David Newton

What are the bikes made of? How heavy are they?
Let me frame my question a bit.
As an example the green Taurus, and others, have geometry and look somewhat like a Raleigh DL-1.
A DL-1 is a fairly heavy bike.
Are some of the Italian bikes made of light weight tubing & other weight-saving strategies, even though they are utility bikes?

iab

Thanks! Correct me if I am wrong, but the rear brake is in purple. The rod comes down the stem and it looks like it attaches to a ring on the inside of the steerer tube. When the brake lever is squeezed, it lifts the rod and disc "up". The disc pushes on the yellow lever arm that is attached to the downtube and protrudes through a groove cut into the steerer tube. No matter how much that disc turns with the handlebars, it is always in contact lever arm. Obviously you can't have 360 degrees of turning the handlebars, but judging by the drawing 90-120 degrees would easily be achieved.

Nice, simple mechanism. The groove in the steerer tube is completely internal and would not pose any structural penalty.

Do the Taurus bikes typically go for higher amounts than the Bianchis and Umberto Deis?

Citoyen du Monde

There were many light-weight city bikes, including full aluminum bikes in Italy in the 30's... You need to understand that city bikes represented the 80-90% of the whole bike market and therefore the really high bikes like the Taurus Mod. 19 and Mod. 25 might only have represented 1% of sales but they were considered to be the "halo product" of the bike line which was used to show the market just what they were capable of building. The Lautal model from Taurus was built as a sub-11 Kg bike including full fenders and chaincase (about half the weight of a DL-1!). I have ridden quite a few DL-1's and in my opinion they are a poor excuse for a bike when you compare them to the top Italian and French city bikes. They are unnecessarily heavy and slow handling.

The sliding collar in the steer tube (the part highlighted in purple/pink) is indeed what controls the rear brake. The rod that is actioned by moving the rear brake lever threads into the collar whereas the rod that is actioned by moving the front brake lever passes through a more or less central hole in the collar. The collar has a goove for the front end of the yellow pivot on about a 180° range.

The more complex Taurus bikes are highly sought after with prices considerably higher than almost all racing bikes in Italy. If you find a Bianchi Super, it will be on a similar price to the top Taurus models. Bianchi, Umberto Dei and Taurus all made ranges of bikes. So you can't really compare brand to brand but you could compare models within the range to one another. Taurus tended to be slightly higher priced bikes only whereas Bianchi and Dei sold a wider range of bikes.

woodrupjoe

Pardon my C&V ignorance here, but I always thought Frejus was a French bicycle. As I recall from my High School Italian classes, there's not even a "J" in the Italian alphabet. Maybe a non-native frame-maker building bikes in Italy? Always something new to learn.

I'm 2 for 2 on this- Last month I would have sworn that Marinoni was Italian.

rootboy 

It's a bit deceiving, Frejus being a town on the southwest coast of France and all. But the bikes, Italian through and through, were apparently named in honor of those who lost their lives building the Frejus tunnel under the Alps between Italy and France. Here's some info from the Classic Rendezvous site:

"Frejus (alternatively written Freyus) was founded in 1896 in Torino by Emmo Ghelfi and still run by him in 1946. The brand was later acquired by Emilio Bozzi and co-produced in Milan with his Legnano and Woolsit brands. In the mid 1970s, Mr. Bozzi was kidnapped & assassinated by the Red Guard. The company was then dissolved, his family having lost heart to continue the enterprise. By the early 1980s, the brand license was obtained by Bianchi and in 1988 a new usage of Legnano took place in a Bianchi financed team, starring Maurizio Fondriest."

woodrupjoe

Wow, thanks. What an interesting history. Like I said, always something new to learn. I'll have to do some googling and get more of the details on the info above.

noglider 

I guess the founder of Frejus enjoyed his time in Frejus and named his line of bikes after the city. And yes, the Italian alphabet has no 'J'.

Marinoni is Italian born but immigrated to Montréal long ago.

Citoyen du Monde

If you want to better understand the history of the name Frejus, you must actually go back to prior to 1858. In fact, up until 1858, the house of Savoy (Savoia in Italian), the last family to reign over the kingdom of Italy had control over the whole area where the Frejus mountain is located, as well as the city of Frejus (in what is now France), as well as the location of the Frejus mountain tunnel (which now features one outlet in Italy and one outlet in France). It was therefore a wholly "Italian" territory. The King of Italy launched work on the Frejus tunnel while the whole area was under Italian control. However before the building of the tunnel was completed, a portion that now makes up the Savoy (Savoie in French) area of France (1 point to whoever guesses where the name stems from) was ceded to France. Therefore since the bike company was founded less than 40 years after the transfer it was still recent history. In Italian the j is not used as we would use it in English, but you do see it occasionally. It is known as a "long i". Our Y is known as a "greek i". Both of these terms are meant to differentiate from the normal "Italian" I. The J and the Y are both used to indicate a slightly different pronunciation of the letter I. There is however quite a bit of debate within Italy how to pronounce them and they therefore often get interchanged. That's why the former pro cycling team Jolly is alternatively written as Jollj or Jolly or Jolli (BTW if you play cards in Italy, a Jolly is our Joker).

woodrupjoe

Man, this history lesson gets better by the minute! Hats off to our illustrious C&V scholars.

catmandew52

This is getting interesting!

Roll-Monroe-Co

Photos of random classic Italian city bikes nella strada. Pretty random and NOTHING fancy. A few 500s and well. They are fancy.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/8214363...7629386618803/

Citoyen du Monde

Here is my old 1954 500C Abarth



Check out the advert for the new 500 Abarth

brianinc-ville

Oh, man, don't say that. Take a lock. No scumbag thief deserves that lovely bike.

Roll-Monroe-Co

That's how I felt about this little station wagon. Mi fa male il cuore!

Citoyen du Monde

I owned my 500C for 15 years. The first year that I owned it, it was my only vehicle, also used to make the 20 km commute to work in (in the province of Treviso.) I later brought it with me to the US and eventually sold it to a surgeon in McAllen Texas.



I would buy a new Fiat in a heart beat.

I bought the car when the odometer read 60,000

hagen2456

Any football (that's "soccer" for you Yanks ) fan knows that the letter "j" is used in Italian. At least in Torino!

clubman 

You-vent-tuss!! (I worshiped AC Milan back in the glory days)

Bicilover

any shops that sell these bikes online with worldwide shipping?

Bicilover

most practical bikes ever made and still being made but how can someone outside of Italy obtain one new or second hand?

RustyJames 

Ain’t no way you’re getting my C&V Italian city bike.

RustyJames 

Or this Bianchi when it is finished…

martl

the proverbial Italian city bike is a lot like what is known as "dutch" actually - upright position, closed chain protector, lever action brakes that operate on the bottom side of the rim; on nicer bikes, pushrods hidden inside the handlebars, manufactured by all brands including Dei, Bianchi etc. Internal geared hub or no shifting at all.

htt

David Newton

Wow, I haven't visited here in quite some time, and find this thread still having life! This is my Italian city-bike wanna-be, a Vianelli frame of Columbus SL and its only Italian component. Not exactly city-bike geometry, but it is my city bike. Not riding a lot anymore, I'm 70, and vegetable gardening has taken the time I used to ride. The star of this bike is the RHM saddle, my butt thanks you Rudy!

52telecaster

Rudy rocks!

Bicilover

nice bike