himespau 

Just trying to learn some things. I got a wheelset on ebay a while back in which the brake track was a bit more worn than I was happy with, but I got a good enough deal (and returning would have required transatlantic shipping), so I didn't complain. Eventually, I'm going to have to rebuild these wheels. Currently, the wheels have Mavic CXP-33 rims on them (laced to Chorus hubs with some sort of sapim spokes). I like the slightly aero look of the rims (even though I'm too fat and slow to really take advantage of them), and have thought that the replacement rims would have a similar look. The thing is, the more inexpensive rims in that style (especially if I want to try a wider rim) don't appear to have eyelets (the current mavic's don't have them either). Every rim I've worked with in the past (a limitted number to be sure) has had them, so I was wondering, do you usually get nipple washers to take the place of eyelets and protect the hole from cracking/nipple pull through? If so, how do you chose the appropriate nipple? Do you add 2 mm or so to the ERD to account for nipples?

Like I said, this is just sort of for general information. While my current brake tracks don't look new and I can feel a little depression if I go gently over them with my fingers, I don't think they're worn enough to need replacement right away (not sure how you know when they do need it, though), so I'm just trying to plan things out for the future. Thanks.

Andrew R Stewart 

IIRC the CXP-33 used an internal nipple reinforcement/ferrule. As the nipple is tightened this reinforcement device is pressed against the rim and trapped in place. Almost none of it can be seen from the outside so the rim looks clean and unreinforced. The OEM version of this rim (CX-33, ?) is without this device. But this rim is extruded with a thicker wall at it's peak, to better withstand the spoke tension. Of course this makes for a heavier rim and one that costs less. Both qualities that on a new bike are OK to choose (by the bike brand).

Both the CXP-33 and it's lower cost OEM version look almost exactly the same on the outside. So I've dealt with a number of customers who were "fooled' by this. They thought they had the better rim...

The biggest problem with the no reinforcement design is the nipple seating on bare Aluminum and the resulting high friction between them. This makes building and future truing more nipple stripping likely. Using a lube on the nipple seats helps at the time of building and I often add TriFlow to each nipple/rim point prior to truing built and used wheels.

On a side note my wife uses these rims on her Sunday bike. I can't wait to build her next bike and will pick traditional box shaped rims (Mavic Open Pros or Sports, with butted spokes) as well as get her off the overly stiff Alu frame. She'll have a much smoother ride without the vertically stiff crap she rides now. Andy.

himespau 

I was kind of thinking of replacing the cxp-33 rims with something like the H+ Son Archetype or the BHS 472w rim, neither of which appear to have an internal nipple or eyelet. Maybe modern rims don't need them. Or maybe there's a better choice and maybe going with a box profile rim would be more aesthetically fitting for 36 spoke rims on a 1990-ish italian racing bike (columbus slx frame), and, like you say box profile rims might give a more smooth ride being more vertically compliant. I'm just trying to work out my options for when I do make the change (building up a dynamo hub wheel for my commuter and buying lighting to go with it is going to take my limited bike funds first), and didn't know if these modern rims without eyelets require nipple washers, and, if so, how to figure out which ones are the right ones.

About your lubricating the nipples point, when I built wheels in the past (all 3 of them), I've just dipped the threads of the spoke and the outside of the nipple in a little pile of Park Polylube that I'd squeezed out onto some cardboard. Does that make sense as a lubrication strategy? Much more viscous than your triflow approach, but I haven't had to true the wheels yet, so I don't know whether they've bound up.

Andrew R Stewart 

Grease works well enough for lacing up a new wheel. Certainly longer lasting then Triflow. But with an already built wheel grease won't get into the contact points very well, hence my TriFlow use on them. I really dislike building a rim that doesn't have eyelets. The greater friction is a hindrance to getting good tension without more chance of nipple rounding off, and as the spoke count goes down along with the rim's stiffness going up the needed tension gets higher.

I have always preferred non aero rims. Both for aesthetics and ride quality. I have no direct experience with either H+ Son or BHS brands. But I have read of the H+ Son's having a tire mounting difficulty, some models have a lack of bead bed drop in the rim's center. Andy.

bobonker

The H+ Son Archetype and BHS C472W (Kinlin XC-279) are not bad at all as far as tire mounting goes. I've run cloth rim tape on both rims and can get tires on by hand. And you are correct that neither has eyelets. I'd recommend deburring the spoke nipple holes before starting. Some of the H+ rims I've worked with have a lot of crud around the nipple hole. The Pacenti SL23 is IMO a much higher quality rim though it is a bear to get tires on unless you run very thin rim tape and use good technique.

Bob

hodag

66 views and five replies, well done on thread title sir.

FastJake

I've built up plenty of rims without washers and never had a problem (yet!) Washers can pull through too...

GeneO 

Right up there with "Do I need a rim job?"

himespau 

Probably could have just titled it, "should I lube up my nipples?" to see the views go through the roof.

Haven't heard of those pacentis will have to look into them.

Good point, I'm trying to true this wheelset now and some of the nipples are a bit sticky. I suppose some lube down there would help. Probably should check the tension before doing much more just to make sure it's good.

Hmmm, hadn't thought of that.

Anybody know if I do choose a non-eyeleted rim and do go with washers, how do I choose? Is it rim specific? Nipple specific? Not matter?

himespau 

So I finally put a straight edge to the rims. Rear rim, nice and flat to it. Front rim is missing about 1 mm on the brake track. Is that enough that I should worry/not ride on it?

If so, does anyone know a source for cxp 33 rims (36 hole)? The only ones I see on ebay are laced up (and big money) or 28 hole. Just swapping out that rim would be the fast/easy thing, but it's looking like a total rebuild might be cheaper.