Bike Forums

Bike Forums (https://www.bikeforums.net/forum.php)
-   Classic & Vintage (https://www.bikeforums.net/forumdisplay.php?f=181)
-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

PedalTraveler 11-26-14 06:47 PM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 17280540)
Somewhere you can find my before and after pictures of my 1962 Rudge. I had always wanted a Rudge. It's my favorite 3-speed. Mine was about as crusty as yours. Nice work there.

Thank you very much, I spent much time ogling yours before I started mine, a new saddle and I see mine getting alot of use as well.

thunderworks 11-27-14 08:28 AM

I have an early 1980's Raleigh Superbe. It's missing the key for the fork lock, but otherwise complete . If it's been ridden 10 miles, I'd be shocked. I bought it used a few years ago as a nostalgia piece. I had a 1970's version exactly like this one (same size, color, everything) that was stolen from me in around 1980. There is a small dent in the chainguard from storage, but it truly appears unridden.

The bike is a 21" frame and has the rear rack, Brooks leather seat, Dyno hub . . .any clue what this is worth if I decide to sell it?

Howard 11-27-14 10:01 AM


Originally Posted by thunderworks (Post 17344017)
I have an early 1980's Raleigh Superbe. It's missing the key for the fork lock, but otherwise complete . If it's been ridden 10 miles, I'd be shocked. I bought it used a few years ago as a nostalgia piece. I had a 1970's version exactly like this one (same size, color, everything) that was stolen from me in around 1980. There is a small dent in the chainguard from storage, but it truly appears unridden.

The bike is a 21" frame and has the rear rack, Brooks leather seat, Dyno hub . . .any clue what this is worth if I decide to sell it?

There's an appraisal subforum. Beyond that, values vary by city and region, and IIRC, some or most 1980's Raleigh 3 speeds sold in the US were made in Malaysia. So no real good idea, and I probably shouldn't say here if I did.

[edit: Classic and Vintage Bicycles: What's it Worth? Appraisals and Inquiries ]

noglider 11-30-14 06:42 PM

Very nice work on your granddaughter's bike, @Dan Burkhart. I also like the Fireball, @Sixty Fiver.

agmetal 11-30-14 07:49 PM

Still need to get my hands on a brass punch to figure out what's up with the noise my hub is making, but I threw a new seatpost and stem on my franken-3-speed last night, to shift my whole riding position forward a bit. Here's roughly what it looks like now:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...r/CAM01118.jpg

Number_6 11-30-14 08:19 PM

I've been paying a lot more attention to this forum lately. Last weekend I was primed on getting an old Schwinn New World about two hundred and fifty miles west of here. SInce I'd be in that neighborhood, I looked around for other things of interest and found an ad for two Raleigh three speeds. I really should have given more consideration to the fact that in 1948 at 6'5" I'd be remarkable, if not a freak. The New World was way too small- I could tell it on sight. It might have useful to me if I'd been in a Shriner's parade circling the clown car, though. Not a bad example, I just couldn't use it. After that I went to check out the Raleighs. I told the fellow, I'd probably just take his tall one. It was somewhat disassembled and turned out to be a Sprite. So we made a deal at a greatly reduced garage cleanout price as he said he'd lost interest in rejuvenating them. We loaded the parts up The second one was bronze green, I was told it was a smaller framed bike that was the wife's. I supposed it was a Sprite as well. I told him I didn't know what I'd do with it, being smaller and all and passed, but he wanted them out of the way and would let me have it at the same price as the tall bike. You never know what you might need, so I took it as well. Two Raleigh projects for $100.

I got to the middle of southern Illinois and the rattling of the big Sprite frame was getting annoying. I pulled off for a bite and went back to secure things better, and look some things up on these on the smartphone. It looked like the Sprite was 25"- a one year 1977 only model based on the Grand Prix frame. I finally took a more than cursory look at the green one, which I discovered was a Sports, and obviously a 23" one at that. So much for it being "small". I instantly quit worrying if I'd wasted my money. These bikes will need much work of course, especially in the paint area- but both are complete and quite doable for me. Come January I'll be getting on them. I just have to finish up a couple of Schwinns- my 3 speed Speedster and a newer China "bike shop" line mountain job for my niece.

So I look forward to three 3-speeds for the spring (or maybe 5, if I come across a Tourist and a big 3-speed Suburban...)

SirMike1983 11-30-14 08:52 PM

The New Worlds usually appear in the 19 inch and 21 inch frame versions. There was indeed a 23 inch frame version, but they seem to have been quite uncommon compared to the other sizes. Raleigh apparently marketed far more 23 inch frames than Schwinn did for the 1930s/40s New World.


Originally Posted by Number_6 (Post 17351751)
I've been paying a lot more attention to this forum lately. Last weekend I was primed on getting an old Schwinn New World about two hundred and fifty miles west of here. SInce I'd be in that neighborhood, I looked around for other things of interest and found an ad for two Raleigh three speeds. I really should have given more consideration to the fact that in 1948 at 6'5" I'd be remarkable, if not a freak. The New World was way too small- I could tell it on sight. It might have useful to me if I'd been in a Shriner's parade circling the clown car, though. Not a bad example, I just couldn't use it. After that I went to check out the Raleighs. I told the fellow, I'd probably just take his tall one. It was somewhat disassembled and turned out to be a Sprite. So we made a deal at a greatly reduced garage cleanout price as he said he'd lost interest in rejuvenating them. We loaded the parts up The second one was bronze green, I was told it was a smaller framed bike that was the wife's. I supposed it was a Sprite as well. I told him I didn't know what I'd do with it, being smaller and all and passed, but he wanted them out of the way and would let me have it at the same price as the tall bike. You never know what you might need, so I took it as well. Two Raleigh projects for $100.

I got to the middle of southern Illinois and the rattling of the big Sprite frame was getting annoying. I pulled off for a bite and went back to secure things better, and look some things up on these on the smartphone. It looked like the Sprite was 25"- a one year 1977 only model based on the Grand Prix frame. I finally took a more than cursory look at the green one, which I discovered was a Sports, and obviously a 23" one at that. So much for it being "small". I instantly quit worrying if I'd wasted my money. These bikes will need much work of course, especially in the paint area- but both are complete and quite doable for me. Come January I'll be getting on them. I just have to finish up a couple of Schwinns- my 3 speed Speedster and a newer China "bike shop" line mountain job for my niece.

So I look forward to three 3-speeds for the spring (or maybe 5, if I come across a Tourist and a big 3-speed Suburban...)


Narhay 11-30-14 11:49 PM

What is the consensus to the best quality 26" x 1 3/8" 590 skin wall/tan wall tire? I've got a Kenda tire but the skinwall molding is irregular and the tire itself is lumpy. I am not a fan of my nicely trued wheels looking like they have taken a sledgehammer to the side.

Michelin World Tour 26 x 1-3/8 Tire Black/Tan

I've found these but I'm not sure about the reflective side.

noglider 12-01-14 08:18 AM


Originally Posted by Narhay (Post 17352252)
What is the consensus to the best quality 26" x 1 3/8" 590 skin wall/tan wall tire? I've got a Kenda tire but the skinwall molding is irregular and the tire itself is lumpy. I am not a fan of my nicely trued wheels looking like they have taken a sledgehammer to the side.

Michelin World Tour 26 x 1-3/8 Tire Black/Tan

I've found these but I'm not sure about the reflective side.

Some say the best tire in this size is the Panaracer Col de la Vie. It has a thin sidewall. I haven't tried it.

I have the whitewall Schwalbe Delta Cruisers on my Rudge. They're very handsome but I don't like the way they ride. It's harsh.

I've tried the Kenda Kwest. Is that what you have? It's cheap, and maybe the defect rate is too high, but I like the ride. I generally stay away from Kenda tires, but the tires I tried felt really nice.

Narhay 12-01-14 10:19 AM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 17352607)
Some say the best tire in this size is the Panaracer Col de la Vie. It has a thin sidewall. I haven't tried it.

I have the whitewall Schwalbe Delta Cruisers on my Rudge. They're very handsome but I don't like the way they ride. It's harsh.

I've tried the Kenda Kwest. Is that what you have? It's cheap, and maybe the defect rate is too high, but I like the ride. I generally stay away from Kenda tires, but the tires I tried felt really nice.

I've had mixed success with Kenda tires in the past, with some decent 'Kourier' tires on an older hybrid and then these.

These were your average $13/tire yellow wall cheapest-at-the-LBS Kenda tires I purchased when my Superbe was going to be a flip rather than a keeper. I had a look to see if they had any model names or markings but there were none to be found. I also dislike the 55PSI maximum pressure they are rated for as they run quite 'flat'.

I ordered the Michelins as the panaracer was not in stock at Niagara. I'll report back on their quality but I hope they'll be nicer than what I've got, and they go up to 85PSI.

noglider 12-01-14 10:26 AM

Yeah, Kenda is not a name I admire. Even less is Cheng Shin Tire, aka CST. I hope they get their acts together.

55 psi really ought to suffice for such a wide tire. And if you inflate it to 85, I'd bet it won't blow off.

Salubrious 12-01-14 12:19 PM

I have Kendas on my Raleigh Superbe. Didn't realize how much they were cramping my style until I set up my Humber Sport with Continental City Rides (26" x 1/3/8" of course, 37mm x 590, inflate to 75 pounds). The Humber not only rides better but is easier to make speed and handles better too.

I was just getting ready to try a set of the Michelins (35mm x 590, inflate to 85 pounds!) which are replacing the Kendas on my Superbe. Then the snow came...

I have a set of 28mm 590s on order but likely won't see those until spring- they go on the Claud Butler clubman.

Howard 12-01-14 07:48 PM

I have some Kendas and the Michelins - which I'm running at about 55 psi. I got about 4000 miles out of the last set of Kenda K-40's I had on the Hercules.
Am trying the Michelins on a single speed Raleigh, and so far have no complaints. Have had some good feedback on the reflective sidewalls. Here it is on a commute a week or two ago:

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7562/...11f2b20c_n.jpg
ltd_reflexion


The headlight is a B&M halogen driven by a B&M sidewall generator. I'm happy enough with that arrangement too, FWIW.

adventurepdx 12-01-14 10:14 PM


Originally Posted by Narhay (Post 17352252)
What is the consensus to the best quality 26" x 1 3/8" 590 skin wall/tan wall tire?

I think the consensus, as far as I know, is the Panaracer Col De La Vies are the best gum/skin/tan wall tire available in the 590 size. I currently have them on my Raleigh Wayfarer, so I speak from experience.
  • PROS: They look nice. I like the look of the "blocky" tread, a very vintage look that you don't see in modern tires. And they are the best "riding" tire out there in this size.
  • CONS: The max PSI rating seems pretty low, 45 PSI (vs 65 for the Delta Cruisers.) 45 PSI seems fine for something in a 50mm width, but I find it a bit suspect at 38/40 mm. I've been running them a bit higher under the recommendation of someone else around my 200 lb weight. It's fine for around-town, but when I loaded it up (30 lbs) for a tour I did, I got two flats in a row. I think if I'll do another tour I'll switch tires.

The Delta Cruisers seem to have better puncture protection (only a couple when I had them on the bike), but yeah, the ride quality isn't as good. But they do come in gum/skin/tan wall, so it is an option.

Haven't had any experience with the Michelin World Tours, they look OK.

desconhecido 12-02-14 04:28 PM

I last posted in this thread maybe four years or so ago. That was about my $30 Raleigh Sports and how expensive a $30 bicycle can be. It has the same Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires on it that it had four 1/2 years ago when I got it and I like them fine. Keep them gassed to 80 to 90 psi or so. I really don't like squishy tires as I'm always afraid of pinch flats though that may just be my fault from days gone by when I was trying to ride skinny tires with a fat body.

So, I checked and Amazon has the Marathon Plus in the 1 3/8 size and the get $53 each, Yikes! My recollection from 2010 is $38, which was interesting as it exceeded the cost of the bike -- for each tire. Sure am glad we don't have inflatioin anymore or there's no telling how expensive stuff would be.

Somewhere I read that the Marthon is a heavy tire that feels slow. That may be true, I don't know, but as I ride mostly for exercise, a little extra tire weight and rolling resistance doesn't really bother me. Extra calories.

Hope everyone is having a good season and enjoying their old three speeds. I do mine, as I ride around the streets of Houston in the middle of the night.

desconhecido 12-02-14 04:32 PM

Oh, one more thing for anyone considering the allegedly bullet proof Schwalbe lead lined tires. They are very tight on Sun CR 18 rims. Installing them resulted in at least one patch job. The CR18 rims are renowned to be hard for tire installation and the Schwalbe Marathon tires, in my experience, are tight in other sizes as well.

agmetal 12-05-14 10:54 AM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 17331936)

I finally picked one of these up last night and gave it a shot this morning...not having much luck, though. FWIW, the whole ball ring is pretty shallow, so it's hard for the punch to get any real purchase on the notches. Suggestions?

Here's the hub in question, side-by-side with a loose one I've been using as a learning tool, so you can see the difference. The loose hub is dated 1963, and the one in the wheel is 1971.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...r/CAM01125.jpg

Salubrious 12-05-14 11:42 AM

I would consider installing the older hub in the wheel. Of course, I'm always looking for an excuse to build up a wheel. The older hubs seem to have a better reputation.

Otherwise, you are either going to have go obtain a tool like this:
The Lake Pepin 3-Speed Tour
take a look at the left-hand column and click on 'parts'

As you can see he does not have it in stock, but at least you know what it looks like.

Or- you are going to have to get a very large screwdriver, engage it in that notch, and bludgeon the race loose.

agmetal 12-05-14 11:56 AM

The older hub has 40 holes, that's why I didn't use it when I built up the new wheel last month.

Dan Burkhart 12-05-14 12:10 PM


Originally Posted by agmetal (Post 17364295)
I finally picked one of these up last night and gave it a shot this morning...not having much luck, though. FWIW, the whole ball ring is pretty shallow, so it's hard for the punch to get any real purchase on the notches. Suggestions?

Here's the hub in question, side-by-side with a loose one I've been using as a learning tool, so you can see the difference. The loose hub is dated 1963, and the one in the wheel is 1971.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v8...r/CAM01125.jpg

My brass punch method is most effective for the new scalloped notches, although I have used it with the square notches with success. Most people use a flat chisel or screwdriver to drive that type out.

79pmooney 12-05-14 12:17 PM

What the Sturmey-Archer 3-speed hub inspired: The Magic Wheels wheelchair wheels. Wheelchair Wheels With Power Assist from Magic Wheels Those wheels have completely different mechanisms but were inspired by the S_A 3 speed.

My dad grew up during the depression. He and his friends as teenagers rode all of New England on 3-speeds, cars being way out of reach. Those bikes saw use and abused as only teenagers can dish out. I heard those stories both from my dad and those lifelong friends. My first geared bike was a 3-speed Dunelt (sp) low end Raleigh. I went on to 10 speeds, sew-ups, racing and fix gears. I had a head injury '77. Winter of '78, I coached an aquantance who had surgetry that cut into her spinal cord to walk on crutches and we stayed close for years.

1993, she had the inevitable surgery to rebuild her back that meant a life on a wheelchair. I visited her 10 days out of the hsopital. Got to watch her struggle to go up a 20' vertical ramp. My first thought? "This is someone in too high a gear!" Then "Why couldn't wheelchairs have an internal geared hub like a S-A? That led to a patent with U of Washington, then the inventor of the SonicCare toothbrush seeing that patent and pursuing it. A decade+ later, the Magic Wheel was debuted.

I've tooled around on them. They are a lot of fun. While I was working with the university I got my hands on a wheelchair and rollled around my moderately hilly neighborhood so I knew first hand how hard wheelchairs are. The 2:1 low gear is a real benefit!

If you know of anyone in for a lifetime on a wheelchair, suggest these as a spare set if nothing else, so when injury or sickness happens, thay can pull these wheels out and continue life. Just like running your fix gear on a bigger cog until you get stronger. (These wheels are interchangeable with the existing wheels and no wider so there will not be door issues. Also quick-release so in and out of cars is simple. And as light as you can make a geared hub. They were conceived by an ex-bike racer after all.)

And, yes I do have a financial interest here. Sales might get me a dollar or two before I die. My stake is $12,000 out of my pocket and I own a few shares of Magic wheels. That pales beside my passion to see these in use. The struggel I witnessed 20 years ago is burned into my brain.

Ben

nlerner 12-05-14 12:46 PM

^ That's awesome work, Ben.

agmetal 12-05-14 01:40 PM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 17364594)
My brass punch method is most effective for the new scalloped notches, although I have used it with the square notches with success. Most people use a flat chisel or screwdriver to drive that type out.

Damn, wish I'd realized this before I spent the money on a punch. For some reason I had it in my head that a chisel was somehow a bad idea, and never used one of the ones I had around until reading this. It worked quickly and effectively! After opening up both hubs and comparing side by side, the only notable difference I could see was some wear on the low gear pawls of the hub I've been riding, more than was the case with the loose hub. I swapped pawls between the hubs, and I'll give it a shot later to see if that helps. One thing I noticed is that the scraping sound I've heard in second gear doesn't always start until I'm a couple miles into a ride...but if it's not those pawls, I really don't know what could be causing it.

JohnDThompson 12-05-14 02:18 PM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 17364594)
My brass punch method is most effective for the new scalloped notches

There is a proper tool available for those:

http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/images/pr...r-IMG31629.jpg

Buy Sturmey Archer Sturmey Archer HTR 145 Classic Ball Ring Spanner from SJS Cycles, fast delivery for the UK - 24.99

Dan Burkhart 12-05-14 02:30 PM


Originally Posted by agmetal (Post 17364893)
Damn, wish I'd realized this before I spent the money on a punch. For some reason I had it in my head that a chisel was somehow a bad idea, and never used one of the ones I had around until reading this. It worked quickly and effectively! After opening up both hubs and comparing side by side, the only notable difference I could see was some wear on the low gear pawls of the hub I've been riding, more than was the case with the loose hub. I swapped pawls between the hubs, and I'll give it a shot later to see if that helps. One thing I noticed is that the scraping sound I've heard in second gear doesn't always start until I'm a couple miles into a ride...but if it's not those pawls, I really don't know what could be causing it.

I apologize if I led you down the wrong track there, but I'm sure you'll find other uses for your new brass punch. They are handy to have around.

agmetal 12-05-14 04:47 PM

Interesting observation with my scraping sound...when coasting, it's affected by the position of the cranks (and therefore phase of the two pairs of pawls). It does this in all gears while coasting, but only second while pedaling. This is after swapping the slightly worn-looking pawls from the hub in use, out for the better-looking ones from the loose hub.

noglider 12-05-14 04:59 PM

Is it possible that you have grit that you didn't see?

Ben, thanks for the story. It's heart warming.

markk900 12-05-14 05:23 PM

Try taking the dust cap off from under the sprocket....on one of my hubs I found it made a large amount of mildly scraping noises....I actually forgot to put it back on one time and the noise went away. Now I have the dilemma of put it back and have it be noisy, or leave it off.....

gna 12-05-14 09:55 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 17364481)
I would consider installing the older hub in the wheel. Of course, I'm always looking for an excuse to build up a wheel. The older hubs seem to have a better reputation.

Otherwise, you are either going to have go obtain a tool like this:
The Lake Pepin 3-Speed Tour
take a look at the left-hand column and click on 'parts'

As you can see he does not have it in stock, but at least you know what it looks like.

Or- you are going to have to get a very large screwdriver, engage it in that notch, and bludgeon the race loose.

Send Jon an email--he may have some in stock.

I use an old flat-blade screwdriver. Seems to stay in the notch (mostly).

gna 12-05-14 09:56 PM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 17365495)
Try taking the dust cap off from under the sprocket....on one of my hubs I found it made a large amount of mildly scraping noises....I actually forgot to put it back on one time and the noise went away. Now I have the dilemma of put it back and have it be noisy, or leave it off.....

Just wait for oil to leak out and lubricate it.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:27 AM.


Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.