stingray66

Haveing a lot of problems with a 1975 schwinn varsity with the side pull brakes
Been messing with it for a long time I have bought three sets of different type of look stop pads at frist they squealed
Toed them in squeal is gone BUT if I am going down hill and ride the brakes lightly they howl something a full I have adjusted the center bolt to the caliper made sure pads are sitting on the rim right and all I get is this Loud howling
Today I put back on the original pads that came with the bike sanded them lighty
No toe in just bolted them on and the bike is real quite no Noise The original pads did not stop that great but when I reinstalled them I sanded them a little and now bike stops good and its QUITE
So what am I doing wrong with the kook stops ?? Been messing with this for days

stingray66

this is what i put back on its a block with two cuts in them it has no name on them but after sanding them a little they seem to stop fine and they are quite

rhenning

Did you mean quiet???? Roger

AlexCyclistRoch

I want to meet those "kook stops"......

stingray66

sorry this dam spell check keeps changing words NOT me I did not notice till you said something Now WHAT IS causing the loud howling with the new pads

fietsbob

Bike sing steel rims.. lower your expectations.. start braking earlier.



...

richart

Good old side pull caliper brakes and steel rims...I once rode a Schwinn Racer 3 speed up a telephone pole on a rainy day, but that's another story. Since I have not located any Weinman brake pads like we used back in the '70s, I have had the best success with inexpensive brake pads such as those marketed by Sunlite or Bell or the Dia-Compe gray pads. So many of the current rubber compounds that work great on aluminum rims work like crap on steel rims. The more 'grippy' the brake pad, the more tendency to squeal.

Also, have you taken your calipers apart, cleaned them, and reassembled with just a light touch of grease on the pivot, washers and calipers? When you adjust them, tighten incrementally to the point where they just begin to bind and then loosen about 1/16 to 1/8 turn until they just work freely but you don't want them too loose which will contribute to squealing. Make sure your cable is in good shape, no wear and properly lubed and it is not binding in the housing. Set for about 1/64" to 1/32" inch of toe-in to begin with. Take the bike out and ride and apply some heavy braking to seat everything in and to break in the new pads. Readjust the toe-in as needed.

stingray66

I have done all of this this problem is not a Squealing noise
And not a toe in problem this howling is way much worse I have chrome wheels
This howling driving me nuts as I just can not find what the cause starting to think there must be a special pad for steal rims

wschruba

You are experiencing stick-slip friction that is entering your hearing range (20-20,000 cycles per second)--it is the principal upon which all brakes work. The only way to solve the issue is to address the parts of the system you can change:

-The mass of the system (bike/brake caliper, etc...)
-Coefficient of friction (rim/brake shoes/toe-in)

It can be quite a rabbit hole to eliminate brake squealing, but the short answers are, in order of cheapest-to-most-expensive

1) toe in the brake shoes (sometimes .5mm, sometimes 2mm...),
2) experiment with pad compounds (softer usually squeals more),
3) replace the calipers (different model, not the same one),
4) replace the rim for an aluminum model (in your case).

Some shoes just plain squeal, until they toe themselves in to the point that they don't. By the way, since you probably do not have brake shoes with spherical washers on that, you'll have to physically bend the brake arms to toe them in. Tool manufacturers formerly made a tool for this that allowed you to do it with everything still installed on the bike. An example made by Park was the BT-3; old shops may still have one in their workshop, but otherwise, use a narrow jaw adjustable wrench.

If you are not already familiar with the procedure, you should familiarize yourself. It's possible to damage the caliper if done in ignorance. Start by reading up about your problem here.

*edit*

I should point out, that nobody recommends bending aluminum arms to cold-set toe-in. The tool mentioned above should really only be used on steel brakes (or by someone who really knows what they're doing). You are better off switching to a pad that has angular adjustment. Modern road pads may require some filing of the brake to accommodate the sleeve nut for the brake shoe, or you can use a "v-brake" pad, if on a budget/allergic to modifying things.

Vefer

Even though I LOVE Kool Stops and have then on ALL my bikes EXCEPT the Schwinn collegiate. The calipers only "look" like Dia-comps, but they are a poor copy, the metal is just a little thinner than real Dia-comps and the arms on the calipers flex and bend and cause a chatter which leads to the squeal. The Dia-comp Grey matter brake pads work pretty good on these calipers and chrome steel wheels. The Kool Stops are just too good and the calipers are to weak to hold them. Even with new calipers the Grey matter brake pads work better with the chrome rims.

dedhed

Clean the rim brake tracks with alcohol or brake cleaner if you have it.

stingray66

ok I going to give them a try and let you guys know how i make out where are you guys getting the Dia-comps I found them on Amazon BUT there were some bad reviews saying they were NOT real Did-comps with no angle and were cheap plastic

Vefer

I get them from Amazon, They are Cane Creek Grey Matter. The sides of your steel wheels aren't flat either, I take the new pads to the bench grinder, or a very rough file, you need to taper them top to bottom, the rim is wider at the top edge than it is closer to the spokes, also taper them front to back to get a little toe-in, the rear of the pad should be thinner than the front edge, it doesn't take a lot. Mine work fine after trimming them and no noise.

stingray66

Ok thanks I was hopping they were taper the old one were taper

Vefer

The original pads were also cut square, EVENTUALLY they would wear into the taper of the rim, but you had about 1/2 braking power for the 1st 100-200 miles until they wore in. Those Can Creek Grey pads are cheap enough, grind them to the right taper and you'll have brakes on your 1st ride.
If you want better brakes you'll need to swap to aluminum rims and the Kool Stops. But Varsities can handle a little funky after 20MPH or so, the fork gets a little wobbly. So at normal Varsity speeds Grey Matter pads are good enough - UNLESS you ride in the rain a lot, They are much better that the stock pads, but no were near Kool Stop Salmon

stingray66

ok just wanted to report that I found the problem it was NOT the brakes it was the wheel. The wheel look trued but there were high and low spots on the brake surface of the rim. What cause the howling was the pads vibrating when you used the brakes lightly What I did is use the fender brace as a guide. Took a tie rap and installed it to the brace and adjusted the end to were it just touched the rims brake surface.Then I turn the wheel and found the high and low spot and fine tuned the spokes. A 1/4 turn here and there I took a while but I managed to get the wheel to were it was trued and the brake surface seem straight bike was on the rack so I give the wheel a good spin and it seemed fine I then reinstalled the kool stop pads and took the bike out for a run. I now have good brakes and NO howling from the brakes.I always thought that if the wheel was NOT trued you whole see the wheel bounce around . Mine did not it look good but the brake surface was off. So my guess if the spokes are not all evenly adjusted it will cause the brake surface to get distorted . I know this does not make any sense but THATS how I fixed my problem