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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

dweenk 01-16-15 03:57 PM

@Velocivixen
i used the actual Park cotter pin press to push the cotter pins in deeper so the nut would engage on more threads with great success. In the meantime I bought more pins along with a single cut 8" "B*****d file".

If you call it a love child file, it slides right past the censors.





Velocivixen 01-16-15 06:24 PM

I originally just changed out the brake cables & pads & used same housing, but with copious amounts of Tri-Flow inside. Rear brake was horrible, front OK. Today changed out to new, modern brake housing and OMG! My brakes are awesome, even the back. So, if you've got brakes that are only "so-so" then maybe this would help.

pakman 01-17-15 12:16 PM

This Humber reminds me of the first real bicycle I had. My father obtained an old Humber bicycle with the full chain case. rod brakes, fenders with the white paint on the rear. S-A three speed and a Brooks B-17 saddle. This bike was the ticket to freedom for a young guy in the early 60's. At the time all you could find about this bike that it was English and I never knew the model. I wish I still had it.

Velocivixen 01-17-15 12:32 PM

Question re: SA 3-speed shifting:

SA manual says, "continue pedaling, but ease pressure on the pedals...". When I do this the shifter is a tiny bit hard to shift (it's been cleaned & lubricated). However when I STOP pedaling then shift, the shifter moves the wire with no resistance and it works like a charm 100%.

How do you all shift? How's it work for you? Thanks.

Bandera 01-17-15 12:50 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 17477912)
However when I STOP pedaling then shift, the shifter moves the wire with no resistance and it works like a charm 100%.

That's the ticket for smooth long wearing operation, the bits 'n bobs inside the hub shell are whizzing about like a solar system on meth.
Stopping pedaling for a moment allows a smooth load-less mesh of the internal gizmos.
I even back-pedal a touch at times when I've got a big load on the drivetrain and must shift.

-Bandera

Velocivixen 01-17-15 01:18 PM


Originally Posted by Bandera (Post 17477951)
That's the ticket for smooth long wearing operation, the bits 'n bobs inside the hub shell are whizzing about like a solar system on meth.
Stopping pedaling for a moment allows a smooth load-less mesh of the internal gizmos.
I even back-pedal a touch at times when I've got a big load on the drivetrain and must shift.

-Bandera

OK, excellent, so I'm not crazy. (Statement not question;)). Why do you think SA instructs riders to ease up on pedaling? Why don't they just say to stop pedaling for a second or give the rider 2 options? There is a significant difference in shifter feel, shifting while pedaling vs coasting.

Bandera 01-17-15 01:43 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 17478029)
Why do you think SA instructs riders to ease up on pedaling? .

It was an inherit unwillingness of the British to appear to have an un-manly dainty technology that required coasting to shift properly while the Continental derailleur system demanded staunch continuous pedaling to accomplish the same action. One must keep up appearances, must one not? :twitchy:

-Bandera

dweenk 01-17-15 02:48 PM

I just found a convenient oiler for my 3-speeds and a couple of other machines around the property. I bought it today without shopping to much - you may find it cheaper at other locations.

dlsales@dutton-lainson.com

Salubrious 01-17-15 03:49 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 17477912)
SA manual says, "continue pedaling, but ease pressure on the pedals...". When I do this the shifter is a tiny bit hard to shift (it's been cleaned & lubricated). However when I STOP pedaling then shift, the shifter moves the wire with no resistance and it works like a charm 100%.

How do you all shift? How's it work for you? Thanks.

I keep pedaling, but make sure that I am pedaling a bit slower than needed to deliver power. Shifting is immediate. I experience no difference in shifting if I just simply coast. When I first started riding the hub after rebuilding the bike, it was not so accommodating- I had to coast just a tiny bit to get the shift. So the hub might need to just get ridden a bit.

So- how do you like the ride??

noglider 01-17-15 05:12 PM

One fun thing about IGHs is that you can careen to a stoplight in high gear, stop, and then shift to first while stopped.

Bandera 01-17-15 07:21 PM

The key to operating the Sturmey Archer IGH drivetrains is to remain well within the operational parameters of a full-on Lands End-John 'O Groats timed record attempt during a Luftwaffe Blitz and a mild plooter by an elderly parson across the village on a sunny April morning to preside at the funeral of a gouty local peer.

A modicum of haste and a bit of dignified indolence are applied in equal measure for best performance.

-Bandera

Velocivixen 01-17-15 07:40 PM

@Salubrious - the ride seems nice. Still dialing it in, saddle, etc. The new brake housing is fantastic! It will be nicer once I get the 22T cog. Bought a 1/8" ss chain today.
@noglider - yes I've read you could do that. Is it an "optimal" way to shift though? I mean will it put undue stress on the innards?
@Bandera - I don't know what you do in life, but you sure have a colorful way with words. I like it!

Took front wheel to LBS to see about a wheel Truing problem. Couldn't get it all the way true with a funny spot. They checked it and said there was a "flat" spot affecting an area about 6" long. They said I did a good job with the rest of the wheel, but nothing to do. So....since I've wanted to build a wheel and have been acquiring all the tools, I ordered CR18 26 x 1 3/8" rims from Sugarwheelworks and will be them Thursday. I'll buy 14 gauge spokes, brass nipples from them when I go pick up the rim.

Just finished reading "The Wheel" , Jobst Brandt. I think I can do a reasonable job on a front wheel.

noglider 01-17-15 07:56 PM

Shifting while stopped is just fine.

Number_6 01-17-15 09:28 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 17477912)
Question re: SA 3-speed shifting:

SA manual says, "continue pedaling, but ease pressure on the pedals...". When I do this the shifter is a tiny bit hard to shift (it's been cleaned & lubricated). However when I STOP pedaling then shift, the shifter moves the wire with no resistance and it works like a charm 100%.

How do you all shift? How's it work for you? Thanks.

I'll say it like this- when you shift, take the load off the crank. You can pedal backward, stop or pedal forward slower- all will make for some play or slack in the drivetrain since it's not loaded with your pedal power. Then the SA will happily go where you want it to (if it is not ill...).

adventurepdx 01-18-15 11:05 AM


Originally Posted by dweenk (Post 17478197)
I just found a convenient oiler for my 3-speeds and a couple of other machines around the property. I bought it today without shopping to much - you may find it cheaper at other locations.

I got mine through Harbor Freight, a hardware chain. It was about three dollars. Nothing fancy, but gets the job done.

sloar 01-18-15 06:23 PM

Well, I have learned you haven't worked on a bike til you've worked on an old English bike.

crank_addict 01-18-15 06:34 PM


Originally Posted by Number_6 (Post 17478960)
I'll say it like this- when you shift, take the load off the crank. You can pedal backward, stop or pedal forward slower- all will make for some play or slack in the drivetrain since it's not loaded with your pedal power. Then the SA will happily go where you want it to (if it is not ill...).

I don't pedal backwards and further, what purpose would it serve?

I do ride a vintage bike with a combination IGH + derailleurs. The best for IGH shifting is not during pedaling, however for the rear derailleur, its a must to do while pedaling. Also, this particular bike uses a front direct lever mounted on the seat tube derailleur. Its supposed to be shifted while pedaling but really doesn't need much. Archaic but works fast and is very positive.

Bandera 01-18-15 07:18 PM


Originally Posted by crank_addict (Post 17480926)
I don't pedal backwards and further, what purpose would it serve?
I do ride a vintage bike with a combination IGH + derailleurs. The best for IGH shifting is not during pedaling, however for the rear derailleur, its a must to do while pedaling.

I also ride a 1950's AW/Cyclo 3 cog derailleur set-up almost daily.
The needlessly complex, finicky, archaic and downright fiddly system's shifting complexity is a proven deterrent to Alzheimers advancement in elderly cyclists.

Anyone who can discern whether an up-shift is "One down on the cogset and an up-click on the hub, or the other way 'round", is doing very well cognitively. :love:

A friend borrowed my town bike for a simple trip to the local Ice House for some Shiner Bocks and pronounced it: "Complete Rubbish, or Complete Genius. I can't tell which."
Neither can I after >40 years in service.

-Bandera

crank_addict 01-18-15 07:21 PM

^^ haha. But I never learned how to program the Betamax! Good riddance!

Velocivixen 01-18-15 11:19 PM

I agree with @sloar regarding old 3 speeds. Today changed shifter cable, partially. Removed & cleaned some dynohub cogs, washers, locknuts, etc. Larger cog comes tomorrow so at that point I'm taking the entire thing apart. If you don't hear from me for awhile....just know I'm focused.

Sixty Fiver 01-20-15 11:46 AM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 17478029)
OK, excellent, so I'm not crazy. (Statement not question;)). Why do you think SA instructs riders to ease up on pedaling? Why don't they just say to stop pedaling for a second or give the rider 2 options? There is a significant difference in shifter feel, shifting while pedaling vs coasting.

The 3 speed is not synchronized for shifting under load... it is like trying to shift into first gear in a car while it is moving.

Up shifting under a moderate load is usually quite smooth, downshifting under load requires one to back off. When you are really putting the power into it the pawls are firmly planted in the driver shell and resist being moved which is a good thing.

Salubrious 01-20-15 12:05 PM

I find that when I am shifting an older derailleur it helps to back off the torque to get a smoother faster shift. The AW shifts so quickly that what we are really talking about is an instant.

However if the hub is a little gummed up you may have to be patient with it until the new lubricants have made their way into every nook and cranny. My hub on my '72 Superbe was like that initially but cleared up very quickly after a few miles. In looking back over this thread, this is a very common occurrence.
@Velocivixen
If I were you I would not bother to take the hub apart unless you have some evidence that it is really worn out (don't fix it if it ain't broke- that sort of thing....). If its just been sitting, it probably is just fine and needs the lubricant to circulate.

sloar 01-20-15 12:10 PM

Question regarding the SA dyno hub, I put new bulbs in the front and rear lights. I spun the wheel and got a pretty bright light at first, now all I get is a dim low light front and rear spinning it pretty hard. I've cleaned all the terminal and have checked all I can think of. Any ideas?

Salubrious 01-20-15 12:41 PM

Try it with just one bulb- how does it do?

sloar 01-20-15 12:44 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 17485345)
Try it with just one bulb- how does it do?

I will give that a try tomorrow, I'm working today! Thanks


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