfunction.
#5231
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I think part of the problem with modern straps is that they are too far forward, as mentioned by SF, but also, that they are only engaging the bottom of the pedal, and not the actual clasp like the hoy/baranosky/VP design.
In the past, with the SPD-r system, riders used to take the loop tang trom toe clips, cut them down, drill a hole and mount them to the clasp using the tensioning screw. That pulls the clasp up and forward, as does the hoy/baranosky/VP system. Ay e something machined or printed to hold the strap, that uses a new/longer retention screw is what's needed.
I goofed on the bottom drawing. There are supposed to be 4 legs on it to accomodate curves n the design of the pedal clasp.
In the past, with the SPD-r system, riders used to take the loop tang trom toe clips, cut them down, drill a hole and mount them to the clasp using the tensioning screw. That pulls the clasp up and forward, as does the hoy/baranosky/VP system. Ay e something machined or printed to hold the strap, that uses a new/longer retention screw is what's needed.
I goofed on the bottom drawing. There are supposed to be 4 legs on it to accomodate curves n the design of the pedal clasp.

Last edited by taras0000; 10-05-18 at 02:36 PM.
#5232
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I only drew that up like that because I was looking at the Assioma pedals and it looked like the tension screw was on an angle on the backside of the clasp, thereby pulling the clasp up and forward.
Any bracket angle could made up to accomodate different clasp designs/screw angles. If the screw were horizontal when the pedal was level, some more design/engineering would have to go into it, as at that angle, some shear force would be present.
The best design would have
1) to pull the clasp closed (up and forward)
2) act on any mounting hardware in compression while limiting shear/tension forces (because the screws are so small, and materials relatively soft and weak, which makes for a weak interface)
3) and place the strap behind the ball of the foot, ideally as far back as possible. This increases the leverage of the strap against any rotation of the foot, minimizing accidental disengagement.
Any bracket angle could made up to accomodate different clasp designs/screw angles. If the screw were horizontal when the pedal was level, some more design/engineering would have to go into it, as at that angle, some shear force would be present.
The best design would have
1) to pull the clasp closed (up and forward)
2) act on any mounting hardware in compression while limiting shear/tension forces (because the screws are so small, and materials relatively soft and weak, which makes for a weak interface)
3) and place the strap behind the ball of the foot, ideally as far back as possible. This increases the leverage of the strap against any rotation of the foot, minimizing accidental disengagement.
Last edited by taras0000; 10-06-18 at 12:17 AM.
#5233
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This design is horrible and is only slightly better than zip-tying your straps to your pedla spindle.

And this one is just as bad.
#5235
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These, along with the above mentioned ones by Carlton and Bebifudo, are the best because they place the strap better and serve to Acton the clasp in a way that closes it up



#5237
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The old school slotted cleats could still pop loose if you didn't have the Deep slotted cleats. Using newer pedals with the same system adds a little bit of double redundancy there at least. He probably just ended up having the the rat trap on just to make the pedal easier to slip into. There are the MKS EXA (https://www.mkspedal.com/?q=en/product/node/71) pedals that many Japanese Keirin riders use. It uses the 3 hole mount, but it's a system that's really only feasible for track use, so you would need a different set up for the road to train on.
I did something similar. Mine looked similar but without the rat trap at the front for my speed plays but what I did was have new bow ties machine for the bottom side. They were thicker than normal had a tang on the back and a slot milled into them to accomodate a strap. You needed really stiff straps to be able to get into them easily. I wish I took pictures of the set up.
Last edited by taras0000; 10-05-18 at 06:25 PM.
#5238
Senior Member
Agree, I think the VP is the best off the shelf design at the moment. In my experience, they are basically just like LOOK Keo low-mid level pedals, maybe bearings and materials a little nicer, but basic pedal design. The bearings do develop a little play, but not excessive, and the price is right as well. Recommended.
#5239
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Agree, I think the VP is the best off the shelf design at the moment. In my experience, they are basically just like LOOK Keo low-mid level pedals, maybe bearings and materials a little nicer, but basic pedal design. The bearings do develop a little play, but not excessive, and the price is right as well. Recommended.
#5240
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Here are some other Speedplay mods that I came across in case people were interested.


I don't recommend this set up at all as it weakens the strap. I did this the first time around and it held for about a season, but then I went to tighten the straps one time and the strap snapped on me.
This is the better way of doing it

Or even doing this

In this one, the straps are sandwiched between the cleat and a piece of plastic. The screws don't pierce the straps.


I don't recommend this set up at all as it weakens the strap. I did this the first time around and it held for about a season, but then I went to tighten the straps one time and the strap snapped on me.
This is the better way of doing it

Or even doing this

In this one, the straps are sandwiched between the cleat and a piece of plastic. The screws don't pierce the straps.
#5241
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^I tried the top one on my Speedplays (just poke a hole in the strap and run a washer/bolt into the bottom of the pedal) agree looks weak especially over time. Hadn't ever seen the one below it, although it looks like a much better solution.
Then again... for my meager starts pulling a pedal would be an accomplishment in itself.
Then again... for my meager starts pulling a pedal would be an accomplishment in itself.

#5243
Elitist
Thread Starter
This is another example of Track getting hand-me-down tech from the Road world where we have very specific (and somewhat easy to solve) needs that we will pay to have met.
This is an opportunity for some pedal company.

This is a great start, but it's still a relatively minor adaptation to the standard Road pedal.
What if a Track pedal were designed from the ground up?
This is an opportunity for some pedal company.

This is a great start, but it's still a relatively minor adaptation to the standard Road pedal.
What if a Track pedal were designed from the ground up?
#5244
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#5245
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This is another example of Track getting hand-me-down tech from the Road world where we have very specific (and somewhat easy to solve) needs that we will pay to have met.
This is an opportunity for some pedal company.

This is a great start, but it's still a relatively minor adaptation to the standard Road pedal.
What if a Track pedal were designed from the ground up?
This is an opportunity for some pedal company.

This is a great start, but it's still a relatively minor adaptation to the standard Road pedal.
What if a Track pedal were designed from the ground up?
The SPD-R were almost the perfect track pedal in my opinion, Solid metal to metal interface, no chance of breaking a cleat, and strong enough to adapt straps securely. People dropped them when SPD-SL came out. Many were saying (I believe you included) that having the wider/solid platform was a help, from a propriocetive standpoint. So if a wider platform was needed, then SL solved that. All that was needed was a good retention system. One that was strong and adaptable/accepting for straps. If a company like VP can do it, why can't Shimano or LOOK? Because there's no money in it. They already have the lion's share of the high end pedal market, and they're not losing it.
VP comes up with a pedal that was designed for track right from the ground up, and barely anyone buys it. The clasp AND pedal body are slotted to accept straps, single or double. I remember when they first came out years ago, 2011 I think, yet how many people do you see using them? I know of two people who actually own them. How many people are using strap hacks on SL pedals, or LOOKS? I bet you that there are more hacks than VPs. People like us keep saying that we want these track specific products, yet no one goes out and buys them when they hit the market. What message does that send to the manufacturers? If enough people started to buy the VP pedals, you can bet your ass that Shimano and LOOK will offer something. Why? Because they are losing market share.
You want track stuff, buy track stuff when it comes available. If people keep adapting and hacking stuff, then manufacturers have no incentive to make what we want. Why? Because people are still buying their product and it costs them no extra time or money for us to change their product. They are out nothing and we're still buying their product. Buy track stuff, and Shimano and LOOK and will lose out on product and will try to reclaim that market. It's not the offerings that are the problem, it's the consumers.
Last edited by taras0000; 10-06-18 at 02:56 PM.
#5249
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Is there anywhere to buy Fujitoshi style straps ( or similar off brand versions?) for reasonable money? As i understand it Fujitoshi stopped making straps a long time ago and all the ones i have seen are extremely expensive.
Thanks
Thanks
#5250
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There are more brands that make laminated double straps. MKS, and Errebi are two others. Errebi makes the mint green "Sprint" brand straps.