Vittoria's new foam insert for road bikes with flat tires
#26
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With Airliner, though, you could ditch the emergency flat repair kit altogether. No plugs, no CO2. Rely on the sealant for most puncture repair, and then the Airliner for sealant-unpluggable punctures.
Airliner without road repair kit means never messing around roadside...if you’re willing to hive up on the idea of returning to a normal ride after a catastrophic/unpluggable event. Probably some will find that liberating or the risk worth taking.
I’ve been road tubeless since ‘12 or ‘13, and only twice needed to go to a tube to deal with a sealant-unpluggable puncture. Those are good enough ofds for me yo seriously consider Airliner and give up on the concept of road repair.
I use my multitool even less, so I’d probably dump everything except a mini-pump, which might be handy to top up pressure after a sealant repair. Maybe. Really, I’d probably dump that, too.
Between the seat bag, pump, and tools, I’m sure I’ve got more than $100 in emergency kit related stuff, so Airliner would easily save me money as well. Sh*t, my Lezyne Road Drive Carbon pumps are more than $100 apiece...
Last edited by chaadster; 04-03-21 at 10:14 AM. Reason: Grammar fix
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Should we compare the list of required materials for tube users? Tubes really aren't that much more simple - they're just more familiar. "The devil you know... " and all of that.
Actually, let's just keep to the subject of the thread, rather than pander to bottom-feeding troll attempts.
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The inserts sound interesting, but I'm not sure that I'm interested in them... In my five years or so of tubeless use, I've probably had... maybe two instances where it would have come in handy. So it becomes a question of whether or not I want the increased cost and and extra install/removal work for occurrences that have proven themselves to be pretty rare.
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#29
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It’s the idea of never having to futz and fail roadside which is appealing to me. Airliner doesn’t eliminate the futz— stopping to put the hole at 6 o’clock to seal will still be a thing— but it does remove the fail part, in that if the sealant doesn’t do it in a couple of minutes, I can call the whole situation then and ride to wherever on the Airliner. I won’t have to try a plug which pulls out down the road (or did I forget the plug tool?), I won’t have to pump the tire (or did I give one cartridge to buddy and blow my last cartridge on a gummed up valve?), I wont have to put a boot and tube (or did I forget my levers or pinch cut the tube reseating the bead?).
Yeah, none of those things happen much, but they do happen, along with a whole bunch of other stuff like ****** weather, horrific clouds of mosquitos, multiple flats, and needing to get home in time to pock up the kid so I don’t get billed extra by the school. Removing all the variables from roadside repair and simplifying the “decision tree” is pretty compelling to me.
I also like the Airliner idea tremendously for primarily urban bikes, where flats are even more irritating because I usually have somewhere to be.
And because I have a 15 bike household with actively 9 separate, dedicated road repair kits, rendering all those packs, tubes, patches, plugs, pumps, cartridges and levers obsolete (or down to one, at-home kit) substantially simplifies my life. Like, I was just about to buy a Dynaplug Racer tire plug kit, which at $50 is half the price of a pair of Airliners, but which doesn’t guarantee me anything out on the road because it still requires the right size hole, a pump, and probably some sealant and luck. Another $50 makes it all go away...
Here’s a question though: can Airliners be reused? I wonder if riding it flat destroys it?
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Oh god:
Recommendations
- It is recommended not to ride more than 50 km at moderate speed of max 20 km/h in run-flat conditions.
- Air-Liner Road complies with ISO requirements for max system weight of 125 kg (rider, bike and equipment).
- In case of puncture, and consequent air loss, Air-Liner Road allows for temporary low-speed run-flat riding, to get you home. While Air-Liner Road allows you to ride to the nearest repair area, it is not intended as a substitute for a properly inflated tire for extended use.
- The Air-Liner Road insert must be checked each time a tire is changed, prior to installing a replacement tire. Air-Liner Road dimensions can be negatively affected by certain conditions, which may reduce its effectiveness, or eliminate its functionality, such as:
1) Riding on a flat tire: always check the condition of the Air-Liner ROAD insert, after its use inside a deflated tire;
2) Storing the Air-Liner inside a deflated tire: We recommend keeping a moderate pressure (1 Bar min) when not in use. We recommend replacing Air-Liner Road inserts every year. - The Air-liner Road insert can be safely ridden inside a deflated tire, provided the integrity of the insert is maintained, allowing for the original dimensions to remain consistent. The insert must not to be modified on its original shape and dimensions.
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I'm skeptical, but it would be great if I'm wrong. They claim it has no effect on rolling resistance and weighs less than your valve. The idea is you can limp home or back to your car without damaging your rim.
https://cyclingtips.com/2021/04/vitt...or-road-bikes/
https://cyclingtips.com/2021/04/vitt...or-road-bikes/
It's nice how the foam expands or shrinks depending on the internal air pressure. It does not seem to be adding much weight either.
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A 150lbs rider will have a very different impression of a 25c at 30psi than a 250lbs rider will, and if you’re closer to 260lbs on anything other than carbon fiber lightweight, given the recommended max system weight of 275.5lbs, it might just be straight-up bad.
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If I didn't know what I was talking about, I would rather learn instead of taking everybody I don't know what I'm talking about. 🙂
#34
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So now we find it is possibly good only for one flat at a cost equal to a tire and riding on it is a safety issue if not ridden carefully. Progess
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Thinking about how this works.
When you pump up the tyre initially the airliner compresses because it's a closed cell foam and there's a pressure differential. Eventually the high pressure air will make its way into the cells and the foam will expand back to its normal shape again when the pressure between the air inside the airliner and the tyre equalises. When you get a puncture the closed cells are still at high pressure and the airliner will expand to fill the volume of the tyre, pressure will drop accordingly. They will hold their pressure for a little while but go squishy as the airliner loses pressure.
After installation while the pressure is equalising the tyres will deflate faster than normal.
When you pump up the tyre initially the airliner compresses because it's a closed cell foam and there's a pressure differential. Eventually the high pressure air will make its way into the cells and the foam will expand back to its normal shape again when the pressure between the air inside the airliner and the tyre equalises. When you get a puncture the closed cells are still at high pressure and the airliner will expand to fill the volume of the tyre, pressure will drop accordingly. They will hold their pressure for a little while but go squishy as the airliner loses pressure.
After installation while the pressure is equalising the tyres will deflate faster than normal.
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#37
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This thing seems gimmicky, but if they work as advertised, even better. I'll use them if they work.
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#38
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I saw this the other day on GCN and it was interesting to see that EF Nippo has already used them in a number of pro races.
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Certainly to an extent, but do we know that as going on the vid segment? Was the rear flatted as well? How much does Simon weigh?
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*(rhetoric questions, -please don't answer)
Last edited by Racing Dan; 04-04-21 at 04:15 AM.
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Racing Dan dudes like you said the same things about STI, suspension systems, and disc brakes.
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Racing Dan dudes like you said the same things about STI, suspension systems, and disc brakes.
#45
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Me, I just put on a more robust clincher and ride. Haven't had a flat for ages and when I finally do, I pop in an new tube and be on my way in less time than I took to write this post :-) No special tools, other than my hands, a tyre lever and a basic pump is needed either.
Call me a luddite all you want, but this simply doesn't feel like real progress unlike SIS, hydraulic brakes, DI2, .. etc.
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For some people, it's not - I guess that you're one of them. For others, though, tubeless is absolutely a huge quality of life improvement, eliminating, or at least greatly mitigating, a regular hassle associated with roadside flats. This is why hackles are sometimes raised when people like you pop in to a thread with the sole purpose of slinging ****.
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Whether that’s true depends on rider weight.
A 150lbs rider will have a very different impression of a 25c at 30psi than a 250lbs rider will, and if you’re closer to 260lbs on anything other than carbon fiber lightweight, given the recommended max system weight of 275.5lbs, it might just be straight-up bad.
A 150lbs rider will have a very different impression of a 25c at 30psi than a 250lbs rider will, and if you’re closer to 260lbs on anything other than carbon fiber lightweight, given the recommended max system weight of 275.5lbs, it might just be straight-up bad.
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No, UST aren’t the only airtight tubeless tires. I ran first gen Schwalbe Pro One tires on American Classic Argent tubeless rims (non-UST) without sealant, no problem.
I’ve kind of lost track of what all the particular tubeless terminology refering to casing type means, e.g. “tubeless ready,” “Tubeless Easy,” “TLE,” “tubeless,” “tubeless TLR,” and all the rest, but basically some casings are lined to make them airtight, and some are not, relying instead on the sealant to make the casing airtight.
I’ve kind of lost track of what all the particular tubeless terminology refering to casing type means, e.g. “tubeless ready,” “Tubeless Easy,” “TLE,” “tubeless,” “tubeless TLR,” and all the rest, but basically some casings are lined to make them airtight, and some are not, relying instead on the sealant to make the casing airtight.
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There aren't that many of there, but I think that it's pretty much moot, anyway. Whether or not sealant is required, adding some is a small and easy investment that yields great benefits.
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Should be fairly obvious. Its a limp home system rather than race down steep hills on a flat system, like they make it appear at GCN. - And the price, I dunno, but combined with a TL tyre, that is already more expensive than clinchers, and sealant it does add up, especially if we are meant to replace the inserts at a yearly interval, at $40 per insert. Im sure lots couldn't care less, but the fear of flats and ppl insisting riding race day tyres, all the time, sure does drive a lot of business.
Me, I just put on a more robust clincher and ride. Haven't had a flat for ages and when I finally do, I pop in an new tube and be on my way in less time than I took to write this post :-) No special tools, other than my hands, a tyre lever and a basic pump is needed either.
Call me a luddite all you want, but this simply doesn't feel like real progress unlike SIS, hydraulic brakes, DI2, .. etc.
Me, I just put on a more robust clincher and ride. Haven't had a flat for ages and when I finally do, I pop in an new tube and be on my way in less time than I took to write this post :-) No special tools, other than my hands, a tyre lever and a basic pump is needed either.
Call me a luddite all you want, but this simply doesn't feel like real progress unlike SIS, hydraulic brakes, DI2, .. etc.
Lemme guess...does my reward for such existential deprivation earn reward in the afterlife? I know it’s not your place to say, but c’mon, man-to-man here, how many virgins do you think the Lord will grant me for sticking with innertubes?
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