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Technical trail riding - staring at my age?

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Technical trail riding - staring at my age?

Old 09-12-20, 08:30 PM
  #1  
jleeg
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Technical trail riding - staring at my age?

I’m 69 and riding 5 or 6 days a week on the road. A typical ride is 32 miles with almost 2 k of climbing that I cover in 18+ mph. I’ll do longer rides on weekends with a few others. I’d like to take to the trails here in PA when it’s too cold for the road (for some of you that day doesn’t come). I’m agile but am I waisting good money ($5k for the double suspension I desire) given age, approaching brittleness, mt biking life expectancy, etc? I could avoid yet another rabbit hole and just get on the gravel grinder and indoor trainer, but I think I’d love flying around the wooded trails with a buddy or two on winter days. 25 yrs ago I was an aggressive trail rider on a hard tail in winter. I parted company with the bike often enough even then.

While I don’t see posts here re mt biking in our more advanced years, I’m guessing some of you have insights and experience to share. I presume some might suggest compromising by spending less on a bike. Yes, that’s sensible but I’ve not compromised on gear and that expense would not be an indiscretion occupying my thought on that last fateful day. Besides, resale market is strong!

Thanks.
j
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Old 09-13-20, 07:04 AM
  #2  
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Depends on your definition of technical. I am your age and still riding trails, but compared to what I used to ride (was trail riding before I ever owned a road bike), I wouldn't consider them technical. I ride singletrack, with rocks, roots, stream crossings, but no crazy jumps or huge drops (still ride the "mild" ones). This on an outdated hardtail. You aren't far from York, and I used to enjoy riding at Rocky Ridge, Lake Redman/Williams, and the rail trails as well. PA has lots of rail-trails if you're just wanting to get off-road but unsure about trail riding. You might contact YAMBA (York Area Mtn.Bike Assn.), maybe someone has a loaner, or knows where you could rent a bike to try out some of the trails. They may offer to ride a few with you. Sure do miss riding off-road around that area!!
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Old 09-13-20, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by jleeg
I’m 69 and riding 5 or 6 days a week on the road. A typical ride is 32 miles with almost 2 k of climbing that I cover in 18+ mph. I’ll do longer rides on weekends with a few others. I’d like to take to the trails here in PA when it’s too cold for the road (for some of you that day doesn’t come). I’m agile but am I waisting good money ($5k for the double suspension I desire) given age, approaching brittleness, mt biking life expectancy, etc? I could avoid yet another rabbit hole and just get on the gravel grinder and indoor trainer, but I think I’d love flying around the wooded trails with a buddy or two on winter days. 25 yrs ago I was an aggressive trail rider on a hard tail in winter. I parted company with the bike often enough even then.

While I don’t see posts here re mt biking in our more advanced years, I’m guessing some of you have insights and experience to share. I presume some might suggest compromising by spending less on a bike. Yes, that’s sensible but I’ve not compromised on gear and that expense would not be an indiscretion occupying my thought on that last fateful day. Besides, resale market is strong!

Thanks.
j
Honestly, I would look for a used Trek Stache - should be able to get that for ~$1-2K easy. The front suspension and the big fat tires can really take the sting of the trail away but still rides great. Modern suspension bikes are designed to have the small stuff taken up by tires, which leaves the big stuff - jumps, drops, big rock gardens, for the suspension. At your age, I doubt you are doing table tops and 12 foot hucks. Sure there are tons of people ridding 160mm travel 29ers on trail that can be ridden on a cross bike, but they need them to look cool. At our age, we are already cool!
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Old 09-13-20, 07:39 AM
  #4  
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The advise I’m looking for, thanks gents. Think I’ll take the old hardtail to Redmond and a test run. That will reveal much, I’m sure.
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Old 09-13-20, 07:58 AM
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There’s a different skill set required to mt. bike, skills to descend, climb seated (keeps the R wheel planted), cornering, etc... all that takes time to acquire. You can crash more often while gaining those skills, and at our age, injuries take longer to heal. I no longer take risks or ride the more technical stuff locally as I’m tired of getting hurt. As well, my wife is also tired of my getting hurt !. I’m fortunate that there are a lot of local trails that are intermediate that I can ride and hammer when I feel like it.
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Old 09-13-20, 08:28 AM
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I'm 66 and I love trail riding in the mountains. I don't jump or try things that are out of my skill set. I will walk a bit before I risk falling. I went from a 100mm travel 26er to a 160 front 150 rear 27.5 cf bike and what a difference! The bike helps make up for my lack of ability and has saved me more than once. Sure, there are times I wish I had a lighter, more climb friendly bike but when descending ruts and rocks the bigger bike is great.

If you're not going to do anything rough I'm sure a hardtail will be fine. There are so many different types of bikes to choose from it can be overwhelming.
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Old 09-13-20, 09:46 AM
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Well, I'm in the same boat. I ride on the road just about every day but was looking to break things up a bit and decided it would be interesting to ride some of the local trails I ride by every day on my road bike. So the end of July I ordered a FS 29er but due to the COVID-19 mess it won't be in until the end of the year. There are several other riders I've seen out there in our age bracket so I figured what the hell. I intend to be like big john and not do anything beyond my skill set which at this point is pretty much zero as far as mountain biking. My #1 goal is to not hurt myself . The trails I will be riding are pretty tame compared to some of the craziness I see on YouTube which is fine by me. Looking forward to getting started and am gradually acquiring the needed accessories in preparation.
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Old 09-13-20, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe
Oh boy.

This is simply not true.
A bit of an over simplification sure, but for this purpose, fine. Most of the small trail chatter should be taken up by the tires - which is true now and was also true 10 years ago. At close to 70, I doubt the OP is riding rock gardens or the like.
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Old 09-13-20, 01:07 PM
  #9  
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Originally Posted by vespasianus
At close to 70, I doubt the OP is riding rock gardens or the like.
Huh, I wonder. I don't know the riding right around York specifically but everything I take my dirt bike (motorized) on in the same general vicinity has rocks everywhere. I've got a dirt bike riding buddy who may have crossed 80 years old now. He likes the gnarliest stuff available. He also mountain bikes.
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Old 09-13-20, 02:10 PM
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Keep talking....really enjoying your insights. Still in a quandary but will come out the other side.
j
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Old 09-13-20, 03:59 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe
Oh boy.

This is simply not true.
Of course it’s true. It is a simplification as stated, but think about all the rigid fat tired bikes that run 5 psi ?, they roll over stuff that you maybe wanted a FS for. Tires are really the first thing that absorbs hits, the suspension does the rest. Also the reason everybody has moved to tubeless, you can run much less air for greater comfort and control resulting. How much you need is a personal choice and terrain dependent.
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Old 09-13-20, 04:14 PM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by jleeg
Keep talking....really enjoying your insights. Still in a quandary but will come out the other side.
j
Despite the arguing here you have to decide what type of bike to get, if you are going to buy a new bike. Starting in about 2017 mtb design changed quite a bit. Slacker head tube angles, reduced fork offset (some bikes) and steeper seat tube angles along with changes in reach which varies from one builder to another.
27.5 or 29? Short or long travel? CF or aluminum? When I bought mine I looked at geometry charts until I got cross-eyed. I settled on a KHS partly because my friend is a dealer but the fit is good for me.

Now there are consumer direct bikes which offer some savings.
https://us.yt-industries.com/detail/.../sCategory/511
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Old 09-13-20, 04:29 PM
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I run 15 psi in the front and 17-20 out back. I still use tubes. They're 2.8 Maxxis Rekons.
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Old 09-13-20, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe
Much more than an oversimplification. It's simply not true.

Modern suspension is designed to take up the small trail chatter, much more so than in the past. Modern forks and shocks allow you to tune the air spring via varying amounts of HSC, LSC, rebound, and volume. Modern suspension systems like DW-Link, VPP, etc. have much more small bump compliance in their latest iterations and when compared to single pivot, four bar, or faux bar systems.
Originally Posted by HD3andMe
"Modern suspension bikes are designed to have the small stuff taken up by tires"

Nope, this is still false.

Claiming that modern bikes are not designed to have the small stuff taken up by tires shows a real lack of experience with any mountain bike. Suspension is designed to absorb and dampen (via compression circuits, rebound circuits, linkage design, leverage ratio, etc. ), that small stuff that gets beyond the tires. Simply dropping tire pressure can absorb some of the small stuff, but a bouncy tire doesn't manage those events to ensure that the wheel maintains contact and traction.

This is basic stuff.




The reason that "everybody" has moved to tubeless is to prevent punctures, especially snake bites. Because there is no risk of snake bites punctures, you can run lower pressures which means lower rolling resistance and more grip, up to a point.
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Old 09-13-20, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Marylander
Huh, I wonder. I don't know the riding right around York specifically but everything I take my dirt bike (motorized) on in the same general vicinity has rocks everywhere. I've got a dirt bike riding buddy who may have crossed 80 years old now. He likes the gnarliest stuff available. He also mountain bikes.
Yeah, if the place he is riding is really rocky with lots high speed tech stuff, I would say a FS would be good. But I got the feeling he was looking for a bike to hit some of the MTB trail in the winter when it was too cold to ride on the road.

But a bike like the Stache with those fat tires at 12 psi can give a really smooth and fast ride over most terrain. Rocks and such included. And it would be substantially cheaper than his 5K he is fearing.
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Old 09-14-20, 10:28 AM
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Edit. I just read you rode trails 25 years ago.

John

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Old 09-15-20, 12:25 AM
  #17  
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Sounds like you have the skills, so with a few more dabs, walking some bits, and rolling with the falls, you should be OK.

My mother just passed away at 91, but she took pretty regular tumbles while gardening her acreage until some months ago.

I'm 66, & may last spill on dirt was a few weeks ago. (minor raspberry)
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Old 09-15-20, 06:34 AM
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe

As the kids would say, "Do you even mountain bike, bro?"
Bro? Oh god.
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Old 09-15-20, 08:39 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by jleeg
I’m 69 and riding 5 or 6 days a week on the road. A typical ride is 32 miles with almost 2 k of climbing that I cover in 18+ mph. I’ll do longer rides on weekends with a few others. I’d like to take to the trails here in PA when it’s too cold for the road (for some of you that day doesn’t come). I’m agile but am I waisting good money ($5k for the double suspension I desire) given age, approaching brittleness, mt biking life expectancy, etc? I could avoid yet another rabbit hole and just get on the gravel grinder and indoor trainer, but I think I’d love flying around the wooded trails with a buddy or two on winter days. 25 yrs ago I was an aggressive trail rider on a hard tail in winter. I parted company with the bike often enough even then.

While I don’t see posts here re mt biking in our more advanced years, I’m guessing some of you have insights and experience to share. I presume some might suggest compromising by spending less on a bike. Yes, that’s sensible but I’ve not compromised on gear and that expense would not be an indiscretion occupying my thought on that last fateful day. Besides, resale market is strong!

Thanks.
j
I’m only 51 but I’m in PA too. Here’s my opinion. Your preferences may vary...

Two years ago I got a new Trek Marlin 7 hardtail 29er with the goal of riding it on local MUPs during the winter and the trails during the dryer/hotter summer months. I have no desire to risk my life on the windy suburban roads in my area but for the country roads upstate closer to Erie and eastern Ohio I like having beefier tires and straight bars to avoid aggressive rural drivers and be able to transition to gravel.

After two years of trying to ride trails earlier I will tell you that if you’re on anything but asphalt or fine gravel you’re better off with a fat tire bike. It’s just too muddy in the late winter/early spring months for an entry level XC bike like my Marlin. Best to wait until May IMO. Instead, I choose to enjoy the lighter traffic of the MUPs after the first frost and layer up.
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Old 11-22-20, 05:15 PM
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Now that I have some months and miles on my “new” mt bike, I can fill you in on my experience since initiating this thread. I bought a 2018 Specialized Epic FSR Expert. Seems like the name is too long to be right? It was not a particularly studied purchase but at 69 I gotta get going. I was once a rd bike snob when a custom or great Italian steel frame with fancy lugs and Campy components set one back about 1k. I still identify with my rd bike which I know is silly, on the other hand, my car is somewhat pedestrian, always dusty or muddy and loaded with stuff (bike stuff naturally). But I was so in the dark on modern mountain bikes and the tremendous changes since I last rode in the woods that I decided to jump in and not worry (and that might be my first advice...don’t worry, be happy). So, I read a little, asked questions and just got to it.

After talking to the mt bikers I know my first decision was full suspension, on the low side of travel. Good decision for these old bones! My friends were opinionated and all over the place, but my most articulate consultant had ridden off road since he was a kid and was most helpful. He even found my bike on pink bike. Remarkably, this was the only full suspension in a 100 miles and it turned out the seller lives on a road I frequently ride and with whom we had several biking friends in common. So on a road ride I stopped, rode the bike, agreed and picked it up after my ride.

Ok, “technical” covers a lot of ground. And I ain’t there! On my first ride I was too tentative and fell a lot and limped home cut and with a rib fix or bruise. Could still ride the road but was off the mt bike for a month. Looking down at that 29 inch wheel and steering between trees as far apart as the bars and all the other stuff made me feel like I’d not been on a bike! The hills are mostly ok but a full suspension doesn’t climb like a road bike or hard tail. I’m shocked how hard some inclines can be and the stretches of max exertion were eye opening. But a downhill sweeping trail can always bring a smile.

It has helped to watch video tutorials, and think about what I’m doing, and to dismount in the interest of preservation. I’m spending time on the less aggressive trails (plenty hard from my vantage) and am getting the feel. 15 miles is about as much a workout as my 50 mile hilly roads.

I still spend mor time on the road, but the trails are loads of fun, scenic, car-free, and warmer.

See you out there.

PS. I’m usually the oldest guy I see in the woods.
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Old 11-22-20, 05:25 PM
  #21  
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If you've got something better to spend your money on, or don't have the funds, then don't spend it on a bike. Otherwise, test ride some bikes get the one you like.

The only age that matters is not dead yet.
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Old 11-22-20, 06:50 PM
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I’m 67 and have been exclusively riding road bikes and a Peloton the past 5 years. About 18 months ago, I dusted off an old, barely used Gary Fisher mtb and started riding it on very, very easy trails. I went from that to green trails, and now do any blue and some black trails.

My intention is to keep riding for years. Riding is year round here in Central Florida and we have many excellent technical trails in city, county and state parks nearby. My son and I go weekly and in addition I ride road bikes 3 times a week as well.

At my age, I wouldn’t want a hardtail bike. Frankly, I’d love to have a new full suspension bike. But I already totally blew my bike budget this year on a road bike.

Meanwhile, I’m having a blast riding with my son and pushing myself to get better and faster. Sure, I biff. But on technical stuff, speeds are not that high and I haven’t had more than scrapes and bruises.

When age takes it’s inevitable toll, I’ll stop doing blacks trails and even blues. But I’ll keep riding.
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Old 11-22-20, 11:19 PM
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I've thought about it and been encouraged to by younger riders. I still ski fast Alpine. But trees are not snow. When I look at who's still doing it at my age, I see people who have not been injured. One of my little sayings is that one injury can ruin your whole season. I don't have a lot of them left.
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Old 11-23-20, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by jleeg
Now that I have some months and miles on my “new” mt bike, I can fill you in on my experience since initiating this thread. I bought a 2018 Specialized Epic FSR Expert. Seems like the name is too long to be right? It was not a particularly studied purchase but at 69 I gotta get going. I was once a rd bike snob when a custom or great Italian steel frame with fancy lugs and Campy components set one back about 1k. I still identify with my rd bike which I know is silly, on the other hand, my car is somewhat pedestrian, always dusty or muddy and loaded with stuff (bike stuff naturally). But I was so in the dark on modern mountain bikes and the tremendous changes since I last rode in the woods that I decided to jump in and not worry (and that might be my first advice...don’t worry, be happy). So, I read a little, asked questions and just got to it.

After talking to the mt bikers I know my first decision was full suspension, on the low side of travel. Good decision for these old bones! My friends were opinionated and all over the place, but my most articulate consultant had ridden off road since he was a kid and was most helpful. He even found my bike on pink bike. Remarkably, this was the only full suspension in a 100 miles and it turned out the seller lives on a road I frequently ride and with whom we had several biking friends in common. So on a road ride I stopped, rode the bike, agreed and picked it up after my ride.

Ok, “technical” covers a lot of ground. And I ain’t there! On my first ride I was too tentative and fell a lot and limped home cut and with a rib fix or bruise. Could still ride the road but was off the mt bike for a month. Looking down at that 29 inch wheel and steering between trees as far apart as the bars and all the other stuff made me feel like I’d not been on a bike! The hills are mostly ok but a full suspension doesn’t climb like a road bike or hard tail. I’m shocked how hard some inclines can be and the stretches of max exertion were eye opening. But a downhill sweeping trail can always bring a smile.

It has helped to watch video tutorials, and think about what I’m doing, and to dismount in the interest of preservation. I’m spending time on the less aggressive trails (plenty hard from my vantage) and am getting the feel. 15 miles is about as much a workout as my 50 mile hilly roads.

I still spend mor time on the road, but the trails are loads of fun, scenic, car-free, and warmer.

See you out there.

PS. I’m usually the oldest guy I see in the woods.

Good for you going for it at your tender young age. Anyone taking on a new sport at 69 deserves a bow. As you have already experienced, mtn biking single track is a completely different discipline. You will gain so many new skills and learn techniques which seem very contrary to road biking. It’s counterintuitive to charge harder over and through obstacles (creeks) where on a road bike you wouldn’t dare. So it takes some unlearning and relearning. Lots of consistent practice helps in gaining skill and courage. If you ride in fear you probably won’t succeed so just keep at it and keep slowly pushing your comfort zone and you will get there. I took a year off and have been out twice in two weeks and boy do I feel rusty and more tentative. Last year I rode once a week the majority of the year and had decent skills after being at it since age 60. Next month 66. So it’s important to keep at it on a regular basis. Keep watching videos on descending, cornering, overcoming small obstacles and have fun.

I find road road biking more for fitness than fun, where mtn biking is just plain fun with exercise thrown in. Enjoy yourself!
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Old 11-23-20, 06:02 PM
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BCAC
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Originally Posted by HD3andMe
Well, that’s always good for a chuckle.
Yep.

A lot of folks think the same, for sure.

These are all within 20 miles of me.

A random video of each. I’m sure there are better, but kind of give you a view of what is around. These are all old phosphate mines that have been turned into parks or nature preserves, up to 6,000 acres.











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