scooterfrog

please pick apart the concepts in the post

I currently have my eye on 2 flat bar road bikes from bikes direct. (i know they make their bikes themselves and the brands are just brands and there is some risk in buying from them.) I don't want a suspension fork.
The avenue fb 299 https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/.../avenue_fb.htm
the galaxy tour. 349 https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...alaxy_tour.htm
they both seem like a hell of a lot of bike for the money, but i want to have a "plan" to cover for what i see as potential.

They are very similar. Different frames and forks but same components
The galaxy has a carbon fork but the frame doesn't look as nice.
the avenue the frame is the same frame they use up their entire range.
50 buck seems like a good premium for a carbon fork. thoughts.

second as these are mostly road bikes i think the gearing may be a bit too road for me. (and that may be just for now as I get stronger it may not matter)
they both have the same gearing sunrace 12-25 8speed sora in the back and 52/42/30T in the front.
there is an sunrace 11-32 on amazon for $15.
https://www.amazon.com/SunRace-CSM66-Bicycle-Cassette-11-32/dp/B002G3BMJM/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_nC?ie=UTF8&colid=3NRRNL2AJ4PAS&coliid=I326DAJDNR92AS

Should I be looking at Shimano hyperglide to go with the sora 11-30 (this might be best) 0r 11-32(similar to above) or 11-34 (assume I wont use a small front small back or a big front big back))
https://www.amazon.com/Shimano-CS-HG4...glide+cassette

i think that would move the gearing to make it more wide. I am not sure I would ever use a 52-11, but being able to go down to 30-32 should be Plenty low enough.

Does that makes sense or would I be better off changing the chain rings in front 52/42/30T if so what (i can't tell if it's a compact crank or not so I can't figure out what to get. the front dr is clamp on so I can move it down a bit if i need to. 48/38/28T? educate me

third the tires are only 28c that's pretty narrow 1 1/4 ish these bikes have caliper brakes so I have an email out to them to see what will fit but I think a 32? or 35? might be better (more compliant). I also will need new tubes probably so this is a) a more expensive change than $15 but it may make a bigger difference.

the above options seem like better options than buying a new touring bike and converting to a flat bar. which means bar, shifters and brakes

looking for a used bike doesn't seem economical to me. any hard tail mtb i fins will need tires and a new fork at least and I probably wont get 700c wheels. any road bike i find will need a flat bar conversion also not particularly cheap. If I find a steal i might buy it but I haven't seen one yet.

bjjoondo 

You need to ask if the Sora derailluer will handle a 32 or 34 tooth cog, I think a Sora max's out at 27 and could possibly handle a 30 tooth cog but no more. Tire wise, I use 32's on my everyday/utility bike and 28's on my weekend/road bike, my 32's have a bit of raised tread (not knobbies) and my 28's are semi-slick road tires. Unless your doing loose dirt a lot, I'd go no wider than 32's, they handle a hard packed dirt trail fine but don't "suck" to the asphalt like 35's did, (jmho, ymmv).

giantcfr1

Are you sure you really want these bikes? You seem to want to make lots of changes right off the bat.

I had a look at those two bikes as attached and in my opinion they have very basic componants which are not worth spending any money on. How about you use the extra money you were thinking about spending on upgrading / changing, to put towards a decent bike that you don't have to swap parts on so quickly?

There are so many better hybrid bikes out there that would probably suit you, instead of the road bikes you linked to, and the conversion of a touring bike you mentioned.

PatrickGSR94

What about the Motobecane Cafe Latte for $399? https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...fe_latte_x.htm

It says you can get it with a 11-32 cassette, though you may get one with a 12-26. Not sure why it says "no choice".

scooterfrog

you answered my tire question.
on the sheldon brown site it says that most rdr as specked conservatively to handle user mistakes like using the small front and small back and vice versa) but its worth considering.

scooterfrog

it says no choice be cause you get what you get which is based upon the current supplier deals to the manufacturer.

that bike isn't much different from the avenue (or the galaxy except of for the carbon fork)
but it will definitely have lower gearing. it has cantilever brakes so large tire clearance isn't a problem. it was on my list

But i could buy the avenue and change the cassette and be out lets say 320 instead of 400. or the galaxy and have a carbon fork for 370.

scooterfrog

links please.
lets say sora or equivalent mtb set, carbon fork, al frame, flat bar, no suspension with the equivalent of 1.07:1 for a low range (30:28) and 4.3:1 (52:12) for a high for less than 370. (that would be the galaxy with a new cassette)

tires with new tubes might add another 60 but I am not sure I need either of these things

I am really not sure I can do better than that.

also i am not sure I want to make these changes, but I want to understand what I might have to do. I am sure i can grow into the cassette, but for $15 i may not want to.

jamis allegro sport 580 Shimano Acera
Jamis coda sport (steel) 560 Shimano Acera
the allegro x looks too mountaininy for me 38c and its listed as 5lbs heavier than the allegro. I assume they list wiehgts so I can compare within the brand I know it varied by size.

i think Acera is similar to sora these both have better (lower for now) gearing and 32 c tires

scooterfrog

bikes direct says both bikes can take a 700x30c tire i have trouble believing they could fit a 30 but not a 32. A quick google shows this is a cyclocross size (knobies)
so I need to figure out if that is a deal breaker. but the kendra quick is $15 on amazon and I could use the same tubes. so it would be $30 more for those tires. lots of 32s for low prices easy to test.

scooterfrog

its funny if I said I found a used bike for 350 that was perfect except i thought hte gearing was too high would everyone be suggesting what I initially suggested. (change the cassette or the front rings)

bjjoondo 

Think of the Allegro as a "flat bar road bike", the Allegro X as a "Dual Sport", different missions, the X set up makes it more, DIRT worthy!! Take all weight listings with a "grain of salt" as usually they are set at a certain rider weight and frame size, which might not work with the particular unit you NEED, jmho. Acera is a decent mtb/hybrid derailer, just under Alivio and the Acera is very popular in Europe, where the Alivio seems more popular in the USA. (Acera isn't listed with the MTB/Hybrid derailleurs on the Shimano USA site, FYI.)

I own both a Coda Sport and a Allegro 1, which is a 2011 Allegro Sport basicly, the Allegro 1 I use for my "club/road" hybrid with it's Alum. Frame/cro-mo fork, the Coda Sport I use as my everyday/utility/trailer tugger, (I don't own a car!). Think of the Coda as a BMW 7 Series Coupe and the Allegro as a BMW ZX-4 Roadster, (LOL, yes I Like BMW cars! ) Hope this info. helps.

Bill Kapaun

I'm a bit suspect if the Sun Race cassette isn't really a free wheel

giantcfr1

A compact crankset is a double not a triple.
eg. https://www.performancebike.com/bikes...551_1111800_-1

How about looking at this Hybrid. A little more expensive but may be closer to what you're after...

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-us/....2/8910/48614/

scooterfrog

huh... I thought compact was defined by the bcd. regardless swapping the cassette is a better option.

That looks great.

I have a feeling this is going to come down to what tier I can run. changing the gearing is relatively easy. but if the gravity above can only go to 30c (and going there will cost me on the order of $50 + the gearing change at 15- 25 (I need a freewheel tool) i end up at $375. we are within kissing distance. of that giant.

scooterfrog

I am not interested in the allegro X. as with the weight i was only using it compare the 2 models. thinking jamis would take 2 "medium' frames and compare them. its not an absolute. i figured it was the difference an aluminum frma might make over the steel

the allegro sport looks about right. its 'less road' (gearing and tire) then what I highlighted above but i think its closer to what I want.

scooterfrog

why? the one i linked to says cassette and it's the same 'family' as the one on the bike. they do have a freewheel on amazon tat is similar so I may have gotten it wrong.

scooterfrog

ok I am beginning to get it. there are basically 2 types of hybrids I am looking at. I am simplifying here. both have flat bars.

roadbikes that have evolved towards mtbikes like I initlay posted (and lots of others I have seen) these are basically road bikes (with caliper brakes and gearing, skinny tires ans sora or tiagra ot 105 components)

and mountain bikes that have evolved toward road bikes (fitnes sbikes?) the acera or alivio,or deore lower gearing cantelever brakes wider tires and many have suspension forks

there is also frame geometry etc.

quite simply i need to decide which i want. cost wise the bike i posted are cheap, but I am worried i may not like them, but I will probably grow into them. for more money i can get something i like today (anything wil lbe better thatn my 42lb craptastic full suspension bike) but I may need to replace as I get stronger but may not. (or add to my collection) to get a real road bike

scooterfrog

i need to be cheap which is where i started.
this not a flat bar road bike, but the other kind.
diamond back insight2
https://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...27_-1___202398

comments on quality?

scooterfrog

I work from home so I can post a lot with out the boss man over my shoulder.
sometimes I feel like I am talking to myself. but it helps to type it out.
at lunch I went and rode a trek 7.1 20 inch for 429. 20 minute ride a bit of hill etc. I like the shop as well so I bought a water bottle for their time.

musings. way faster that n my craptastic. gearing was too low. same as craptastic. really 28 front 34 rear on a bike that light. i could barely pedal fast enough to not fall over. (this is the same as craptastic by the way). when I mentioned it to the guy at the shop he told me all of this type of bike is geared that way (he called it mega range) and he told me not to worry he could change out the cassette for $25.

he then tried to steer me to the road bikes and said something about a flat bar conversion. (shorter stem, flat bars, new shifters and brake levers. now this was a considerable up sell in cost but I never gave him a budget, but it kind of puts me back where i started in post 1. except .... I am no longer concerned about the gearing

bjjoondo 

Ok except for the POS Shimano M-131 Crankset, the chainwheels are Pinned together, can't replace them seprately, jmho.

bjjoondo 

28/34 is for UPHILL, long grades uphill or loaded touring, FYI.

Bunnicula

Have you looked for used on CL? I see plenty of hybrids in my area, people trading up to road bikes quite often. Would certainly be cheaper, could prolly find a higher level FX than a 7.2, which will be more roadish, and the Specialized Sirrus is also very road-like. I'd be looking to get carbon forks. Besides absorbing vibration, bike is lighter and easier on climbs. Fuji also makes nice bikes at a cheaper price point.

Really? Why?

scooterfrog

Because I need to be going about 4 mph to not wobble. I could not spin fast enough. I think I would fall over loaded or not. Uphill or down. maybe I just need to spin much much much faster. How slow can you go before you wobble. Maye it's just me

And yes I have looked on c l I am not finding any thing great on the North side of Boston. Any thing cheap is either old and in need of some tlc, that I must budget for, or of unknown quality. How good is an old nishiki. ?

Bunnicula

So now you lost me. You cannot get to 4 mph on a Trek 7.0? Yes, put the bike in a different gear and get some peddling going on. Even this bike is much lighter than your old bike. You should be able to do 12mph and upwards, no problem.

PatrickGSR94

He's saying 28/34 is useless to him because he can't spin fast enough to keep the bike upright in that gear. I guess he wants all gears to be useful to him.

I dunno, I can go about 2.5 mph in a low gear and stay upright on my bike. Maybe a small bit of weaving, but still upright.

My lowest gear I think is 26/28, and I used it recently going up a steep grassy hill while hauling my son in his trailer behind me. I managed to stay upright and not have to put my feet on the ground. Just had to stay far forward over the bars to keep my front wheel from lifting up.

scooterfrog

Maybe 4 m p h Is an exaggeration, but you get my point. The gear seemed useless.