TMassimo

not sure if is sarcasm, but it's true... ask any salesman for advice any you're very likely to be ripped off.

indyfabz

And yet you tried on something before buying it. How did you do that over the Internets?

badger1

That's easy; follow the advice often given on Bike Forums about buying a bike online.

Go into an LBS that carries the brand one wants. Ask for advice, try stuff on, take up the shop's time, work out your sizing and then leave without buying anything and order the goods online. Done.

indyfabz

That's mean. It's also akin to the "free rider" problem, a term used in antitrust law to justify refusal to deal, etc.

TMassimo

easy. buy two (one large, one medium). Try them on at your leisure in the comfort of your home... return one. Some shops will even pay for the return shipping.

I was actually ordering them online. Then, at check out where I have to choose which shop I want to go to pick them up from, on this very rare occasion they had it in store. So, I went directly to the store, tried them on for 5 minutes and chose the large. Then, at home I tried it again and felt it maybe was too big. So, I went back to the store, tried them again, and chose the medium. See where I'm going with this?

Let's accept Internet shopping wins hands down.

TimothyH

This is what I do.

I just purchased two Arc'teryx running tops online from REI and returned the one which didn't fit to the local store.

Purchased two different sized Sidi shoes from Performance, had them shipped to the local store. I went down to the local store, took delivery, tried them on in the store and returned the one which didn't fit right there on the spot.

It ties up some of my cash while the product is in transit and before the return hits my credit card but that's how the game is played nowadays.

Going to a small, locally owned shop to waste the owner's time with the intent of walking out and buying online is very distasteful. I'm less idealistic about doing this at a corporate store like REI or Performance but my conscience would bother me if I did this to a local business owner.


-Tim-

indyfabz

Not for everyone for all things. Take, for example, my super fly custom ti job. There is no other bike exactly like it. In fact, that color of ceramic glaze was custom blended just for me.(Cue the hatas!)


And I really hate buying apparel on line. Let's say I want a new pair of cycling shoes or hiking boots. I want to feel how different makes, models and sizes feel on my feel without having to order multiple pairs, hoping I get one that I like and then going through the process of returning the others, if not all of them. If the latter, I have to start over again. Talk about inefficient. It's also wasteful in terms of resources.

nycphotography

I love the fit and performance of Hincapie kits. All our team kits have been Hincapie, and i pick up random items when I find them either closeout online, or at the warehouse sale at the fondo.

Our new kit was offered in both Velocity and Signature so I got both. Both are great, but I really wish I got 2 sets of signature because for the slight price difference it is way more supportive and less stretchy. Stuff in pockets stays put better because it is tight. Like it's supposed to be.

As long as I don't go gaining belly weight, it's perfect.

badger1

Thanks. Eating my lunch, just prepping to go off and lecture on phrase grammar, and you post a pic of your bike again.
Now I'm distracted by bike envy.
If ever a bicycle deserved the descriptor 'beautiful', yours would be a candidate.

ptempel

Thanks @pjr71 and @quicktrigger for the recommendation. $24 for a short is a steal. I may have to get one to try out. Searching a bit, I do see that Santic has a bib for not much more:

https://www.amazon.com/SANTIC-Mens-E...bib&th=1&psc=1

ptempel

I hatas that bike! Ahh just kidding. Was perusing the Engin website and was drooling over some of their work...

The Bicycles | Engin Cycles

Nice bike!



Cue the song "Oh Yeah!" from Yello. Being nit picky but I would prolly remove the rim stickers from the Alpha 340 rims.

quicktrigger

FWIW, I have a mix of both brand name, and direct from China biking clothes. One of the issues I run into is that LBS almost never have my size. They can claim they have my size, but it does not fit well if they do. Just the same I have bought from LBS, and in fact went looking for baggy mountain bike shorts WITH zipper pockets this past weekend. I wanted to compare. Guess what..... 5 shops and NOTHING!

As for knowing what size you need when buying online, read peoples review first about sizing and quality. That is exactly what I did, and I hit the right size the first time. Even so, it would have been one of two sizes, and at worst I would buy 2 at $25 for a total of $50, instead of $80 to $100 for ONE pair, and an additional $80-$100 every time after.

Otherwise, bike shoes I have bought one pair local (didn't have the size I needed but went up one size), and then two more pairs from clearance online. And bikes gloves, again a mix of direct from China and name brand, and frankly I prefer the chinese gloves that were $8/pair. I have two outer "shells" that were $28/ea that have been excellent. I also have 7-8 Jersey's but usually rather wear dry-fit shirts that I get for $12-$15/ea.

Point being, nearly all of it is made in China or similar, and the majority of the cost for the LBS are for people between you and the Chinese producer. All the people in between I owe NOTHING. Nothing against them, but I do not have unlimited funds, nor do I think a crappy plastic shell is worth $150 or more. Every dollar I don't spend feathering someone else's pocket is another dollar I have to use elsewhere. Some people love the "NAME", which means basically nothing to me. If that is you, doesn't matter to me. But don't try to guilt people into spending their cash because it doesn't fit your view.

EDIT: This is the cycling gloves on Amazon that I like.

https://https://www.amazon.com/QEPAE-...011&th=1&psc=1

indyfabz

Who tried to do that?

quicktrigger

Didn't say you did, but often there is a pervasive attitude that you are cheating the LBS if you don't buy everything from the LBS, and/or that XYZ is inferior etc. To sum up, an elitist attitude.

BTW, no hater here on your bike color. Great looking bike.

indyfabz

Those are the rims on my Engin. They were originally on my Independent Fabrication. Removing those horrible decals was a pre-condition to me purchasing them. And since I was riding 10 speed at the time, Drew gave me a 10 speed Chris King hub set he had in stock at cost. He's a great businessman, master craftsman and all around good guy.

indyfabz

I never suggested you said I did.


And hang around here enough and you will see that it cuts both ways, at least evenly, if not more on the side of "Anyone who buys from a shop because is a sucker because they rip you off, and you are a sucker if you use shop labor because LBS mechanics suck and overcharge you for their sucky work."

quicktrigger

Been here for over two years, and you certainly get it both ways. IMHO the elitism is much more vocal group. As stated, it doesn't matter to me. Spend your money where you like. And for those that would give me a disapproving attitude..... ooooh well. However, many people aren't self confident enough not to judge or care if others want to judge them.

ptempel

Sounds like he hooked you up well on the wheelset. On the website it says that Engin is not taking any new orders at this time. They must be doing well if they have that kind of demand.

ptempel

Heh. I'm unfortuantely one of these guys. Maybe if my LBS had the bib short for $100, I might have gone for it. But $150? I'm in single income land with a 4 year old. And baby needs a pair of shoes!

indyfabz

"They" is really only one person. Unless something has changed, he does all the frame building and finishing (he doesn't paint, but he does do any etching you want). He estimated he spent 65 hrs. on mine when he built it back in 2015. Not all of that was active time (e.g., 4 hr. hydroponic bath where the fame simply sits in a bath that removes impurities), but that's still a good number of hours. And that was before he was making his own dropouts with his recently acquired CNC mill. He also runs his own LBS and has a relatively young child.


I formally ordered my frame in Nov. of '14. I rode it home from the shop sometime in May of '15. Some of that time involved getting "test tubes" (I almost went with pink, but the test tube looked too much like bubble gum) from Paint By Todd and twice shipping it out to his shop in central PA for the actual ceramic coating. The first time it came back looking not quite right. It was sent back for the addition of black pinstripes where the ceramic coating meets the bare titanium. That made a huge difference the difference and demonstrates his commitment to perfection. Frankly, I don't know when the guy sleeps.

sumgy

My own: