Road Terrain; Hills vs. Flats
01-22-19, 09:37 AM
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So this is interesting. Where I live I have nothing BUT hills. I keep thinking how nice it would be to have more flats to ride on. Never thought of how it would be difficult to go anywhere when not peddling.
So to the OP, now that you've ridden both which do you prefer?
So to the OP, now that you've ridden both which do you prefer?
01-22-19, 10:44 AM
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@BirdsBikeBinocs I'm with you. I prefer hills. There is something about riding them. Wind? Forget about it. I HATE wind. But hills I'm ok with. I don't even mind mountains. I can get behind a good mountain/hill climb.
I don't descend like a mad man though. I'm all over the brakes. And I'm ok with that.
@Rides4Beer Hills make you stronger! That's been my motto for a long while now. Some friends I ride with start to groan when I suggest a ride that contains some hills. My response "Hills make you strong" to which they groan again LOL.
I don't descend like a mad man though. I'm all over the brakes. And I'm ok with that.
@Rides4Beer Hills make you stronger! That's been my motto for a long while now. Some friends I ride with start to groan when I suggest a ride that contains some hills. My response "Hills make you strong" to which they groan again LOL.
01-22-19, 11:55 AM
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Watts are watts, you maybe going faster or slower but you can make hills or flats burn the same. You learn that very quickly riding with power meters. What I think people have largely ignored is the other factors involved, type of riding you are used to and physiological factors. A 300 pound rider is going to hate the hills, chances are pretty good his threshold power is not going to be high enough to push his body mass up the hill at even a moderate pace, yet put that same rider on the flats with some wind and often times he will be just fine, especially if he can get somewhat aerodynamically positioned on his bike. The larger rider has the leg strength to generate higher torque the required by the wind, yet is not inhibited by his body mass as much as on the hills.
Smaller guys have less less body mass to push up the hills, so requires much less power so much easier, but on the flats with wind they typically do not have the ability to generate torque to push as big of gear and tend to get blown around more causing them to use extra energy just to stay upright on the road.
So depending on your home terrain, your physiological strengths and limitations each individual will find for himself or herself one to be more challenging vs the other.
I am sure if you asked Nairo Quintana he will say he loves mountains and hates time trials........small guy light weight.....hmmmmm!
Smaller guys have less less body mass to push up the hills, so requires much less power so much easier, but on the flats with wind they typically do not have the ability to generate torque to push as big of gear and tend to get blown around more causing them to use extra energy just to stay upright on the road.
So depending on your home terrain, your physiological strengths and limitations each individual will find for himself or herself one to be more challenging vs the other.
I am sure if you asked Nairo Quintana he will say he loves mountains and hates time trials........small guy light weight.....hmmmmm!
01-23-19, 08:58 PM
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Mileage in the hills and mountains is definitely slower, in my experience. Whether it is harder..... depends. To go the same number of miles in the same time? Sure, that would definitely be harder in the mountains. But I don't think most people expect to do that.
What I do find is that riding flat terrain is generally more wearisome than riding in the hills/mountains for the same amount of time. Not so much that it is boring as that I'm not getting to mix up what my body is doing as much. My body (back, arms, hands) ache more after 6 hours on the flats more than 6 hours in the mountains.
What I do find is that riding flat terrain is generally more wearisome than riding in the hills/mountains for the same amount of time. Not so much that it is boring as that I'm not getting to mix up what my body is doing as much. My body (back, arms, hands) ache more after 6 hours on the flats more than 6 hours in the mountains.
Last edited by Kapusta; 01-24-19 at 06:51 AM.
01-24-19, 01:27 AM
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Rookies fear the hills, others fear the wind. Only wind can make you GO MAD.
But there was one day it was way more up and down than I expected, and GOT mad. LOL Vernon to Summerland.
Last summer I rode my 120 lb tour bike thru BC, then south to Seaside OR, then east and NE thru Spokane and the Crowsnest Pass.
The 2nd day there was a big south headwind 30 to 35 mph, I got 23 miles to the next town and was DONE only going 4 or 5 mph. The 9th day I started in Golden and did 98 miles to Revelstoke, that has 2 major climbs with a big dip between, and a bunch of little ones. 12 hours, tired but I got there.
After I left Portland, I was in the heat up to likely 110F on the highway. Those days were cut down to 30 or 40 miles tops also.
There were some frustrating days when I was thinking it's 90 minutes to go, then the wind starts up and an hour later I am still 90 minutes to go.
But there was one day it was way more up and down than I expected, and GOT mad. LOL Vernon to Summerland.
Last summer I rode my 120 lb tour bike thru BC, then south to Seaside OR, then east and NE thru Spokane and the Crowsnest Pass.
The 2nd day there was a big south headwind 30 to 35 mph, I got 23 miles to the next town and was DONE only going 4 or 5 mph. The 9th day I started in Golden and did 98 miles to Revelstoke, that has 2 major climbs with a big dip between, and a bunch of little ones. 12 hours, tired but I got there.
After I left Portland, I was in the heat up to likely 110F on the highway. Those days were cut down to 30 or 40 miles tops also.
There were some frustrating days when I was thinking it's 90 minutes to go, then the wind starts up and an hour later I am still 90 minutes to go.
Last edited by GamblerGORD53; 01-24-19 at 01:31 AM.
01-24-19, 06:07 AM
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I chose to go to the gym instead of riding a century once this year when I saw gusts of 35-50 mph in the forecast. I was actually more worried about crosswinds at that intensity than either head or tail winds. Do other people have wind cutoff points?
01-24-19, 07:21 AM
#57
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You folks arguing, and trying to change each other’s minds are FUNNY !
Anyway.........WIND stinks !
Anyway.........WIND stinks !
01-24-19, 08:20 AM
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I think the arguing phase of this thread fizzled rather quickly. I also think that experienced riders know that they can put in maximum effort in whatever terrain they're riding, and can put in something less than maximum as well.
And if you want to talk about wind literally stinking, have you ever ridden by one of those big cow barn operations? Arrrrrrrggggggghhhh!
01-24-19, 08:43 AM
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I think the arguing phase of this thread fizzled rather quickly. I also think that experienced riders know that they can put in maximum effort in whatever terrain they're riding, and can put in something less than maximum as well.
And if you want to talk about wind literally stinking, have you ever ridden by one of those big cow barn operations? Arrrrrrrggggggghhhh!
And if you want to talk about wind literally stinking, have you ever ridden by one of those big cow barn operations? Arrrrrrrggggggghhhh!
LOL....yes I have, and an occasional land fill !
01-24-19, 08:46 AM
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I climb a measly 400,000ft per year, and I'm here to tell you that wind is worse than any hill. I'll take slogging up a hill over going into a headwind any day of the week-- because a hill has a top, and as others have pointed out, you get to coast back down. Wind is merciless.
I agree to a point about riding flats vs. repeated climb/descents... especially if you throw in stoplights. Going up a hill is usually steady power for a specific amount of time, followed by a relatively long period of coasting or low-power output. Riding on flat, urban/suburban streets is constant fluctuations in power, including frequent and repeated bursts to 1.5 - 2X FTP, in my experience. I was watching my power output yesterday, and every acceleration from a stoplight was ~440W for 5-7 seconds. Repeat that 30 or 40 times, and climbing the hills at a steady output starts to feel easier. "Traffic intervals" really start to grind me down after say mile 50. I quietly pray for green lights.
Oh, and a "climb" is at least 30 minutes, uninterrupted. Or more. A few minutes up a bump, that's just riding. That's what kinda makes me jealous of people who live where there's rolling terrain-- they can climb 3,000 - 4,000ft in a day and never climb more than 100ft in one go. If I pull out of the driveway and head east, I climb 800ft in the first 5 miles. If I keep going, it's 4,800ft in 20 miles.
I agree to a point about riding flats vs. repeated climb/descents... especially if you throw in stoplights. Going up a hill is usually steady power for a specific amount of time, followed by a relatively long period of coasting or low-power output. Riding on flat, urban/suburban streets is constant fluctuations in power, including frequent and repeated bursts to 1.5 - 2X FTP, in my experience. I was watching my power output yesterday, and every acceleration from a stoplight was ~440W for 5-7 seconds. Repeat that 30 or 40 times, and climbing the hills at a steady output starts to feel easier. "Traffic intervals" really start to grind me down after say mile 50. I quietly pray for green lights.
Oh, and a "climb" is at least 30 minutes, uninterrupted. Or more. A few minutes up a bump, that's just riding. That's what kinda makes me jealous of people who live where there's rolling terrain-- they can climb 3,000 - 4,000ft in a day and never climb more than 100ft in one go. If I pull out of the driveway and head east, I climb 800ft in the first 5 miles. If I keep going, it's 4,800ft in 20 miles.
I live in the flats. I mean absolutely flat. Wind is so demoralizing to me. For me there is a significant psychological difference. I go out to CO almost every summer and give myself some substantial climbing challenges. When I reach the peak I can look back and say "I conquered that." 3000 feet of climbing at an average grade of 3% is an readily measurable accomplishment. There is no such glory with the wind. You can't look back and say "I conquered that." You don't find threads here where people have tracked their time pedaling into a 15MPH headwind and boasted about it. There is no spectacular view at the end of a run into a headwind. Headwinds blow.
Climbing adds up much more easily in rolling terrain. One year in Ragbrai we hit close to 5000 feet of climbing. I wasn't too worn out at the end of that day. If I hit 5000 feet of climbing in CO there was a climb or two that kicked my butt.
I also get what you are saying about urban riding. It's a different beast. The constant starting and stopping is challenges us in a unique way.
01-24-19, 09:07 AM
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I think the arguing phase of this thread fizzled rather quickly. I also think that experienced riders know that they can put in maximum effort in whatever terrain they're riding, and can put in something less than maximum as well.
And if you want to talk about wind literally stinking, have you ever ridden by one of those big cow barn operations? Arrrrrrrggggggghhhh!
And if you want to talk about wind literally stinking, have you ever ridden by one of those big cow barn operations? Arrrrrrrggggggghhhh!
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's. The captain said "I think John will appreciate your bike, why don't you describe it to him." I started off by telling them that I was patriotic and had built the bike in a patriotic red, white and blue scheme. I went on to describe the bike in such detail that I hoped a blind person could create a useful visual. When I finished, John asked me a question or two and I answered. I sensed that they were ready to roll out (they were really fast) but I thought I had a unique opportunity to learn, so I asked John if he would take a minute to tell me how he experiences the ride. He was happy to do so. He told me that he would often hear parts of other conversations, some of which were interesting and some of which he wished he could unhear. He said it was nice to get beside someone playing music, but only if it was good music. He also said he could tell when they were passing good food stands. I joked that I bet the many pig farms really got his attention. The two of them chuckled in agreement. They laughed in agreement again when I said "you can damn near taste them." With that I thanked them for the conversation and bid them farewell.
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief. A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
That was a really long way for me to tell you I can truly relate to the smell of big cattle operations. Two of my usual loops take me by sewage treatment plants. On warm, humid, windless days you really can taste them.
01-24-19, 11:06 AM
#62
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Your post brought an interesting story to mind. When I rode RAGBRAI in 2016 I chatted with a lot of people along the way. It's a great social event. I was riding a generic white carbon fiber frame with no decals at all. I had a blue crank, blue cables and a few other blue accents. I had red pedals, red tires, red grips and some other red accents. The bike was really patriotic looking.
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's. The captain said "I think John will appreciate your bike, why don't you describe it to him." I started off by telling them that I was patriotic and had built the bike in a patriotic red, white and blue scheme. I went on to describe the bike in such detail that I hoped a blind person could create a useful visual. When I finished, John asked me a question or two and I answered. I sensed that they were ready to roll out (they were really fast) but I thought I had a unique opportunity to learn, so I asked John if he would take a minute to tell me how he experiences the ride. He was happy to do so. He told me that he would often hear parts of other conversations, some of which were interesting and some of which he wished he could unhear. He said it was nice to get beside someone playing music, but only if it was good music. He also said he could tell when they were passing good food stands. I joked that I bet the many pig farms really got his attention. The two of them chuckled in agreement. They laughed in agreement again when I said "you can damn near taste them." With that I thanked them for the conversation and bid them farewell.
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief. A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
That was a really long way for me to tell you I can truly relate to the smell of big cattle operations. Two of my usual loops take me by sewage treatment plants. On warm, humid, windless days you really can taste them.
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's. The captain said "I think John will appreciate your bike, why don't you describe it to him." I started off by telling them that I was patriotic and had built the bike in a patriotic red, white and blue scheme. I went on to describe the bike in such detail that I hoped a blind person could create a useful visual. When I finished, John asked me a question or two and I answered. I sensed that they were ready to roll out (they were really fast) but I thought I had a unique opportunity to learn, so I asked John if he would take a minute to tell me how he experiences the ride. He was happy to do so. He told me that he would often hear parts of other conversations, some of which were interesting and some of which he wished he could unhear. He said it was nice to get beside someone playing music, but only if it was good music. He also said he could tell when they were passing good food stands. I joked that I bet the many pig farms really got his attention. The two of them chuckled in agreement. They laughed in agreement again when I said "you can damn near taste them." With that I thanked them for the conversation and bid them farewell.
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief. A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
That was a really long way for me to tell you I can truly relate to the smell of big cattle operations. Two of my usual loops take me by sewage treatment plants. On warm, humid, windless days you really can taste them.
Last April on a solo ride along a familiar rural route I encountered a cyclist flying a flag I didn't recognize -- an American flag, monochrome except for a single red stripe. As I passed I slowed to ask about it. He was a former paramedic or EMT (I've forgotten which) who was badly injured when he was struck by another vehicle while stopped to render aid to a previous crash victim. After finally getting out of the hospital his goal was to ride across the US, flying that flag, to raise awareness for emergency responders, to encourage drivers to slow down and pass safely. Along the way he stopped at many fire and police stations to chat and take photos.
I could tell the fellow was in a lot of discomfort and we actually got off to walk our bikes for awhile on some hills -- besides the neck injury (which I also have from a 2001 accident), dragging that big billowing flag into 15-25 mph wind was a serious chore.
His girlfriend drove ahead in an RV and they'd rendezvous at various points, depending on how he was feeling and the routes. I think that day I met him he was pretty exhausted after about 25 miles -- it was into a stiff headwind the whole way, with a roller coaster highway and lots of short but steep climbs. Even for me on a road bike with no baggage or flag it's a challenging ride.
He persisted and finished a few months later, having ridden from the southeast coast to California.
01-24-19, 11:24 AM
#63
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For example: a continuous climb up HWY38 to Valley of the Falls Drive, ascending 4,000ft in 15 miles, and taking about 2 hours. My last effort was very moderated, and averaged just north of 200W for the climb. The descent took 27 minutes and averaged 70W.
Was there coasting on the way up? Well, if you stop pedaling, you stop moving, so no. Coasting on the way down? Yeah. Quite a bit. That coasting isn't recovery so much as it is what I earned. I paid for that coasting.
Was there coasting on the way up? Well, if you stop pedaling, you stop moving, so no. Coasting on the way down? Yeah. Quite a bit. That coasting isn't recovery so much as it is what I earned. I paid for that coasting.
I often think the same thing when I find myself coasting, and as also posted above, using a cadence meter is a good motivator to keep pedaling. Furthermore if you track your average speed for a ride, pedaling downhill is an easy way to bump up the average.
As far as feeling "guilty" about coasting, I think to myself that I did have to pedal up the hill to be able to coast down, and maybe the respite is good for recovery. A saying of Ronald Reagan from the 1980 presidential campaign strangely comes to mind as I coast. RR said, "I paid for this microphone, Mr. Breen."
I paid for this hill.
As far as feeling "guilty" about coasting, I think to myself that I did have to pedal up the hill to be able to coast down, and maybe the respite is good for recovery. A saying of Ronald Reagan from the 1980 presidential campaign strangely comes to mind as I coast. RR said, "I paid for this microphone, Mr. Breen."
I paid for this hill.
01-24-19, 11:59 AM
#64
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Your post brought an interesting story to mind. When I rode RAGBRAI in 2016 I chatted with a lot of people along the way. It's a great social event.
I was riding a generic white carbon fiber frame with no decals at all. I had a blue crank, blue cables and a few other blue accents. I had red pedals, red tires, red grips and some other red accents. The bike was really patriotic looking.
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's...
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief.
A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
I was riding a generic white carbon fiber frame with no decals at all. I had a blue crank, blue cables and a few other blue accents. I had red pedals, red tires, red grips and some other red accents. The bike was really patriotic looking.
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's...
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief.
A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
Thanks for sharing that story.
Last April on a solo ride along a familiar rural route I encountered a cyclist flying a flag I didn't recognize -- an American flag, monochrome except for a single red stripe. As I passed I slowed to ask about it.
He was a former paramedic or EMT (I've forgotten which) who was badly injured when he was struck by another vehicle while stopped to render aid to a previous crash victim. After finally getting out of the hospital his goal was to ride across the US, flying that flag, to raise awareness for emergency responders, to encourage drivers to slow down and pass safely. Along the way he stopped at many fire and police stations to chat and take photos.
He persisted and finished a few months later, having ridden from the southeast coast to California.
Last April on a solo ride along a familiar rural route I encountered a cyclist flying a flag I didn't recognize -- an American flag, monochrome except for a single red stripe. As I passed I slowed to ask about it.
He was a former paramedic or EMT (I've forgotten which) who was badly injured when he was struck by another vehicle while stopped to render aid to a previous crash victim. After finally getting out of the hospital his goal was to ride across the US, flying that flag, to raise awareness for emergency responders, to encourage drivers to slow down and pass safely. Along the way he stopped at many fire and police stations to chat and take photos.
He persisted and finished a few months later, having ridden from the southeast coast to California.
I live in downtown Boston and was in a suburb 14 miles south of the City on Saturday (yesterday).
I just so happened to encounter a large contingent of well-appointed cyclists at a water stop. It turns out they were on the Muddy Angels Ride(National EMS Emergency Medical Services Memorial Bike Ride) to “memorialize and celebrate the lives of those who serve everyday, those who have become sick or injured while performing their duties, and those who have died in the line of duty.”
This was the East Coast Ride, from Boston to Washington DC, one of a few other Regional Rides. Their itinerary is:…
Many riders were wearing those blue and orange jerseys as seen below.
I just so happened to encounter a large contingent of well-appointed cyclists at a water stop. It turns out they were on the Muddy Angels Ride(National EMS Emergency Medical Services Memorial Bike Ride) to “memorialize and celebrate the lives of those who serve everyday, those who have become sick or injured while performing their duties, and those who have died in the line of duty.”
This was the East Coast Ride, from Boston to Washington DC, one of a few other Regional Rides. Their itinerary is:…
Many riders were wearing those blue and orange jerseys as seen below.
01-24-19, 12:00 PM
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Of course wind is worse than climbing. At least when you climb you know you will get to enjoy the downhill at some point.
The wind just changes direction when you turn around. It's like finishing a climb and finding yourself at the bottom again.
The wind just changes direction when you turn around. It's like finishing a climb and finding yourself at the bottom again.
01-24-19, 12:50 PM
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01-24-19, 01:34 PM
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I would love to ride in hillier terrain to build up my strength, but the closest thing to a proper hill is a 65 mile ride and is only about 10 minutes long at 7%. Also don't have headwinds/tailwinds, just crosswinds.
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01-24-19, 02:31 PM
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Thanks for sharing that story.
Last April on a solo ride along a familiar rural route I encountered a cyclist flying a flag I didn't recognize -- an American flag, monochrome except for a single red stripe. As I passed I slowed to ask about it. He was a former paramedic or EMT (I've forgotten which) who was badly injured when he was struck by another vehicle while stopped to render aid to a previous crash victim. After finally getting out of the hospital his goal was to ride across the US, flying that flag, to raise awareness for emergency responders, to encourage drivers to slow down and pass safely. Along the way he stopped at many fire and police stations to chat and take photos.
I could tell the fellow was in a lot of discomfort and we actually got off to walk our bikes for awhile on some hills -- besides the neck injury (which I also have from a 2001 accident), dragging that big billowing flag into 15-25 mph wind was a serious chore.
His girlfriend drove ahead in an RV and they'd rendezvous at various points, depending on how he was feeling and the routes. I think that day I met him he was pretty exhausted after about 25 miles -- it was into a stiff headwind the whole way, with a roller coaster highway and lots of short but steep climbs. Even for me on a road bike with no baggage or flag it's a challenging ride.
He persisted and finished a few months later, having ridden from the southeast coast to California.
Last April on a solo ride along a familiar rural route I encountered a cyclist flying a flag I didn't recognize -- an American flag, monochrome except for a single red stripe. As I passed I slowed to ask about it. He was a former paramedic or EMT (I've forgotten which) who was badly injured when he was struck by another vehicle while stopped to render aid to a previous crash victim. After finally getting out of the hospital his goal was to ride across the US, flying that flag, to raise awareness for emergency responders, to encourage drivers to slow down and pass safely. Along the way he stopped at many fire and police stations to chat and take photos.
I could tell the fellow was in a lot of discomfort and we actually got off to walk our bikes for awhile on some hills -- besides the neck injury (which I also have from a 2001 accident), dragging that big billowing flag into 15-25 mph wind was a serious chore.
His girlfriend drove ahead in an RV and they'd rendezvous at various points, depending on how he was feeling and the routes. I think that day I met him he was pretty exhausted after about 25 miles -- it was into a stiff headwind the whole way, with a roller coaster highway and lots of short but steep climbs. Even for me on a road bike with no baggage or flag it's a challenging ride.
He persisted and finished a few months later, having ridden from the southeast coast to California.
Thank you for sharing. I could read anecdotes like that all day long. For me RAGBRAI was as much about the short social interactions as it was the ride.
01-25-19, 10:43 AM
#69
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Your post brought an interesting story to mind. When I rode RAGBRAI in 2016 I chatted with a lot of people along the way. It's a great social event. I was riding a generic white carbon fiber frame with no decals at all. I had a blue crank, blue cables and a few other blue accents. I had red pedals, red tires, red grips and some other red accents. The bike was really patriotic looking.
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's. The captain said "I think John will appreciate your bike, why don't you describe it to him." I started off by telling them that I was patriotic and had built the bike in a patriotic red, white and blue scheme. I went on to describe the bike in such detail that I hoped a blind person could create a useful visual. When I finished, John asked me a question or two and I answered. I sensed that they were ready to roll out (they were really fast) but I thought I had a unique opportunity to learn, so I asked John if he would take a minute to tell me how he experiences the ride. He was happy to do so. He told me that he would often hear parts of other conversations, some of which were interesting and some of which he wished he could unhear. He said it was nice to get beside someone playing music, but only if it was good music. He also said he could tell when they were passing good food stands. I joked that I bet the many pig farms really got his attention. The two of them chuckled in agreement. They laughed in agreement again when I said "you can damn near taste them." With that I thanked them for the conversation and bid them farewell.
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief. A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
That was a really long way for me to tell you I can truly relate to the smell of big cattle operations. Two of my usual loops take me by sewage treatment plants. On warm, humid, windless days you really can taste them.
A few guys on a tandem pulled up beside me and the captain struck up a conversation. After chatting for a minute or so, he introduced me to his stoker. His stoker was blind. He had lost his vision in his early 30's. He was now in his 40's. The captain said "I think John will appreciate your bike, why don't you describe it to him." I started off by telling them that I was patriotic and had built the bike in a patriotic red, white and blue scheme. I went on to describe the bike in such detail that I hoped a blind person could create a useful visual. When I finished, John asked me a question or two and I answered. I sensed that they were ready to roll out (they were really fast) but I thought I had a unique opportunity to learn, so I asked John if he would take a minute to tell me how he experiences the ride. He was happy to do so. He told me that he would often hear parts of other conversations, some of which were interesting and some of which he wished he could unhear. He said it was nice to get beside someone playing music, but only if it was good music. He also said he could tell when they were passing good food stands. I joked that I bet the many pig farms really got his attention. The two of them chuckled in agreement. They laughed in agreement again when I said "you can damn near taste them." With that I thanked them for the conversation and bid them farewell.
I thought about the conversation after they rode away. The riders just had this presence about them that made me think they may be military. The fact that they liked the patriotic themed bike reinforced the belief. A year or so later I stumbled across this and it all came together for me. https://fox4kc.com/2018/09/01/army-v...riends-memory/ I shed a tear when I read it.
That was a really long way for me to tell you I can truly relate to the smell of big cattle operations. Two of my usual loops take me by sewage treatment plants. On warm, humid, windless days you really can taste them.
Best pig poop story ever!
Seriously, thanks for telling that story, made my online day. Very sad, but truly touching.
01-25-19, 10:56 AM
#70
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Just wanted to point out that my mention of the smell of cow poop on a thread about hills and flats brought out two inspiring stories from @Paul Barnard and @canklecat.
Sometimes the internet is astounding in a good way.
Sometimes the internet is astounding in a good way.
