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Old 11-01-16, 05:10 AM
  #1  
osco53
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My First Plus bike, or Mid fat

I don't yet know the new slang for these bikes but I am so glad I tested them out.
Two full suspension models and this one and only HT mid fat/plus bike,, what ever.
Don't count a parking lot ride as a test ride, these bikes can only show you the magic on the trails.

To the newer riders reading this, this 'Geometry' stuff will make a big difference. Do more than read It, Understand it. before you buy a bike, any bike.
Don't look at the bikes that were quickly made with boost to get them out there, the Slacker Geo of this model really counts. Pay attention to Geometry !!!!
The bike below has a head tube angle of 66.5.. If you look many are still at old school HT numbers,,69-70 degrees.
Consider this carefully.
This Scale Is stable at fast speeds and turns very tight at slow speed but still climbs great. I think the GEO is a major factor.
One of the main reasons I became a Scott fan Is they seem to put more Into their frames.. as we all should know components are components,,they can be changed out. So focus on the frame more on any bike you choose.

I've been wanting to get back on a Hard Tail for some time now. I figure I am stronger and more agile and can get more out of a leaner hard tail. I will keep my full squish Scott Spark, got It all hopped up, tuned to my liking. This 2017 Scott Scale 720 Plus bike just came In at one of my Local bike shops, well, It's In my house now. Still adjusting the bike, still moving my XT pedals from one bike to the other, got my Carbon handle bars on now.
The tires are only 800 grams, still the tubes gotta go, I Bet two of these mid fat tubes weigh as much or MORE than THREE regular 27.5 tubes but so far the added wheel mass does not cause the bike to feel sluggish or slow. Acceleration Is good.
In all fairness It's a 2 x 10 system and I think this helps me deal with the obviously greater tire wheel mass compared to my 1 x 11 full suspension bike with It being tubeless and rolling on sub 700 gram tires. Also being a hard tail The bike Is snappier on take off without the power robbing rear end of a soft tail.
As soon as I find tubeless valves I like the tubes will be gone. I predict this will be a game changer.
The plushness of the fatter tires at lower pressures so far seems to take much of the Hard Tail harshness away.

The three things that made me pull the trigger suddenly and Specific to the 2017 model..
1: A dropper post that works great.
2: Maxxis Recon tires,
3: Rockshox Recon fork,, a definite upgrade from last years Suntour..
The wider stance of the 110 front axle make this fork feel like a beefier model.

This thing handles really well,
Likes to be leaned way way over In loose corners.
Likes to be hammered on going up steep punchy climbs.
Likes to be pointed down a hill and 'released'~~~~

I've got lots of sand, It's better In sand, but deep sand is still deep sand and this Is not a true fat bike.

My Scott Spark 760 27.5 full suspension weighs 28.9 pounds with a relatively heavy saddle pedals and all.

This Scale 720 Plus bike out of the box was 28.3,,NO pedals. This Is WITH a dropper post that is 1.3 pounds.
When I loose the tubes and sooner or later It will be a 1 x 11 I bet I finish up at 27 pounds.

Last edited by osco53; 11-29-16 at 06:33 AM.
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Old 11-05-16, 06:22 AM
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Going out for a real first ride, Am not counting the neighbor hood ride, got everything In order now.
****Tubeless****,
Dork ring behind the cassette Is gone, The thing rang the spokes when I hit a bump,, all quiet now.
Carbon handlebar Is on, Forearm and finger comfort restored.
Cockpit adjusted, brake lever reach, Inboard position and angles all set.
XT mountain pedals on and ready for adjustments,
Got all that sticky sand magnet factory grease off the chain, I swear people, If you run a bike with that stuff your drive train will wear out really soon. Get It all off before the first ride.
We shall see~

Last edited by osco53; 11-05-16 at 06:30 AM.
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Old 11-05-16, 10:08 AM
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Bradleykd
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Nice rig.


I have not ridden a + bike yet. I really dislike fat bikes because, when you lean them over, you have to fight the front wheel from turning. Does the mid-fat do this, but to a lesser degree, or does the slacker headtube angle make it stable enough that it doesn't happen?


I always hear people praising the + bikes for beginner riders. From what I hear, they will slow down a professional because of added rolling resistance and weight, but for the beginner, they have no effect on speed, but handle way more comfortably. I guess this plays into that slacker HT angle keeping the wheel from wanting to flop on you.


Welcome back to the hardtail world! I ride some pretty gnarly logs, rocks, and roots, and I prefer the hardtail to the full suspension. Sometimes on long rough rides, when I start sitting down more, I wish I had it, but I feel so much more control over the back wheel with a hardtail.
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Old 11-07-16, 10:32 AM
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I rode a Cannodale Bad Habit 27.5+ last weekend, totally surprised how well it handled compared to full fat bikes. It felt almost as nimble as my regular 27.5 bike.

Nice looking ride, enjoy.
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Old 11-08-16, 05:02 AM
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From Bradleykd

I have not ridden a + bike yet. I really dislike fat bikes because, when you lean them over, you have to fight the front wheel from turning. Does the mid-fat do this, but to a lesser degree, or does the slacker headtube angle make it stable enough that it doesn't happen?

I too rode several full fat bikes, leaning them over without that fight you speak of or at least minimizing It took great care In Tire pressure decisions. But the problem was my changing trail conditions, Stopping before sandy blown out corners to change psi then stopping again to change it for down hill runs,,not practical.
My Biggest dislike was when I'd pick up speed fast down a drop,, those full fat tires really did start bouncing like a basket ball. The back end spent very little time on the ground, not my cup of tea.

And the gyro effect of that much mass made it very hard no matter how wide the handlebars were, made it very hard to change the direction of that massive gyroscope wheel.

My new bike did none of this, slacker geo ? maybe I don't know.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I always hear people praising the + bikes for beginner riders. From what I hear, they will slow down a professional because of added rolling resistance and weight, but for the beginner, they have no effect on speed, but handle way more comfortably. I guess this plays into that slacker HT angle keeping the wheel from wanting to flop on you.

I am no pro but they did not slow me down they let me, let loose, as I stated I got personal records on my first ride in places I had stopped getting them for months per Strava.
Wheel flop, never noticed any bad handling traits, as often Is the case as soon as I learned to lean the bike over more to let the bike go It,,, wen't. As often discovered a bike does better when the rider learns not to get In the way , follow me ?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Welcome back to the hardtail world! I ride some pretty gnarly logs, rocks, and roots, and I prefer the hardtail to the full suspension. Sometimes on long rough rides, when I start sitting down more, I wish I had it, but I feel so much more control over the back wheel with a hardtail.

Bingo ! I agree, that's what I missed most from my first hard tail.....

The only Hard Tail plus bike I just got to ride with a steeper head tube was a Specialized Fuse, a lower spec'd bike at about $1300 The head tube angle was only I think 1 degree steeper, the ride should have been similar but It was not.
I did not like the feel at all, too planted, too much tire, Steering was too light for my taste and It had 3.0" wide tires plus the rims looked narrower, I did not measure them. The bike felt way too tall, didn't like being perched up there.
The bike was twitchy but It could have simply been too much air in the tires, and I know for a fact that Is a performance robber on plus bikes.

I suspect that bike set up with a better fork and time to make it fit me and 2.8" wide tires with a bit wider rims,
I bet after all this The Fuse would be close to mine In feel, a single degree of head tube angle should not be that big of a deal but a second degree as on other makers plus bikes IMO would be bad.

It's been said and I agree 110% that tire pressure and fork set up Is critical with these plus bikes,

First time I took mine for a quick spin with tubes and 20 psi the ride was crappy but I knew why and was sure of how to correct it.
Tubed and down to 16 ish psi the bike was sluggish still. The tires fighting the tube Inside, this effect Is amplified because these plus tires have very tall sidewalls.

Tubes are like brake drag against the tire sidewall fighting the tire on every flex over every bump and lean angle.
I believe this has a greater negative effect on handling far more than does tube weight.

Once the tubes were gone the bike was transformed Into IMO a fast smooth trail bike....

Last edited by osco53; 11-08-16 at 05:28 AM.
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Old 11-10-16, 08:05 AM
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I have a 3 yr old 29er that I really like. I test rode a 27.5+ the other day.
I thought it was nice but wish I had some trail time on it.
I am seriously thinking about getting a 2017 Cannondale Cujo 2.
I'll put my 29er up for sale and if it sells buy the Cannondale.
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Old 11-12-16, 06:04 AM
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10-4 On the Cujo plus bike,,,, and the bonus,,

We can set up a 29 x 2.3 wheels set and run that If the need arises :~
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