elcruxio

Uuuuh... Are you being serious right now? How long have you been cycling? I've been at it for 10 years and it has been 10 years since I read a user manual of a bicycle the last time but I absolutely advocate a new rider reads the user manual of a new bike. To not do so would be idiotic. Also if one is unfamiliar with a new type of part in a bicycle I would as well recommend one reads the manual for said part.

But I get what you're getting at. You're cranky about disc brakes and them being on other people's bikes for some reason and that's ok.
But here's something to think about. If you have hydro discs properly setup the only thing you need to do to them is to take out the old pads when they get worn and put in new ones and off you go. With lower mid to high end brakes you don't even need to take off the wheel first. Actually if you need to remove the wheel you're dealing with pretty low end hydraulics. Essentially you can do this blindfolded. Oh yeah and bleed every three to seven years depending how much use they're seeing. But bleeding is easier than swapping cables so...
With mechanicals (BB7's in this case) you do actually need to screw the pistons back a little and then adjust distance to disc, but mechanicals are better for some uses and the tradeoffs aren't that great.

Try slapping on new rim brake pads without adjusting them. Oh yeah, you can't because even screwing them on requires adjustment, pumping the lever, correcting toe in (information about getting the correct toe in is pretty deep in the realm of spirits and magic) not to mention rim wear so you need to gauge the rim regularly and also swap the rim regularly. If you ride in Arizona or other dry place, well good on ya, but if you ride in the cold wet north like I do get ready to swap rims every couple of seasons.

corrado33

Don't need to remove the wheel to replace pads? Uh... how are you going to push the pistons back to allow for the larger new pads? Are you going to lever against the rotor? Sounds like a good way to push your rotor out of true.

Bleeding hydraulic lines is EASIER than replacing cables? What are you smoking? Are you serious? And every 3-7 years? Try yearly or biyearly if you actually ride your bike outdoors. Not to mention you need special tools to bleed every different type of hydraulic brake. Oh and you need special fluid for hydraulics as well? And that fluid isn't standardized. Geeze, sounds like even more of a pain.

I don't know what you're talking about with having to ADJUST rim brakes. Most pads come with a tiny rubber foot at the back end so that they're toed in correctly on installation. So basically squeeze the lever into the rim with the pad flat on the rim, tighten the bolt, and you're good to go. Nothing but a 5mm allen or 10mm hex wrench needed.

You've gotta be on some sort of drugs if you think hydraulics are easier to work on than rim brakes.

elcruxio

You take the pads out, put in a thin tool like a very wide screwdriver or a tire lever and push the piston in... How'd you think you push them in? Using the other side as leverage? Man you really don't know about hydro's do you? Levering against the other side is a very quick road to damaged pistons.

I did mention I live in the worst possible conditions for a bicycle. That's actually one reason I use mechs since they're more reliable when the temps go into -40C range even though at those temps even mechanical systems do have their issues. Or, I lived more up north. Nowdays I live more southward so it's not as cold but it's much wetter. I need to get me some hydro's again... But yeah, I don't bleed often since I don't need to and if you need to bleed yearly, it basically means there is a leak in your closed system, which may have been caused by the incorrect method of pushing in the pistons. Again, it's useful to follow the manufacturer instructions in this.

As to the fluid, it's no more difficult to source than it is to source cables and housings. Actually it's pretty much the same since you different standards in cables / housings too. Sometimes getting cables is more difficult than getting fluids. For instance new Sram brifters require thinner than ordinary housings, which are a real pain to get a hold of. Then there are mountain, road and campagnolo cables and you can't always tell which to use without opening up your shifter / lever. And while pretty basic stuff, you need to know which cable thickness goes to which part and which housing goes where and which ferrule goes where etc etc etc. It's easy when you know it but I was bleeding brakes way before I was swapping cables myself. With bleeding you only need to know which oil to use. And sometimes when in doubt, just use water
Special tools are useful but not strictly necessary since you can put together a pretty universal toolset by yourself and buying either a universal set or a specific set for your particular brake system from for example epic bleed solutions is as easy as buying cable cutters

Which brings me to:

You absolutely need good quality cable cutters to swap cables / housings. If you think you can manage without, you're actually bodgin the job and damaging housings in the process.

Oh how I wish it was that easy. Ever tried to get cantilevers to work? Avid shorty ultimate? It's a great brake but the suckiest ever to work on.

That's actually extremely offensive and inflammatory so I'll just report you for that.

Canker

This isn't a disc vs rim thread. There are plenty of those stupid threads if you want to argue about the same old crap go there.

joejack951

Where did you get the above idea from? Ask TRP; they are designed for the latest Shimano/SRAM levers and the geometry of the brake arm confirms that (it swings on a 36mm radius). If you want to see how good they match up with 'conventional' short pull levers, try using them with Campagnolo levers which haven't gone 'long pull' like Shimano and SRAM have in more recent years (I believe beginning with 5700, 6700, and 7900, not sure on the lower end).

corrado33

You're funny.

Direct from SRAM for some of their brakes.

So they mean, lever the pistons against each other. So it seems I'm actually the correct one here. You may want to read the manual on your next set of disc brakes. I'd also like to see you try to lever a screwdriver between the piston and rotor without damaging either...

And for the record, I live in Montana and commute everyday! I'm well versed in biking in bad weather. Even on rim brakes nonetheless! Yet my cables have never frozen... interesting. I must be doing something right?

Different cables and housings for different braking setups? Do you know what you're saying? I use the exact same type of brake cable and housing for EVERY ONE of the hundreds of mountain bikes I fix every year. Difficult to source? I suppose if finding a wal-mart or ANY BIKE SHOP IN THE WORLD is difficult then... sure...

I mean, anybody that works on bikes will have a cable cutter for derailleur cables, so it's not like they need anything special to work on brakes... And I mean, you could certainly cut cable and housing with a good pair of side cutters if you were careful. Good luck bleeding your brakes with a turkey baster.

elcruxio

It's pretty hard to damage the piston if the pad is in the way. Just a teensy bit of shifting the goalposts there bud. If you have the pads in you're not really leveraging between pistons are you?. I'll just point out that your method is actually pretty difficult if the wheel is still in place, which with modern good quality hydro's is no longer an issue. Avid elixir does not qualify as a good quality brake.

That's nice dear. Come see me when you get out of the continental climate zone and try out the more humid coastal climate. Because it's usually not the temperature that is the issue. If you lived where I live, you'd know that.
Also, can you just get a direct quote from me where I stated I had frozen cables? I have trouble finding that bit.

Yes, this may come as a shock to you but road brakes and MTB brakes use different cables. I'd assume that someone who works on hundreds of bikes a year would know that. The matter is not really made easier by the fact that some road levers use MTB cables and possibly vice versa.
I'd also assume that someone who works on hundreds of bikes a year would also know that swapping pads without taking the wheel out is standard procedure these days. Something tells me you may not be completely honest with your internet persona... Also, get a Sram Rival (or red, or force, whatever) brifter body and try to put jagwire/shimano/other standard thickness housings in. You're in for a treat

I find that the argument "anyone who works on bikes has tool X.." is actually a really bad one because it really applies to every essential tool one needs for any set of bikes one might have. You have hydro brakes? A bleed set is probably in order. Have single speed bikes? A lockring tool is probably handy. Have single speed MTB's with hydro brakes? Why would that person have cable cutters? See? Tools is tools, nothing special in bleed tools nowdays. And did I mention you can make your own? No need for a turkey baster if you have a pharmacy handy.

Does Walmart not sell DOT fluid or hydraulic system mineral oil? I thought they have everything.
And do your bike shops not sell DOT fluid or mineral oils? Because I'd be a bit worried if they don't.
I'll let you in on a secret. But don't tell anyone else ok?
Bicycles that use DOT fluids use the exact same fluids that are in automotive use. You just have to match the numbers.
And you can use pretty much any hydraulic system mineral oil in brakes that use mineral oil. If you're crafty enough, you can actually use water.

BillyD

Guys, guys! No need to make things personal and hostile. Relax a little.

Kahrpistols

I test rode my new sintered aftermarket pads (changing nothing else about the brakes except adjusting them so that the pads won't rub) yesterday in the dry and today in the slight wet.

As has been said previously, the new aftermarket pads were night and day different from the stock TRP pads. I had already changed my rear pads to Shimano organic, but as it was in the rear I didn't notice too much of a difference but with both front and rear Nukeproof sintered pads, I feel much more secure in my braking.

Even the braking in the wet is far better now.

On a slightly unrelated note, how long do you guys notice your pads last for? I still had material left on my stock TRP pads even after 8 months of hard riding but I wanted to change them out regardless. If semi-metallic lasts 8+ months, I imagine sintered should last a year or longer.

fietsbob

Found new Kool Stop 'organic' disk pads better than Avid stock BB7 pads too, so not surprising.



I used a big Screwdriver to push the disc brake wheel pistons back when I replaced the disc brake pads on my car.

redlude97

you got most of that right, except for the hand force part. Physics will tell you that the reason they pull less cable is the cable pull point is closer to the pivot point relative to the lever throw. This means it requires more lever arm throw but less force. Same problem with the trp hyrds which can be fixed with a lever arm hack that results in shorter throw but more force required

well biked

TRP says Spyres will work with any drop bar brake lever on the market, and I suppose they will if the user is willing to put up with sub-par pairings with levers/brakes or come up with some sort of hack, as you say. The bottom line is that there will be differences in the way the brakes will perform, depending on the levers that are paired with them.


I've said enough in this thread, I'll finish by quoting Sheldon (the OP's 105 levers are somewhere between the two types Sheldon is describing in this quote):

"Cable Pull

Standard pull levers are designed to work with caliper brakes or traditional centerpull cantilever brakes.
Long pull levers are designed to work with "direct-pull" cantilever brakes, such as Shimano "V-Brakes" ®

Direct pull cantilevers have twice as much mechanical advantage as traditional brakes, so they require a lever with half as much mechanical advantage. Long pull levers pull the cable twice as far, but only half as hard."