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Car runs red light => hits SUV => cyclist dies

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Car runs red light => hits SUV => cyclist dies

Old 08-13-19, 10:25 PM
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vol
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Car runs red light => hits SUV => cyclist dies

It seems none of the safety cautions that have been discussed here could have prevented this (safety-conscious) cyclist's death.

Just happened on Coney Island, NY: An 18 year old driver ran red light, hit a crossing SUV, causing it to spin and hit a cyclist waiting to cross the road. He got trapped underneath the SUV and died as a result.

https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york...xm4-story.html (it includes video footage of the incident)

The video is also on youtube:


Another footage from a different angle (the cyclist is not visible in this one):


Last edited by vol; 08-13-19 at 10:41 PM.
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Old 08-14-19, 05:46 AM
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Fortunately, I generally bike ride in a semi-rural county, and don't have any serious red light intersections to navigate, but when I'm driving in town, I routinely slow down, often positioning another vehicle on my blind side, anticipating some jerk-off running the light. It's getting close to how I used to drive when I lived in Mexico, where I'd drastically slow down at nearly every intersection even though I had the right of way, because of how common it was for other drivers to completely ignore stop signs.
So now, even here in the states, I slow down and have my head on a swivel when riding through most intersections in town. Sucks, but whatcha gonna do ?
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Old 08-14-19, 06:34 AM
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Life comes down to seconds at times. Had Mr. Alorriz approached the intersection more slowly, or if he decided to roll through the light himself, he would still be alive. I believe that intersections are the most dangerous road environments that we encounter while riding, walking, or driving. That's why many cities have implemented a leading walk signal for pedestrians. It's time to make the Idaho Stop more universal. The less time we spend waiting at an intersection, the safer we'll be.

RIP Mr. Alorriz. I'll think about you whenever I stop at a red light.

I had another thought about driver training. The video shows that Mr. Baig turns left slightly when he realized that he was likely to hit the other car. This action put him on a more direct collision path and ensured a worse outcome. Clearly a case of target fixation. Had he been trained to understand target fixation and turn in the opposite direction of the other car's travel path, this whole thing may have been avoided. OTOH, his training didn't help him understand traffic signals.
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Old 08-14-19, 06:42 AM
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Well that absolutely $%&%* sucks.
Although there might not be much in the way of criminal penalties, a civil trial will screw this driver forever. Any jury who sees the first video will certainly convict. Still that is no consolation.
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Old 08-14-19, 08:17 AM
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I bet if the occupant(s) if the blue Honda had died, it would be possible to lay criminal charges.
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Old 08-14-19, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost View Post
Life comes down to seconds at times. Had Mr. Alorriz approached the intersection more slowly, or if he decided to roll through the light himself, he would still be alive.
Had the blue Honda not been there and had Mr. Alorriz decided to roll through the red light, he would have been run over directly by the driver in the silver Charger.

The man standing at the corner had a close miss. In many cases, he may not have survived. I've seen a situation in which the smashed car was push up the corner of the sidewalk and into someones yard. Had a cyclist rolled through the light when that happened, he wouldn't have escaped it either.

Last edited by Daniel4; 08-14-19 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 08-14-19, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Daniel4 View Post
Had the blue Honda not been there and had Mr. Alorriz decided to roll through the red light, he would have been run over directly by the driver in the silver Charger.
How so? They were headed in completely opposite directions so Mr. Alorriz would not have been in the "line of fire". I think you may have meant that he could have been hit by the Honda which certainly could have happened if he stormed through the intersection without looking. The way I saw it in the video is that the Honda was well through the intersection when Mr. Alorriz arrived so (though it's all conjecture at this point) is that had he planned to cross through the red behind the Honda instead of slowing to a stop, he might have been far enough past the corner to squeak by. That pedestrian is probably praying his thanks.

I hate this game of what-ifs. This is such a tragedy. I showed the video to my wife - probably a mistake because she worries enough about me as it is.

I doubt that Mr. Baig intended to blow through the light. He was likely not sufficiently observant. I can guess that he was "victimized" by all of the available distractions of this modern age. If they discover that he was texting, that may tip things to the side of criminal charges. In any case, the justice system will punish only this one person here, which is not adequate to deter others.
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Old 08-14-19, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost View Post

I hate this game of what-ifs.
Then you shouldn't have suggested that if the cyclist rolled through, he would have survived as if his he was in someway responsible for his own death.

Last edited by Daniel4; 08-14-19 at 10:29 AM.
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Old 08-14-19, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Daniel4 View Post
Then you shouldn't have suggested that if the cyclist rolled through, he would have survived as if his he was in someway responsible for his own death.
Do you seriously feel that I am blaming the victim here? Whatever suggestions you've extrapolated from my comments are products of your own mind, mate.
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Old 08-14-19, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by vol View Post
It seems none of the safety cautions that have been discussed here could have prevented this (safety-conscious) cyclist's death
This was a preventable crash.

The speed limit on Coney Island Ave is 25 mph, one of the first (and last) arterials in NYC to be designated an “arterial safe zone” - five years ago.

The entire city shortly went 25 mph in November, 2014 - almost five years ago. Since the first “arterial safe zones” worked, and it was NUTS to have the speed limits on minor streets higher.

However, too many people in Brooklyn care way too much about parking spaces, so the battle front is still the Boulevard of Death. Coney Island Ave is awful, but other roads are wicked awful, so it’s not even on the list of streets to be redesigned! That road and those intersections remain untouched, people on foot and people on bikes continue to be frequently hurt and killed, for five long years.

And drivers keep driving at excessive speeds, because. For five long years.

As far as enforcement, the only good thing to say is the new policy is not to ticket people on bikes when one is killed, so THIS time the local “bike patrols” aren’t out. However, crickets about ticketing people driving motor vehicles on Coney Island Ave, let alone parking tickets for the double parkers.

So please stop saying that nothing can be done about such crashes.

Nothing WAS done. Maybe such horrific crash videos will change some minds?

-mr. bill

Last edited by mr_bill; 08-14-19 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 08-14-19, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by mr_bill View Post
This was a preventable crash.

So please stop saying that nothing can be done about such crashes.
By the safety cautions discussed here I meant obviously the safety measures adopted by cyclists, e.g. lights, helmets, mirrors, taking the lane, avoiding right hooks and left crosses, keeping distance from big trucks, etc.
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Old 08-14-19, 05:14 PM
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Obviously. So please stop saying nothing can be done....

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Old 08-14-19, 07:20 PM
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Many years ago I posted videos stills of a car in front of line at red light being hit by a car that was hit by a red light runner. I always line up with traffic vs. going to front of line and I noted at the time that this was another good reason to line up with other vehicles. Since then I have always lined up or if first in line stay back as far as reasonable and have witnessed several other similar accidents since.
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Old 08-14-19, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by vol View Post
e.g. lights, helmets, mirrors, taking the lane, avoiding right hooks and left crosses, keeping distance from big trucks, etc.
Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
Many years ago I posted videos stills of a car in front of line at red light being hit by a car that was hit by a red light runner. I always line up with traffic vs. going to front of line and I noted at the time that this was another good reason to line up with other vehicles. Since then I have always lined up or if first in line stay back as far as reasonable and have witnessed several other similar accidents since.
Thanks, good to know. I'll add this to the list of safety measures to keep in mind. So many unpredictable happenings could occur at an intersection (not to say they don't happen elsewhere--e.g. taxi getting on the curb).

What I find amazing is that in many driver caused fatal accidents the culprit driver survives.

Last edited by vol; 08-14-19 at 08:52 PM.
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Old 08-15-19, 06:23 AM
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Someone died due to another's negligence. I have no idea why they would not be prosecuted for that. I hope there is some recourse for the family in civil court.
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Old 08-15-19, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
Many years ago I posted videos stills of a car in front of line at red light being hit by a car that was hit by a red light runner. I always line up with traffic vs. going to front of line and I noted at the time that this was another good reason to line up with other vehicles. Since then I have always lined up or if first in line stay back as far as reasonable and have witnessed several other similar accidents since.
When arriving at red lights, my practice is to hang back and let traffic filter ahead, as I wait for the light to change. And if I have to stop, I stop about 10 feet short of the intersection and wait next to the curb. I've gotten endless criticism for this practice here, but had this been done in the video above, it probably would have saved the cyclist's life.

In the video, you can see a limit line, behind which, the car that took the video was sitting. Had the cyclist not advanced past that line, I think he would have been OK.

Last edited by Lemond1985; 08-15-19 at 06:42 AM.
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Old 08-15-19, 07:32 AM
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This is the collision I witnessed many years ago:
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Old 08-15-19, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by noisebeam View Post
Many years ago I posted videos stills of a car in front of line at red light being hit by a car that was hit by a red light runner. I always line up with traffic vs. going to front of line and I noted at the time that this was another good reason to line up with other vehicles. Since then I have always lined up or if first in line stay back as far as reasonable and have witnessed several other similar accidents since.
Agreed. Some intersections, the likelihood of a red light runner impacting me is minimal enough that I'll pull out to ensure the cars that are waiting see me. But probably more than half the intersections I ride through on my typical commute, I wait at the midpoint of the car that's at the front of the queue (where the driver can see me). Nothing can protect me in a really serious impact, but at least that's a few thousand lbs of metal between me an a potential incident.
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Old 08-15-19, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by TakingMyTime View Post
Someone died due to another's negligence. I have no idea why they would not be prosecuted for that. I hope there is some recourse for the family in civil court.
Lawyers used to take cases like that pro bono. Now they want four figure retainers and the rest on contingency. Not every family is prepared for that. As I understand it, in most states a driver is only criminally liable if they commit two traffic offenses at once. Again, as I understand it, the driver of the silver car ran the light but was not speeding; the driver of the blue Honda was speeding but did not run the light. Both drivers are only on the hook for the traffic statutes that they violated. That should change. IMO when there is a death, even a single violation of existing statutes should pull criminal penalties into play.
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Old 08-15-19, 03:54 PM
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The charger was speeding.
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Old 08-16-19, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted by 02Giant View Post
The charger was speeding.
And with all those orange cones it looked as if it may have been some sort of construction zone. That should count for something.
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Old 08-16-19, 10:41 AM
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The guy that shot the video just blows through a red light. What was he thinking?
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Old 08-16-19, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by San Rensho View Post
The guy that shot the video just blows through a red light. What was he thinking?
The 2nd video shows two black cars crossed the intersection soon after and the drivers got out to walk toward the accident spot, probably to help; one was probably the one that shot the video.
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Old 08-19-19, 09:27 PM
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Very unfortunate and tragic.
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Old 08-21-19, 11:19 AM
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The teenage driver who ran a red light in Brooklyn earlier this month and smashed into another car, which then struck and killed 52-year-old cyclist Jose Alzorriz, has been charged with eleven crimes, including manslaughter and criminally negligent homicide. Both of those charges are felonies.

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