Clip in knee pain
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Clip in knee pain
Hi all,
I have severe knee pain when i clip in on three different bikes.
I set the cleats on the shoes as far back as I possibly could.
The float isn’t crazy but not bad either. Spd pedals.
I keep a bend in my knee as far as seat height goes.
Any thoughts?
I have severe knee pain when i clip in on three different bikes.
I set the cleats on the shoes as far back as I possibly could.
The float isn’t crazy but not bad either. Spd pedals.
I keep a bend in my knee as far as seat height goes.
Any thoughts?
#2
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What is your riding history? Maybe going back to last year (2019) - what kind of mileage do you ride per week and in one ride?
Have you made any noteworthy changes in your riding in the past year? More mileage? Riding harder? Did you switch to SPD's recently?
Did you have any leg issues - injuries, strength training to overcome past issues, physical therapy to overcome any past issues or injuries?
Lots of questions, I know, but any more info you can offer the group would help other than "pain when clipping in".
For what it is worth, I have been riding on bad knees for several years now. I used platform pedals when I got in to heavier mileage riding and built up the muscles and tendons on the top of my legs. In a round about way, the build up of my legs ended up pulling my kneecaps sideways which put pressure on the bones. I did a lot of physical therapy to "fix" my knees, and quite frankly they are not back to normal still. However, that is what forced me to SPD's - I made the move so that I could work my legs all the way around. It is has made all the difference and if it wasn't for SPD's I simply wouldn't be able to ride more than around the block.
In your case - the process of clipping in to the pedals causing a lot of pain doesn't sound quite right. There has to be something going on that needs looked at. It just is that when you clip in you exacerbate that issue and you feel it.
I would be curious if, when clipped in and riding, you push forward with your toes from about 9:00 to 2:00 in your pedal stroke if that causes pain also. Or, if you stand next to a wall with shoes on and try to put pressure on your toes against the wall forwards (leg extended, as opposed to retracted in the pedal stroke) if that causes pain.
As for cleat position - I center mine on the ball of my feet behind my big toes. I do ride with convertible pedals that have platforms on one side, though, because on long rides it gives me flexibility to change where the force is on my feet in case my calves burn out in the cleat position - I gots lotsa options with the platform side, even though my cleats don't hold there. The relief to my calves at that point trumps being clipped in.
Have you made any noteworthy changes in your riding in the past year? More mileage? Riding harder? Did you switch to SPD's recently?
Did you have any leg issues - injuries, strength training to overcome past issues, physical therapy to overcome any past issues or injuries?
Lots of questions, I know, but any more info you can offer the group would help other than "pain when clipping in".
For what it is worth, I have been riding on bad knees for several years now. I used platform pedals when I got in to heavier mileage riding and built up the muscles and tendons on the top of my legs. In a round about way, the build up of my legs ended up pulling my kneecaps sideways which put pressure on the bones. I did a lot of physical therapy to "fix" my knees, and quite frankly they are not back to normal still. However, that is what forced me to SPD's - I made the move so that I could work my legs all the way around. It is has made all the difference and if it wasn't for SPD's I simply wouldn't be able to ride more than around the block.
In your case - the process of clipping in to the pedals causing a lot of pain doesn't sound quite right. There has to be something going on that needs looked at. It just is that when you clip in you exacerbate that issue and you feel it.
I would be curious if, when clipped in and riding, you push forward with your toes from about 9:00 to 2:00 in your pedal stroke if that causes pain also. Or, if you stand next to a wall with shoes on and try to put pressure on your toes against the wall forwards (leg extended, as opposed to retracted in the pedal stroke) if that causes pain.
As for cleat position - I center mine on the ball of my feet behind my big toes. I do ride with convertible pedals that have platforms on one side, though, because on long rides it gives me flexibility to change where the force is on my feet in case my calves burn out in the cleat position - I gots lotsa options with the platform side, even though my cleats don't hold there. The relief to my calves at that point trumps being clipped in.
#3
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Well I rode 4k to 8k a day everyday as a commuter - even in the dead of winter. I also hike and trail run.
since Covid I’ve been doing group rides - the first time I felt the lightening bolt strike me near dead was on a 50k ride. I rode 50k before but on platforms without issue.
I had xrays done, nothing turned up.
I have pain time to time but rarely while riding my bike with just platforms. It’s almost guaranteed to cause pain if I clip in. Terrible pain sometimes. I ride a Long haul trucker, trek 520 and Marinoni special (Not that the bike really matters).
since Covid I’ve been doing group rides - the first time I felt the lightening bolt strike me near dead was on a 50k ride. I rode 50k before but on platforms without issue.
I had xrays done, nothing turned up.
I have pain time to time but rarely while riding my bike with just platforms. It’s almost guaranteed to cause pain if I clip in. Terrible pain sometimes. I ride a Long haul trucker, trek 520 and Marinoni special (Not that the bike really matters).
#4
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Are your feet in the same place on the pedals as they were on the platforms? Might be interesting to ride the platform pedals and stop without moving your foot and measuring where the ball of your foot is fore and aft in regard to the pedal spindle. Also the distance between the crank face and the ball of your foot. Measure the same between your heel and the crank. Swap pedals and see if you can match those with your cleats.
For a century, cyclists rode new shoes without cleats long enough for the pedal to make a mark on the sole. The old-fashioned slotted cleat was placed over the mark. I've had knee isues the past many decades and used slotted or fixed cleats that force my feet to toe-in. That external forcing is a Godsend for my knees. No restraint is, for me, bad. Forcing my feet in with my muscles, worse. But that's just me. You do fine on platforms so your challenge is to get that position with cleats.
Ben
For a century, cyclists rode new shoes without cleats long enough for the pedal to make a mark on the sole. The old-fashioned slotted cleat was placed over the mark. I've had knee isues the past many decades and used slotted or fixed cleats that force my feet to toe-in. That external forcing is a Godsend for my knees. No restraint is, for me, bad. Forcing my feet in with my muscles, worse. But that's just me. You do fine on platforms so your challenge is to get that position with cleats.
Ben
#5
Senior Member
I had the same issue before. For me I needed pedals with longer spindles or pedal extensions. I also position the cleat to the inside as much as possible.
#6
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That is odd. Sitting here, I can put the inside of my heel against a chair leg, then trap the outside of the ball of my heel with the other heel and twist my lower leg as though I were clipping in, as hard as I can, full muscle engagement, without a hint of pain.
My understanding is that if you were to try this test, even putting the slightest twisting force on your foot would hurt? In that case, you might have a nasty injury. Better get it looked at, MRI probably.
Using this method to twist my foot the other way, as if I were clipping out, will produce a little discomfort on the inside of my knee, but that's near the limit of my strength.
MTB shoes or road? If MTB, are the rubber cleats far enough away from the SPD cleats to not touch the pedal? With the shoe off your foot, can you look to see what's going on?
Another thought: By putting the cleats as far back as possible, you are decreasing the lever arm between your tibia and your pedal. Obviously, the smaller the lever arm, the more force is required to clip in. Torque = force*distance, thus force = torque/distance and the larger the distance the smaller the force. Move your cleats forward.
My understanding is that if you were to try this test, even putting the slightest twisting force on your foot would hurt? In that case, you might have a nasty injury. Better get it looked at, MRI probably.
Using this method to twist my foot the other way, as if I were clipping out, will produce a little discomfort on the inside of my knee, but that's near the limit of my strength.
MTB shoes or road? If MTB, are the rubber cleats far enough away from the SPD cleats to not touch the pedal? With the shoe off your foot, can you look to see what's going on?
Another thought: By putting the cleats as far back as possible, you are decreasing the lever arm between your tibia and your pedal. Obviously, the smaller the lever arm, the more force is required to clip in. Torque = force*distance, thus force = torque/distance and the larger the distance the smaller the force. Move your cleats forward.
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