Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Commuting
Reload this Page >

Upgrade to 10-sp or not?

Commuting Bicycle commuting is easier than you think, before you know it, you'll be hooked. Learn the tips, hints, equipment, safety requirements for safely riding your bike to work.

Upgrade to 10-sp or not?

Old 12-17-16, 08:22 AM
  #1  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
Upgrade to 10-sp or not?

My main winter commuter and sometimes grocery getting machine is a 9-sp triple Tiagra set up, which works fine, though I can't remember the last time I was on the granny gear. I've got a 13-25T on it right now with the studded tires.

Bianchi.jpg

My other sometimes commuter is a 9-sp Sora CX setup, with a 46-36 up front and 11-32 up front. Again, works fine, though I am rarely on the 36T ring, nor the 32 cog on the back.

IMG_0032.jpg

So I recently pick up a near-new 10-sp 5700 compact groupset for a really good price, and am trying to decide if I should put it on one of the bikes, and if so, which one.

First off, I don't like the exposed shifter cables. It doesn't look tidy and gets in the way of head lights. I've got a bunch of 11-25T 10-speed cassettes so not like I'll need to buy new, though I'd prefer something like 12-28 or 12-25.

Second, the left 5700 shifter isn't the most smooth shifter, requiring extra force to shift up. The 3500 and 4500 left shifters, on the other hand, work buttery smooth. I am willing to make that trade-off for the cosmetic benefits.

I could go with a triple crank on the Bianchi does not match the black 105's. The black Sora on the Norco does, so I could go with a 46-36 and a 10-sp 11-25.

Anyone want to weigh in on this? C'mon, we've gotten 40cm of snow here in the last 72 hours, so I know none of you living in the NE are out riding your bikes today.
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 10:43 AM
  #2  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
Yeah, mine's a hand-me-down from my my sister, who's 5 inches shorter than I am, but bought it way too big for her. It was a riser bar with, yeah, what do you call them? box rims. I converted the whole thing to drop bar. Only frame is original. Pretty decent ride, actually, if not a tad heavy.
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 10:53 AM
  #3  
MRT2
Senior Member
 
MRT2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 5,866

Bikes: 2012 Salsa Casseroll, 2009 Kona Blast, 1997 Bianchi Advantage, 1994 Trek 930.

Mentioned: 13 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 829 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
Yeah, mine's a hand-me-down from my my sister, who's 5 inches shorter than I am, but bought it way too big for her. It was a riser bar with, yeah, what do you call them? box rims. I converted the whole thing to drop bar. Only frame is original. Pretty decent ride, actually, if not a tad heavy.
I have that frame, still mostly stock from new. It is a '97 model. I rode it for about 10 years. Then it became a backup bike. Then I gifted it to my son as an around town bike. Now that he has outgrown it, it is once again a backup bike.

Honestly, I wouldn't bother going to from 9 to 10 speed.
MRT2 is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 01:19 PM
  #4  
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 41,396

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 188 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6899 Post(s)
Liked 238 Times in 196 Posts
I didn't bother 'Up Grading' from 7 speed my self , but for Going to The 14 speed Rohloff.

(3 x 3 speeds*, used twice, in high and low range)
[Yes savvy mathematicians, 3x3 is nine, but in the planetary gear world , 3 of them are 1:1, so only 1 is used]


'Speeds' is a Parts Tally .. Actual Gears are Ratios of teeth counts..





...
fietsbob is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 01:33 PM
  #5  
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 41,396

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 188 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6899 Post(s)
Liked 238 Times in 196 Posts
Anyone want to weigh in on this? C'mon, we've gotten 40cm of snow here in the last 72 hours,
Ive had a Mountain Bike with Suomi (thats Finnish , in Finnish) Nokian studded tires for 25 years ..

It is ready to go whenever the road gets Icy-snowy .

this week that was not the case, PDX 150 miles inland had its sub zero C surprise precip and challenge,,
and a Big business for towing and Body repair companies ..

By the Sea It just got Cold.. year-round springs do make Icy patches

So I rode that Bike on mostly cold Bare Pavement..

Picked up traction add-ons for My Shoes so To not fall on my Butt on Black Ice Like I did last year

when crossing over the mountains to PDX . and getting out of the Studded tire fitted Van in a Parking lot at 1000 feet elevation.




fietsbob is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 02:02 PM
  #6  
dabac
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,957
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 829 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 9 Times in 8 Posts
I wouldn't put 10-speed on a commuter unless I got sponsored.
9-speed wears fast enough.
Winter bike has 7-speed. Lasts as long or longer in a lot poorer conditions.
dabac is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 02:10 PM
  #7  
Bike Gremlin
Bike Gremlin
 
Bike Gremlin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Novi Sad
Posts: 4,081

Bikes: Custom made on Scott Speedster frame, Custom made on a 1996. steel MTB frame (all but frame changed at least once in the past 20 years).

Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 949 Post(s)
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Shimano 10 speed road (before the new Tiagra 4700 10 speed) is the most sensitive system to any cable/housing dirt, imperfection, as well as very sensitive to any play in RD pivots and misalignment of the RD (11 speed is the only worse on that account).

So for commuting I don't see 10 as an "upgrade". Especially the pre-Tiagra 4700 10 speed.


Whenever looking for "upgrades", I always ask people: "what do you want to upgrade? What is your goal? Faster shifting? Easier climbing gears? What exactly you need to improve on the bike and what do you expect the new upgrade will bring?" Then I can give some useful advice to help that particular person on their particular bicycle.
Bike Gremlin is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 02:23 PM
  #8  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
I hear what y'all saying. Going from 9 to 10 speed isn't really much difference, and deep down I know this, of course....But, if you were to do it, which bike, and why?

Maybe I ought to look for another frame on which I can put the groupset. LOL.
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 03:32 PM
  #9  
ammarolli
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Reykjavík
Posts: 187

Bikes: Trek Crossrip 2 2017, Cube Cruve Pro 2015 and Berlín Dutch Bike 3 speed 2014

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I commute mostly on 3x9speed and the only thing I would ever want to do to my drivetrain is upgrading to a better 9 speed groupset.
10 speed is much more expensive and wears faster so I don't see the point of having more gears for commuting.
ammarolli is offline  
Old 12-17-16, 03:43 PM
  #10  
Darth Lefty 
Disco Infiltrator
 
Darth Lefty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Folsom CA
Posts: 9,767

Bikes: Schwinn Paramount, Salsa Timberjack, Diamondback Expert TG, Burley Samba

Mentioned: 62 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1561 Post(s)
Liked 164 Times in 104 Posts
For my taste the stock gearing of road groupsets is too high for a commuter bike. 105 is a nice level, though
__________________
Genesis 49:16-17
Darth Lefty is online now  
Old 12-17-16, 04:47 PM
  #11  
HardyWeinberg
GATC
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: south Puget Sound
Posts: 8,688
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 454 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 11 Times in 11 Posts
I have found it easy to avoid 10-speed until I realized I needed to give my 1x7 commuter a greater beast-of-burden capacity for occasional longer jaunts with the fam where nobody else would carry cargo.... so 10 spd with 11/36 was the solution (chainring remains the same 42t job the bike has always had, back when it was 42/17 FG to the present)
HardyWeinberg is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 12:55 AM
  #12  
InTheRain
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Puget Sound
Posts: 1,974

Bikes: 2007 Rocky Mountain Sherpa 30 (bionx), 2015 Cannondale Synapse Carbon Ultegra

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 139 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
My 9-speed triple shifts much nicer than my 10 speed compact double. However, I don't find myself ever using the 30 tooth chainring on the front of my triple. Then again, if I commute with my road bike with the 10 speed double, I never use the 34 tooth chainring either.

Last edited by InTheRain; 12-18-16 at 08:35 PM.
InTheRain is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 01:44 AM
  #13  
Bike Gremlin
Bike Gremlin
 
Bike Gremlin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Novi Sad
Posts: 4,081

Bikes: Custom made on Scott Speedster frame, Custom made on a 1996. steel MTB frame (all but frame changed at least once in the past 20 years).

Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 949 Post(s)
Liked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
I hear what y'all saying. Going from 9 to 10 speed isn't really much difference, and deep down I know this, of course....But, if you were to do it, which bike, and why?

Maybe I ought to look for another frame on which I can put the groupset. LOL.
If I really had to use the 10 speed on one of the two bikes, I'd go with the CX one. It's less likely to carry lots of cargo. Though I'd keep the current crankset - 46-36 sounds much more useful than 34-50 IMO. Perhaps even keeping the original FD, if it was designed for 46 big chainring. If it's a standard road double FD for 53-50 big ring, then of course, I'd use the 105 fd.
Bike Gremlin is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 08:34 AM
  #14  
martianone
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Northern VT
Posts: 2,117

Bikes: recumbent & upright

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 53 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
My commuter is a 1x9 with 12-36 cassette, have a road bike that is 1x10 with 11-36 cassette (different size chain rings). In good weather commute with them interchangeably, cannot say the gearing really makes a difference. Bike geometry and set up - does, road bike is faster.
martianone is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 10:10 AM
  #15  
AlmostTrick
Tortoise Wins by a Hare!
 
AlmostTrick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Looney Tunes, IL
Posts: 6,545

Bikes: Wabi Special FG, Raleigh Roper, Nashbar AL-1, Miyata One Hundred, '68 Schwinn Orange Krate, and More!!

Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1117 Post(s)
Liked 153 Times in 94 Posts
I have a Bianchi Avenue and wife has an Advantage. Both are 7 speeds. Avenue was actually a 6, but I recently spun on a mega range 7 speed freewheel and replaced the triple crank with a SS unit. Works well for me.

Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
So I recently pick up a near-new 10-sp 5700 compact groupset for a really good price,
Really good price, as in you could sell it at a profit? That's what I would do.
AlmostTrick is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 10:21 AM
  #16  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Really good price, as in you could sell it at a profit? That's what I would do.
Yeah, I bought the entire groupset for less than what I was willing to spend on the STI shifters alone. Great shape too. I think the seller had the bike for a short time and then upgraded to 11-speed.
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 10:26 AM
  #17  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
Originally Posted by Slaninar View Post
If I really had to use the 10 speed on one of the two bikes, I'd go with the CX one. It's less likely to carry lots of cargo. Though I'd keep the current crankset - 46-36 sounds much more useful than 34-50 IMO. Perhaps even keeping the original FD, if it was designed for 46 big chainring. If it's a standard road double FD for 53-50 big ring, then of course, I'd use the 105 fd.
That's what I was leaning toward as well. And I agree about the 46-36. If that's the case then I'd replace the wide 9-sp with a wide 10-sp gearing, like a 12-28 or 11-32.
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 12:21 PM
  #18  
fietsbob 
coprolite
 
fietsbob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NW,Oregon Coast
Posts: 41,396

Bikes: 8

Mentioned: 188 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6899 Post(s)
Liked 238 Times in 196 Posts
you can get wide range cassettes small & largest tooth count differences, without more "speeds" ie number of cogs.

you buying new brifters too, you probably need a new right one, at least.

9 & 10 are different index sets.
fietsbob is offline  
Old 12-18-16, 08:25 PM
  #19  
San Pedro
Senior Member
 
San Pedro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Kota, Aichi, Japan
Posts: 1,271

Bikes: 2011 Giant Seek R3, 2015 Specialized Allez Elite, 2017 Giant TCR Advanced 2

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 342 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
I would totally put in on the Norco bike. If 5700 has the same ergonomics as 5800 that would be worth the upgrade to me, plus the hidden cables look way better.
San Pedro is offline  
Old 12-19-16, 08:07 AM
  #20  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
Originally Posted by San Pedro View Post
I would totally put in on the Norco bike. If 5700 has the same ergonomics as 5800 that would be worth the upgrade to me, plus the hidden cables look way better.
That I don't know, but I do like the ergonomics of the 5700 hoods better that of the older Sora and Tiagra, and the hidden cables was one of the reasons I cited for wanting to change.
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-19-16, 08:36 AM
  #21  
ptempel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Jersry the beautiful Garden State
Posts: 1,911

Bikes: 2007 Ridley Excalibur, 2003 Orbea Orca, 199? Cannondale Headshock MTB hardtail

Mentioned: 29 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 514 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Another vote for putting the 5700 groupset on the Norco. Looks like a nice bike. Another advantage of 10-speed (or anything relatively recent) is availability of parts. Its behind the curve a bit to not be too costly. But not too far back to be a PITA to get parts for it. Well, 9-speed parts should be easily available too (replaced an Ultegra 6500 rear derailleur earlier in the year). I have been wanting to replace the 6500 drivetrain with the Dura Ace 7800 stuff I bought used form a friend. Only missing parts are the brifters. And 7800 brifters are too pricey, IMO. Maybe could try the newer Tiagra or Ultrgra 10-speed brifters instead?

The Bianchi looks nice but seems a little too small. Would be a good investment to get a bigger frameset and move the parts over to it maybe? Probably not nigh priority since its a rain bike...

Edit: I see some Ultegra 6600 brifter on Ebay starting at $70: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-Ulte...-/351931778512 Maybe can get something like this on the cheap.

Last edited by ptempel; 12-19-16 at 08:42 AM.
ptempel is offline  
Old 12-19-16, 09:00 AM
  #22  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
@ptempel, DA of any generation is pricey. I bought a left 7800 shifter last summer that came with a malfunctioning right one for a song and thought I could possibly take it apart and fix, but haven't been able to. I've got a set of malfunctioning 7900 shifters sitting around that could be used for spare parts if the working ones on my Roubaix were to fail.

You're probably right about the Bianchi being a size too small. I don't know the exact size equivalent as it was once a hybrid, but I'd have to guess around a 51 cm. I ride a 54 cm normally, but it fits fine as a dropbar convert.

Ultegra 6600 brifters should be quite reasonable in terms of price, but I find that the bidding on eBay usually gets ridiculously high. It'd preferable to find them locally. Personally I'd love to get a set of 6700 brifters, but they, unlike 5700's, seem much more rare around here.

I don't know about the pull ratios on the new 4700's, but they'd be an attractive option if one didn't to replace the RD or FD>
mcours2006 is offline  
Old 12-19-16, 09:40 AM
  #23  
ptempel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: New Jersry the beautiful Garden State
Posts: 1,911

Bikes: 2007 Ridley Excalibur, 2003 Orbea Orca, 199? Cannondale Headshock MTB hardtail

Mentioned: 29 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 514 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
Ultegra 6600 brifters should be quite reasonable in terms of price, but I find that the bidding on eBay usually gets ridiculously high. It'd preferable to find them locally. Personally I'd love to get a set of 6700 brifters, but they, unlike 5700's, seem much more rare around here. I don't know about the pull ratios on the new 4700's, but they'd be an attractive option if one didn't to replace the RD or FD>
I've read that the pull ratio changed with 4700 brifters. So I think I have to stick with older gen 10 speed brifters or use a converter. Shimano also changed the brake pull with the newer calipers. But have read that its usually ok to use newer brifters with older calipers. You just lose a little bit of brake force doing that. You get into trouble with locking wheels up with too much force the other way around (old brifters with new calipers).
ptempel is offline  
Old 12-19-16, 10:00 AM
  #24  
bulldog1935
Banned.
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
Posts: 2,717

Bikes: '74 Raleigh International utility; '98 Moser Forma road; '92 Viner Pro CX upright

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 939 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
sounds like you should hold out for another frame to go with the new groupset
bulldog1935 is offline  
Old 03-17-18, 05:08 PM
  #25  
mcours2006
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
mcours2006's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Toronto, CANADA
Posts: 5,710

Bikes: Giant Rapid, Bianchi Advantage, Specialized Roubaix, 1985 Gardin Quatro, Norco Threshold, Raleigh Serengheti MTB

Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1749 Post(s)
Liked 63 Times in 37 Posts
So after over a year of deliberating what to do with a almost-complete 5700 groupset (minus FD), I decided to upgrade neither of the bikes mentioned in the OP, but instead put the groupset on my 1986 real steel Gardin. It had previously worn a 1050 gruppo, which was just okay. I didn't mind the DT shifters, which were 7-sp, but I ran an 8-sp cassette on friction mode. But the brake levers were just not the most comfortable, regardless of where I put them. I was just too used to the ergonomics of the modern STI shifters.

Here's the before:
Gardin 02.jpg
IMG_0886.JPG

And the after:
DSCF2271.JPG
DSCF2275.JPG
DSCF2273.JPG

This bike has a short wheel base as well, so getting the shifting right is tricky. Still working on it.
mcours2006 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.