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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

clubman 04-21-16 08:10 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 18705945)
All the other Raleigh made brands used plain Endrick rims. Only the Raleigh badged bikes got the Raleigh pattern...snip..I wouldn't think of swapping them out for alloys. I think they add a lot to the bike. I'm a sucker for tradition.

Agree with keeping them. A little correction, Raleighs premium rebrands occasionally came with Westricks. I've got a 53 Rudge and a 55 Humber that both had them. They also had that "flat" finish on the raised centre. Maybe for paint but I rarely see paint on them.

bmthom.gis 04-21-16 08:26 AM


Originally Posted by peppep (Post 18705772)
@bmthom.gis, nice! Have you posted pics of yours? Sounds great. Your starting out steps are what I'm doing: cleaning, cables, tires and tubes, and cleaning/greasing the rotational systems. Looking for a cheaper saddle that will match the look well enough. The idea of putting on alloy wheels is really tempting (and a good excuse to learn to build wheels)! I'm going to wait until the rest is done and see how I like riding it. If I enjoy it enough to keep it and ride it often, then the wheel upgrade really sounds worth it, if only to avoid getting caught in the rain with steel rims. Budgets reset after some time, right? :lol:

Not sure how all-out I'll go patina-wise; I don't mind it showing its age, but I also like the idea of shining it up and the peace of mind of not having big rusty spots. If I do end up selling it, I think clean and rust-free will affect the price I can get. But not gonna lie, I'm hoping to keep it!

Tire-wise, I was going to order some Schwalbe Delta Cruisers (black with gumwalls), but I just called my favorite LBS and they stock Kenda k40s. I like to support them; reading up on those tires now.

I have indeed, but I'll post again. My tires are cheap Kendas, but they work. When they die, I'll spring for some Col de la Vies. As for the wheels, ride quality definitely improved. Also, I prefer having a double wall over a single wall and for the rims to have hooks. It wasn't hard...I ziptied the old and new together, started at the valve hole and did every other spoke (so, one side at a time). Brakign is improved...if I got better quality pads it might even skid, but it doesn't...however I think the next thign I would do is get calipers that don't have as much flex. No real braking problems, though. Haven't used it in the wet quite yet.
Shortly before the wheel rebuild
http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psogro1vjv.jpg

http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...ps3gwkxhpj.jpg

First iteration, before the saddle swap
http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psl4el2c95.jpg

"as found" - after some scrubbing
http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psdahz39wt.jpg

http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psadpdjrhq.jpg

New rims...rear got these green nipples. If anyone ever does steal it, it will be easy to identify
http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psiwsdwwdd.jpg

Gratuitous catalog
http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psosjijh7q.jpg

jmeb 04-21-16 08:37 AM

This beautiful rebuild just popped up on my local CL for $325. 1959 Hercules, rebuilt wheels with alloy rims, front shimano dynamo, brooks saddle. Wish it was my size.

http://images.craigslist.org/00F0F_1...UZ_600x450.jpg

1959 Hercules/Birmingham cruiser - sweet rebuild!

DQRider 04-21-16 08:58 AM


Originally Posted by bmthom.gis (Post 18707241)
I have indeed, but I'll post again. My tires are cheap Kendas, but they work. When they die, I'll spring for some Col de la Vies. As for the wheels, ride quality definitely improved. Also, I prefer having a double wall over a single wall and for the rims to have hooks. It wasn't hard...I ziptied the old and new together, started at the valve hole and did every other spoke (so, one side at a time). Brakign is improved...if I got better quality pads it might even skid, but it doesn't...however I think the next thign I would do is get calipers that don't have as much flex. No real braking problems, though. Haven't used it in the wet quite yet.
Shortly before the wheel rebuild
http://i1372.photobucket.com/albums/...psogro1vjv.jpg

First iteration, before the saddle swap
"as found" - after some scrubbing
New rims...rear got these green nipples. If anyone ever does steal it, it will be easy to identify
Gratuitous catalog

What a gorgeous Sport! You have succeeded in updating it without losing any of its character. Well done! :thumb:

artclone 04-21-16 09:33 AM


Originally Posted by DQRider
What a gorgeous Sport! You have succeeded in updating it without losing any of its character. Well done! :thumb:

Agreed, really nice. I love those subtly slick green spoke nipples!

peppep 04-21-16 09:42 AM


Originally Posted by artclone (Post 18707447)
Agreed, really nice. I love those subtly slick green spoke nipples!

Double-agreed, looks great! Thanks for sharing!

peppep 04-21-16 10:11 AM

5 Attachment(s)
Since I'm going away for a few days, I figured this is the perfect time to order some parts. Once again, please excuse the newb questions (it means fewer questions on the next bike, right??). I did try searching first, but still confused...

Brake pads: I was going to order the Kool Stop Continental Salmon Brake Shoes, but looked at my current brake bad set-up, and the front and rear have different sizes/types of brake pads:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517152http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517151
The front ones are newer (pads still feel rubbery) and shorter with metal on all four edges. The rear ones are older and longer, with metal just on the long edges. So, very basic, but the question is what to order? Do I need full brake pads with the metal bits for either of these?

Shift cables: Not sure if I can use a standard cable and add the little end bits myself, or if I need to order an SA cable (like what Harris sells that includes the housing and the bit with the nut at the end that doesn't look as nice as the current setup). My current housing is mostly in pretty good shape, but has a few areas that are pretty busted. I think black would look nice, but am down to keep anything original that's still good to use.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517156http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517154http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517155
So, the questions are: 1. Can I use a regular new cable and some readily available item I don't know about to cinch the ends? 2. what do you think about re-using the housing?

Basic stuff, but learning!

BigChief 04-21-16 10:40 AM

Looks like the easiest thing would be one size fits all Sturmey Archer trigger replacement cable and casing with a pinch bolt adapter.
For steel rims, these are my favorite. Length doesn't matter.
Fibrax Raincheater Vintage Brake Pads f/Steel Rims - Harris Cyclery bicycle shop - West Newton, Massachusetts

BigChief 04-21-16 10:48 AM

Hmmm...I see cables like this all over the place. Has the correct end for the trigger, the correct casing cap for your trigger, but the casing is too long.
You only want to run the casing to the top bar mounted fulcrum clip. Trimming cable casing is a bear without a cable cutter. Maybe you know someone who could cut the casing the proper length for you.
https://www.bikeparts.com/BPC320792/...FQqoaQodgsoB0A

peppep 04-21-16 11:21 AM

@BigChief, you are seriously my hero right now. I have access to cable cutters at the coop (they've got tons of tools, but can be hit-or-miss on advice depending on who's there, hence the brain-picking of all you experts here).

bmthom.gis 04-21-16 11:46 AM

Also, you can buy a lot of this stuff on Amazon with Prime shipping if you are a Prime member.

bmthom.gis 04-21-16 11:46 AM


Originally Posted by DQRider (Post 18707324)
What a gorgeous Sport! You have succeeded in updating it without losing any of its character. Well done! :thumb:


Originally Posted by artclone (Post 18707447)
Agreed, really nice. I love those subtly slick green spoke nipples!


Originally Posted by peppep (Post 18707475)
Double-agreed, looks great! Thanks for sharing!

:thumb:

BigChief 04-21-16 11:49 AM

Here's a close up of the pinch bolt adapter you'll need. This way you don't have to worry about the length of the cable. One end of the cable will have the end that fits into the trigger, the other is plain.
Find a casing with the color you want. Trim it to the length of your existing casing. I believe yours had white originally. You'll need a cable casing cap with the ball end to fit into the keyhole slot in the trigger for your year. Lots of Sturmey Archer parts on eBay.
New Sturmey Archer Cable Anchorage for Shift Cables | eBay

peppep 04-21-16 12:06 PM

Thanks, asking my LBS if they can get this stuff in, otherwise ordering. I learned how to overhaul bikes on one with standard cables and a derailleur pretty recently, so while I'm comfortable doing things like cleaning and regreasing a hub, this is all new and unknown. I'm excited to dive in, but want to dive in with the right parts! Greatly appreciate your help.

markk900 04-21-16 06:17 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 18707645)
Trimming cable casing is a bear without a cable cutter.

I've been pretty successful using a fine tooth hacksaw......

smontanaro 04-21-16 06:54 PM

^ Dremel works for me...

AngeloDolce 04-22-16 12:04 AM


Originally Posted by artclone (Post 18702909)
Crazy price, but I really like that chain case. I haven't seen that one with the exposed crank.

It's a normal full chain case (e.g. Sheldon Brown photo My 1954 Raleigh Superbe Roadster). The reason the crank is exposed is because the round cover was lost sometime over the last 50 years. You need to remove the cover to take the crank off (e.g. overhaul bottom bracket), so you can just leave the cover off if you like the exposed look.

I can't tell from the ad if the seller is charging extra since it is missing pieces.

AngeloDolce 04-22-16 12:22 AM


Originally Posted by peppep (Post 18707537)
Since I'm going away for a few days, I figured this is the perfect time to order some parts. Once again, please excuse the newb questions (it means fewer questions on the next bike, right??). I did try searching first, but still confused...

Brake pads: I was going to order the Kool Stop Continental Salmon Brake Shoes, but looked at my current brake bad set-up, and the front and rear have different sizes/types of brake pads:
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517152http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517151
The front ones are newer (pads still feel rubbery) and shorter with metal on all four edges. The rear ones are older and longer, with metal just on the long edges. So, very basic, but the question is what to order? Do I need full brake pads with the metal bits for either of these?

Shift cables: Not sure if I can use a standard cable and add the little end bits myself, or if I need to order an SA cable (like what Harris sells that includes the housing and the bit with the nut at the end that doesn't look as nice as the current setup). My current housing is mostly in pretty good shape, but has a few areas that are pretty busted. I think black would look nice, but am down to keep anything original that's still good to use.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517156http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517154http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=517155
So, the questions are: 1. Can I use a regular new cable and some readily available item I don't know about to cinch the ends? 2. what do you think about re-using the housing?

Basic stuff, but learning!

You'll be fine with the Kool Stop. The open brake holders on the (older) rear brakes let you reuse the metal holder, but also mean the brake shoes have to be installed with the open end to the rear so that braking won't remove the rubber shoe. The Kool Stop will work and give you better braking; virtually all brake shoes now come with the complete holder.

The shifter cable housing is coiled steel under the plastic coating. In the last picture, it looks like the coiled steel is bent and has some gaps. If this is the case, I'd replace the housing. I've crimped narrow tubing on the end of shifter cables (I like the style of the older cables better than the modern universal cables).

The decals and the double ended rear brake cable look like bikes I've seen from the early 50's, so the rear hub and front brake may be later replacements. If you can't use the double ended brake cable you have now for some reason, it may be simpler and cheaper to see if the coop that sold the bike has a newer (60's -80's?) brake like the front that uses a modern cable.

I've never tried soldering an end on to a brake cable - the brake cable needs more strength than a shifter cable, and losing a brake is a lot worse than losing a shift.

BigChief 04-22-16 05:35 AM

I know, from experience, that regular, low temp 60/40 type solder isn't strong enough for making cables. Not even SA shifter cables. You need to silver braze. I did try an experiment on my most recent SA shifter cable build. Instead of brazing, I used JB Weld to hold the short piece of 3/32" brass tubing I use on the adjuster barrel end and so far, it's holding up fine. We'll see.

artclone 04-22-16 07:55 AM


Originally Posted by AngeloDolce (Post 18709407)
It's a normal full chain case (e.g. Sheldon Brown photo My 1954 Raleigh Superbe Roadster). The reason the crank is exposed is because the round cover was lost sometime over the last 50 years. You need to remove the cover to take the crank off (e.g. overhaul bottom bracket), so you can just leave the cover off if you like the exposed look.

I can't tell from the ad if the seller is charging extra since it is missing pieces.

Ah! Thank you.

noglider 04-22-16 09:50 AM

@peppep, you don't need to replace your shift cable, and you're better off not doing it. That damage looks minimal and inconsequential.

And you haven't mentioned why you want to replace your brake cables. Maybe you don't have to do that, either. You can't get cables that are as well-made as the originals, so stick with them if you can.

mirfi 04-22-16 11:30 AM

Hello,

Saw this on CL, just had to tell somebody.

4 Speed?
Vintage 1951 Raleigh Sports 4 Speed w/Dynohub - $300


Vintage 1951 Raleigh Sports 4 Speed w/Dynohub

Salubrious 04-22-16 11:50 AM

^^ Yup! Awesome ride! And at a good price. The 4-speed is more finicky in its adjustment than the 3-speed, but it is reliable. Essentially its like a 3-speed that has a low gear below 1st. That's not 100% true- the ratios are slightly different, but 2nd-4th are close enough to the AW that its hard to tell them apart.

3speedslow 04-22-16 12:36 PM

Cables, as a last resort, replace. Keep the originals until for safety you have to get something else.

arex 04-23-16 05:26 PM

I now have the crank on the Twenty assembled and working well. It took a different spindle (found on eBay by VV and pointed out to me) and a different DS crank (supplied by VV) to work. Even then, there's VERY little space between the crank and the cup, about 1mm, but it works now without touching or rubbing.


Testing with the new-to-me spindle alone didn't work...my crank still rubbed on the cup, though it wasn't bound up tight like the original spindle and original crank. When I measured each spindle with calipers, the new-to-me spindle's cotter notch was about 1mm closer to the end of the spindle.


After I received VV's crank, I compared the dimensions to mine. Sure enough, the cotter hole in my crank was about 1.5mm further out from the base of the crank. This crank, combined with my spindle (as well as whatever issues the reversed cups are introducing) made for a virtually unusable bottom bracket and crank. I have no idea how this situation ever got past Raleigh's QC, or the bike shop that sold it, or how the previous owner was able to use it.


Thanks again to @Velocivixen...you're a lifesaver.


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