ak08820

Today, I was approaching the red light (at Oak tree Road and Grove Ave in Edison NJ going North on Grove Ave) behind a few cars already stopped at the red light and a woman (in her 40-50s)in a red SUV a few feet behind me honked for no reason. Since we were all stopped, I went around to the driver's side and asked her what was the problem and why did she honk - in a not too polite way. Another driver (probably in his 60's) behind the SUV in a large red 90's American car opened the door and invited me for a brawl for "holding up the traffic".

After the light turned green (I went thru the intersection earlier when there was no oncoming left turn traffic to avoid those 2 motorist behind me in a busy intersection)
the woman honked again when she passed me.

After crossing the intersection he followed me and forced me to stop, got out grabbed the bike, yelled and then when I tried to call the police started to snatch the phone and when I held him away by my arm raised across his chest accused me of attacking him, by now on the side walk 20 feet away from his car. When I explained to him that I was telling the woman not to honk he insisted that it was actually legal and mandatory to honk at every cyclist so that in case of an accident the motorist would not be at fault for not warning the cyclist. He said that he was asked that question by lawyers/police in 2 past accident cases he was involved in.


Unfortunately, I did not take his license plate number and now have no way to file a complaint for attempted assault. I asked him for his email address so that I can send him a reference to the regulations that actually advise against honking as I later confirmed and he mumbled it. I have emailed him and

Anyway, my question is how can a cyclist educate a motorist who honks for no reason. For some reason, it instantly puts me in a state of road rage.
I am thinking of pinning a sign like this https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5c/Italian_traffic_signs_-_divieto_di_segnalazioni_acustiche.svg on my back that indicates no honking but I am sure that will only increase the honking.

I am thinking of carrying copies of the NJ DOT Bicycling manual P 22 which indicates how drivers are supposed to drive around bicyclists and silently and politely handling them to these offending drivers in future. https://www.state.nj.us/transportatio...lingmanual.pdf

I know I was at fault for yelling at the woman in the first place, but the driver behind her was mad at me for simply being on the road talking to that woman and 'blocking the road' even when everything was at a standstill. I can't understand this mentality which thinks that bicycling where there cars is illegal. A couple of months ago, I was asked to move to the sidewalk by a landscaper towing a trailer behind a truck or van when I was riding perfectly on the right edge of the rightmost lane. FL is notorious for that but NJ is not far behind.

John Young

I had a similar incident a few weeks back when out on my road bike. I was going along a road with yellow lines at the side (means no parking for anyone not familiar with UK roads) anyway this car goes past and swerves close in front of me. I never did anything apart from shake my head, then as I went down beside the car (on inside near curb) I heard.

'Get in to the side you stupid prat'

I got off my bike and went back to his open passengers window and asked him what his problem was.

First off I could see he (young lad around 20) was surprised at all that I stopped, think I was supposed to keep going and say nothing

Anyway I kept my cool and asked him what he was shouting for. He told me I should be right at the side (which I was) and should always ride on the double yellow lines (no parking lines) I told him they were for parking and he then said I should have more consideration for other road users. I informed him that I also drive a car and was well aware of other road users,

I then asked if I was only supposed to ride on the yellow lines.... what do I do on roads with no yellow lines

He drove off.......


IDIOT....

I think so people just don't think see someone who is vulnerable (cyclist) and think or he or she is an easy target to bully

009jim

Well I have a couple ideas for you.........

[1] Have a sign on back of your car/bike that says "honk if you have low IQ".

[2] Carry an air-zound horn and if someone honks you do nothing initially but try to catch them unawares and blow your air-zound very close to their ear, thus scaring the bejesus out of them.

spunkyj

Only an idiot would admit to having been involved in two past collisions with a cyclist (apparently serious enough to involve lawyers) while trying to intimidate a cyclist! This guy is super lucky that you didn't get his license plate and report him. High probability he already had a suspended license.

Blinkie

I'd have to say when temper or adrenaline is running (due to be confronted about their bad behavior), there's very little chance that the motorist(s) will be thinking rationally at that point; trying to educate them will be all but a waste of time.

Like with many things, I think it's about earlier education. We have decades' worth of people driving on public roads who have no clue of most motor vehicle regulations, and much less about coexisting with cyclists. In many places the latter may not ever come into play, but the knowledge needs to be there. Both people somehow claimed the same idea about using one's horn to 'warn' a cyclist of passing, and though one person had been involved (it's easy to assume, by his behavior at fault) in two accidents involving bicycles, it's apparent that someone in that area is spreading that sort of misinformation, and that's so easy to do; all it takes is supposition:

"So if there's someone riding a bike on the road, they don't have mirrors or anything. How do you suppose they know if someone's about to pass, so they don't wobble out into traffic or something?"
"I don't know ... maybe you should blow your horn at them or something to let them know."
"Yeah. That sounds right. then they'll hear you."

I've seen such conversations taken as 'how it should be' in other scenarios.

Sharing the road is something which needs to be at least touched upon in the driver's educational process. It's something that should perhaps be added to public school 'assemblies' lists, especially when kids are getting closer to adult size (say middle school or so) and are likely to begin independently riding a bike places.

I could also go on about the lack of driver re-testing knowledge for license renewal, and my curiosity about how so many people actually qualify for driving privilege, but I'll keep it shorter, to adding a bit about sharing the roads with cyclists.

Sadly, I don't think it would do a great deal for a lot of drivers. But off hand I don't have any other ideas.

ak08820

Great Idea! I would even make a sign that says "Honk if you are an Idiot"

2 issues in this one, most times the car windows are closed due to the heat or cold reducing the effectiveness and I would not want to go to the drivers side to be near the ear.

gmt13

Honking for no apparent reason is irritating, but I have found that it works best for me if I just ignore it.

-G

sudo bike

1. You can't. At least not in any in-traffic scenario. Just not gonna happen. Too much adrenaline, pride, defensiveness... a mire of problems you just can't get past. Give it up now and save yourself the stress.
2. Ignoring it is honestly probably your best bet. Confrontation, even when attempted in a polite way, is almost always going to send the situation somewhere you probably don't want it to be. At most, I use hand signals (aside from the obvious one ). If I'm sitting at a red and someone behind me honks, I may either point to the next open lane or pump my hand backwards like "whatever, stay back". But even that doesn't really do anything. All it really does is show them you're aware of their presence.

ak08820

I agree that is the best action, but the honking instantly invokes road rage into me. I will need to work hard on that.

Chris516

I don't even try to educate the motorists'. Because they are not worth my time.

dynodonn 

Why I now video all my commutes, and even though my last reported motorist was traveling at a 40 mph speed "differential", I still was able to obtain a clear image of the motorist, his vehicle description, and vehicle license number.


From personal experience, I think this is a waste of time, with many motorist having their mind made up, and unwilling to except any literature while they are in a state of anger. I found it's generally more productive to have the motorist reported to/documented by local authorities, and have the authorities inform the motorist of proper road procedures when operating around other road users, especially when a motorist starts developing or has shown a pattern of poor driving.

unterhausen

I wave so they know I heard them.

genec

I carry both copies of the laws as they pertain to cyclists and an airzound.

After cycling about for some 40 odd years or so, it dawned on me about 10+ years back that I do indeed have to educate the vast unclean masses who otherwise just don't have a clue... so I made up small business cards that have the laws on them that I hand out (not often mind you... but there are moments). And I have an airzounds that I use to either warn those that fail in their responsibilities as a road user, or to respond to those that feel I am not doing my part (even though I strive to be quite legal).

The fact is there are those that will not stray from their ill-formed false beliefs... and all you can do is provide guidance and hope to avoid them in the future.

Thirstyman

anyone who gets out of his car is beyond reasoning with. Not to mention someone that puts their hands on me. At that point it is all about defensive acts of violence as needed.

Really the only education that is needed at that point is for you to tell them " do us both a favor and stay in your car" or saying their license plate number out loud so they understand that you know it.

As far as controlling your own emotions of road rage, I find it is best to realize that a good portion of society has disfunctional behavioral patterns and thinking and keep yourself from getting caught up in THEIR problems.

skye

I'm convinced that a video camera is in my near future.

ak08820

I am happy that I put it out here for discussion and received all the valuable input. Seems that the best bets are
- Ignore other drivers' actions and contact/conversation. In fact that is standard advice even when driving to avoid road rage related issues.
- Carry Airzound and Video if possible
- Carry a copy of local regulations, in case they are needed, e.g., when a cop comes, not to distribute
- I am going to add a pepper spray to my bag. I think that when I am assaulted like that, it may help. Usually, carried to control dogs when cycle touring

sudo bike

Those all sounds like pretty reasonable things to take away from it.

kjmillig

Let me tell how the story would go with me since I have a CHL and carry on my bike (when in Texas):Take that as you will, but I refuse to be a victim of severe road rage if I can help it.
You can't educate motorists unless they want to be educated, and on a busy road they generally aren't in the education mood.
BTW, I very likely would not have gone to the SUV's window. I might have given a middle finger salute though if I was already in a bad mood. And always be ready to throw yourself to the ground and scream loudly in pretend agony at the slightest tap from a motor vehicle.

Metal Man

I have a sign on my bike that says "Honk if you like bikes".

gcottay

Get the license number. Report it.

Ratzinger

I agree with those who suggested ignoring bad drivers, if only because, when I"m angry, it's hard to say something productive! And telling a bad, angry driver to **** off isn't good for anyone in the end.

The only thing I'll say now, if I have the chance, is "You're going to hurt someone driving like that!". I hope that, once the driver calms down, they'll realize that their anger and dangerous driving could really result in someone getting hurt and that they should slow down.

DX-MAN

"Assaulting him"...OP, you were BEING assaulted, you would have been in the right to cripple that fool.

ak08820

I wonder if this can be an inexpensive alternative to the standard helmet cams mentioned above. It is around $40.
https://www.meritline.com/digital-vid...q_v=297f18c3a0
Operating time before recharging is 100 min, which will be lesser in practice.

dougmc

Of course, that's an invitation for somebody to come up right behind you ... and honk.

If one thinks honking at cyclists and scaring them is fun, think how much more fun it would be if the cyclist had a sign that actually invited them to honk!

unterhausen

I wish there was a way to signal to someone that they are being an ass that isn't as offensive as flipping them off. In a quiet neighborhood with 25mph speed limits on my commute yesterday there was a guy that was driving way too fast around a corner. He ended up fully in my lane, and if my idiot detector hadn't been going off I might have been flattened.