RunningBulldog

Hi,

Assuming a I build or modify a frame in the next month or so, I will need to populate it with its associated components. I don't know what's good and what's not.

I know you can spend as much as you like on components, or as little as you like for crap.

I'm looking for suggestions for the sweet spot -- well functioning, durable, reliable, light weight components that are a really good bargain.

Assume a 10 speed cassette and dual chainrings in front. Everything else on the table.

thanks,

rebel1916

Campy Centaur from Ribble is hard to beat. But 105 or Rival would be perfectly fine too.

jimc101

What sort of bike are you talking about, road, MTB, time trial, CX (10 speed dual or double crank is common for all of these now), do you have any specific requirements, discs, hydraulics, electronics etc.

Saying you can spend as little as you like for crap, misses that budget components are perfect for many application, and not for others, in the same way that high end components are not necessary for certain applications.

Kimmo

Don't use Shimano; their 10s road systems index like crap. SRAM pulls the most cable; you hardly ever need to adjust it.

jimc101

Only if your a bad mechanic, and don't know how to set it up.

HillRider

Really? Then how have I been able to get several 10-speed Shimano road systems to shift perfectly? Magic?

wphamilton

RunningBulldog, that sweet spot tends to be subjective, in particularly what is light, or is a really good bargain. A rule of thumb we see around here a lot is "cheap, light, durable: pick two" but even that is a little subjective.

If you took a poll I'd bet that Shimano 105 comes in as the price/quality sweet spot and Tiagra or Sora level components as the least expensive having acceptable performance. If you want to look at it logically instead, find out what's equipped on entry-level road bikes on Bikes Direct and other sites - those components would be a sweet spot in price and reliability, minus typically one or two places where they cut corners to reduce cost or weight or both. Find out the weight of said components, compare against the weight of higher level components and decide if the price difference is worth it.

gilaasepeda

for me brifter 105, the rest tiagra component

Jed19

Yeah, I have had Shimano 10-Speed Ultegra on two bikes, and they both shift perfectly.

FBinNY 

Not counting the wheels where there's large differences in quality, often the best way to build up a frame is to buy a complete bike, with the same BB and headset system, and strip it for parts.

If you shop for a leftover, odd size or odd color bike from a motivated seller it'll be significantly less that the sum of the components, even if you throw away the frame. I've done this for people, then taken the frame and built it up with used or low/mid range parts as a B bike, so they end up with 2 bikes for what they expected to pay for one.

fietsbob

Having bought a frame and then building it up, you start well behind the better
combined price of a built in the assembly factory, and boxed for shipping, bike
to be un-packed and set-up .. at your LBS..


But Shimano leads the world in volume sales of the lowest cost components
used by bike assembling factories, for the many brands.


If the bottom line is the prime criteria go that way, want to spend a Lot More then
Campag and SRAM start to get into the Game.

The parts on a New $400 built bike work.

Spending over $400, retail, just for a few components not even a full group, is easy to do.

RunningBulldog

Hi,

I'm talking about a road bike, btw. This thread was relocated from the framebuilding forum so a little bit of context was lost.

Thanks for the input so far. Though I'm still not sure what to look for.

Maybe the inverse question is more easily answered. Is there a make of components I should avoid?

RubeRad

I can't imagine anything in 2x10 being crap. Are you sure you need 10 though? Options expand significantly and prices drop if you revert to 9sp. (for instance, here's how I built up my 9sp)

FB's idea of a whole bike is often a good one, especially from CL, but 10sp bikes are newer, more premium, and so won't be plentiful and cheap on CL. But 10sp parts can be found.

Another possibility, buy a 2x10sp bike from bikesdirect.com and sell the frame & any leftover components, but I just checked, and the cheapest I can see is already $800; maybe better off just buying a gruppo that way.

Barrettscv 

I'll use new Shimano 5600 series 105 if I'm building a modern bike. I'll seek out New-Old-Stock or lightly used Shimano 600 (Ultegra level) if I'm building a vintage bike with down-tube shifters.

rebel1916

Again, check Ribble.com for groups. Cheaper than buying a BD bike just for parts.

Kimmo

Oh? Kindly point out the obvious stuff I'm doing wrong, then: https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...spawn-of-Satan

I'm not saying they're all crap all the time; I'm saying out of any indexed system to date, they're the most fussy and least precise.

This has nothing to do with my skills as a mechanic; it's basic geometry. And anyone worth their salt can see it's poor engineering on Shimano's part: all these woes don't bother SRAM a bit.

I've been able to get several S10 bikes shifting fine myself. But sometimes despite ticking all the boxes, minor factors like normal cable friction and slightly sloppy derailer pulleys and so on conspire to make S10 a total PITA, basically requiring everything involved be replaced when it's worn less than you'd like.

It's a bloody shambles. Do you think it's any accident they revised their cable pull for 10s MTB stuff? You know, gear that would be installed on the odd frame that requires a full-length housing run?

S10 can't handle normal cable friction. S9 is not a whole lot better. Not such a problem with Campy; their 10s can be a little fussy but you can still get away with the most basic SS cable in a pinch. SRAM came late to the party so have the most appropriate actuation ratio for 10s, since they didn't have to worry about backwards-compatibility of derailers.

When it comes to the accuracy of an indexed system, cable pull per shift is everything. I say choose a robust design that doesn't stop working when it gets dirty or worn.

If you still don't get it, compare a couple of imaginary systems, one that pulls a mm of cable per shift, and one that pulls an inch. Go figure...

Kimmo

Buy a bike with most of the gear you want, strip it, build up your frame, sell whatever you don't want.

This is pretty much hands-down the cheapest way to go about it. Usually.

dsaul

For shifters and derailleurs - Microshift 10 speed can't be beat for price and function(I paid $300 for the Arsis shifters and front and rear derailleurs). I bought them cause they were cheap and the same weight as Dura Ace. After two seasons using them, I would buy them again because they shift reliably every time with very little maintenance. Throw away the cables that come with them and use Jagwire stainless.

Brakes - Tektro r580 and throw away the crap pads they come with and replace with Kool Stop salmon pads.

For other components, just shop around. SRAM Rival stuff works great if you don't care about a few extra grams. I lucked into an ebay deal on a used set of Force cranks or I would be using Rival.

gilaasepeda

i use 105 brifter and rest is tiagra work smoothly

Kimmo

You can skimp on brakes and cranks; not a whole lot of functional difference between half-decent stuff and you-beaut gear.

AFAIK they're Shimano-compatible, so my S10 diss applies despite your experience. Many folks might never have trouble, but such silly cable pull is simply marginal.

If I say it sucks, that means I'm either too incompetent to have a clue, or that it's inherently dodgy and waiting for an excuse to perform below par. Or maybe also that many folks have quite low standards.

You decide.

dsaul

Microshift are Shimano compatible, but don't run the shifter cable under the bar tape. IMO the extra friction from the sharp bend at the shifter to run under the tape is the biggest problem with Shimano shifting. YMMV

TallRider

@Kimmo, this may have been covered in the other thread (spawn of satan), but do the *relative* problems in Shimano's shifting being more finicky crop up prior to under-the-bar-tape cable routing?

gsa103

Perhaps you should describe the build goals a little bit, then we can provide a better recommendation. What are your goals?

If you're trying to hit a tight budget Tiagra 10-speed is probably the way to go. Building up a new custom frame that cost you several grand, I'd probably go at least Ultegra.

I wouldn't recommend going to 9-speed, the component coverage for 10-speed stuff is currently much better. The other option to consider is a hybrid MTB gearing + road shifters if you want really low gearing.

wrk101

+1,000,000 Used donor bike. Strip it down, use the parts, and then sell the frameset if it is something decent. None of my STI bikes have been built with new parts. And don't get hung up on 10 speed. For the right deal, 8 speed or above can be pretty nice. I have multiple 8 speed DA and Ultegra/600 bikes.

RubeRad

And don't forget the rule of thumb; as you ascend the Shimano hierarchy, functionality and durability peak at 105. Beyond that (as I've heard) you don't get any better performance, you just get lighter, which means less durable. And maybe prettier.