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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

clubman 07-26-17 05:59 AM

Well then, there you go. it's not a post-war bike. Must have been made between 43 and 45. My mistake.

BigChief 07-26-17 03:04 PM

What a glorious day for riding in Maine today. Had the roadster out on the wheeler trails. Had to walk a few swampy spots, but the trails are nicer than the roads in some ways.

gster 07-27-17 01:42 PM

Toronto Vintage Bicycle Show, 2017!
 
1 Attachment(s)
This Sunday.Attachment 573813

nlerner 07-28-17 04:33 PM

Update on my Sturmey-Archer trigger spring replacement project. This is for a 3/4-speed trigger from the late 40s/early 50s. Here's a pic of an NOS spring on top of the existing spring:

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4310/...53088d1e_c.jpg

Note the couple of degrees difference between the bends of the long end. I imagine that 60 years or so of wear and tear will do that. While I plan on installing the two new springs in two of the triggers in my stash, I have a couple of others that I'll just bend these springs back to their original shape.

BigChief 07-28-17 08:39 PM

Never thought of that. Unless they're too rusty a retensioning may be all they need. You'll notice the fresh spring right away. It will have that like new crisp feel.

obrentharris 07-28-17 09:18 PM

I am resurrecting this $20 Schwinn Traveler for the http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...e-100-3-a.html

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Roc...DSC1401-XL.jpg

I have gleaned from the serial number that this bike is a 1955 model. I'm quite sure that most of the parts on it are non original. (The 700c front wheel for instance) I am curious about the rear hub and the shifter. It appears that both are Sturmey Archer clones. Am I correct in this assumption? The hub is marked "JC Higgins 50320 3-speed" and is laced into a 26x1 3/8 EA3 rim.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Roc...DSC1439-XL.jpg


After several baths in penetrating oil then light lubricating oil and the judicious application of emery cloth to the inside surfaces I was able to bring this "Brampton Speedy Switch" back to life.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Roc...DSC1434-XL.jpg

Can any of you help me in piecing together my own less-than-scientific history of this bike by providing some idea of the age of these two components?

Thanks,
Brent

BigChief 07-29-17 04:27 AM

That hub is a Styria made in Austria. Not a licensed Sturmey Archer clone like a Brampton or Hercules.

clubman 07-29-17 04:36 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19753004)
That hub is a Styria made in Austria. Not a licensed Sturmey Archer clone like a Brampton or Hercules.

You sure BigChief? I thought the internals were licensed SA clones with just the shell being different.

BigChief 07-29-17 06:34 AM

You know, I'm not sure. I've never had a Styria apart. The case is very different, so it is an assumption. The Birmingham made Brampton has the same style case and interchangeable parts except they kept the older style threaded driver. I assumed that the licensing would be rather specific and require the same case like the Brampton. But maybe not. I suspect that Brampton may have been the actual manufacturer of the Hercules hubs as well.

Velocivixen 07-29-17 07:11 AM


Originally Posted by nlerner (Post 19752236)
Update on my Sturmey-Archer trigger spring replacement project. This is for a 3/4-speed trigger from the late 40s/early 50s. Here's a pic of an NOS spring on top of the existing spring:

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4310/...53088d1e_c.jpg

Note the couple of degrees difference between the bends of the long end. I imagine that 60 years or so of wear and tear will do that. While I plan on installing the two new springs in two of the triggers in my stash, I have a couple of others that I'll just bend these springs back to their original shape.

Would you please explain or show a few photos of how to get the shifter apart? I have some nice older shifters that I would love to use, but they have the same issue - need a new spring (3 speed) & I don't know to to get them apart without ruining them. They're riveted.

On a different note: Is there an era or span of years where the SA AW hub is particularly "bomb proof"? I mean, for example, are the ones from the '50's sturdier than the ones from the '70's? Thanks.

clubman 07-29-17 07:19 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19753116)
You know, I'm not sure. I've never had a Styria apart. The case is very different, so it is an assumption. The Birmingham made Brampton has the same style case and interchangeable parts except they kept the older style threaded driver. I assumed that the licensing would be rather specific and require the same case like the Brampton. But maybe not. I suspect that Brampton may have been the actual manufacturer of the Hercules hubs as well.

I've been sitting on this NOS Brampton hub complete with the bits for some years now. It's interesting that all of the external 'parts' are not SA made and I haven't opened it up to look at whats inside. So when SA licensed these other companies, were they required to retool everything? That's not an inexpensive venture. I think you're right about the Hercules connection, the round trigger can be found on some of their bikes as well.

Any idea when these were made? No date code.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Bv...=w1244-h902-no

nlerner 07-29-17 08:36 AM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19753189)
Would you please explain or show a few photos of how to get the shifter apart? I have some nice older shifters that I would love to use, but they have the same issue - need a new spring (3 speed) & I don't know to to get them apart without ruining them. They're riveted.

See @BigChief's pictorial explanation a few pages back. Those two pins aren't riveted in the triggers I'm working on (though perhaps they were in some of the generations of shifters). The end that protrudes on the face is knurled, and it's the end that protrudes through the back face plate that I whacked with a hammer and punch. There are also at least three different generations of springs, I believe, so you'll need to sort that out, too.

gster 07-29-17 09:02 AM

Scorchers!
 
2 Attachment(s)
My theme for tomorrow'a bike show here in Toronto is.. Scorchers!
2 three speeds, ('61 Raleigh Superbe and a '67 Glider), 1 Duomatic (modified '72 Glider)and 2 single speed bikes, (Raleigh frame with a Bayliss Wiley hub and an Indian Eastman with rod and lever brakes).
Attachment 574062

Attachment 574063

dweenk 07-29-17 10:00 AM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19753189)
Would you please explain or show a few photos of how to get the shifter apart? I have some nice older shifters that I would love to use, but they have the same issue - need a new spring (3 speed) & I don't know to to get them apart without ruining them. They're riveted.

On a different note: Is there an era or span of years where the SA AW hub is particularly "bomb proof"? I mean, for example, are the ones from the '50's sturdier than the ones from the '70's? Thanks.

VV,

One side of the rivet looks like a small nail head, so flip the shifter over and drive it out from that side. Save the pin because they can be reused. When you re-assemble it, pust the pin in from the "nail head side". Lay the shifter down on the nail head side and gently peen the thin end of the pin.

BigChief 07-29-17 10:14 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 19753393)
My theme for tomorrow'a bike show here in Toronto is.. Scorchers!
2 three speeds, ('61 Raleigh Superbe and a '67 Glider), 1 Duomatic (modified '72 Glider)and 2 single speed bikes, (Raleigh frame with a Bayliss Wiley hub and an Indian Eastman with rod and lever brakes).
Attachment 574062

Attachment 574063

Love it!! There is a bit of historical perspective here. This is how kids made "racers" out of throw away bikes in the 60s. Nobody valued the old 3 speeds much and I put my original Rudge together from mostly roadside trash day finds.
I sold it to somebody who came into the bike shop where I worked and always regretted it. Took me years to find an over painted, 50s Rudge that was messed up enough to scorcherize. Wish I could be there with you!

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4324/...58cf37b7_k.jpgRudge Scorcher by Billy Bones, on Flickr

BigChief 07-29-17 10:30 AM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19753207)
I've been sitting on this NOS Brampton hub complete with the bits for some years now. It's interesting that all of the external 'parts' are not SA made and I haven't opened it up to look at whats inside. So when SA licensed these other companies, were they required to retool everything? That's not an inexpensive venture. I think you're right about the Hercules connection, the round trigger can be found on some of their bikes as well.

Any idea when these were made? No date code.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Bv...=w1244-h902-no

I salvaged my Brampton hub from this bike. No badge, but seems to be a Birmingham brand. From things like the stirrup brake levers and rear reflector, I'll guess this bike to be early 50s. Didn't have a Brampton shifter though. This is where I got the SA 3 or 4 speed I use on mt roadster. It does have the same chrome 2 piece cable guide pulley as in your picture.
Attachment 574066

Velocivixen 07-29-17 12:01 PM

@nlerner & @dweenk - OK, thanks. I'll look at @BigChief photos.

Don't wanna hijack, but the deal with my new SA 2 Speed Kickback w/Coaster hub is that the SA rep will sent new innards to Universal Cycles who will take the old innards out and slide in the new. I had to disassemble my wheel for this. I thought I'd get a new hub. Oh well.

dweenk 07-29-17 12:06 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19753673)
@nlerner & @dweenk - OK, thanks. I'll look at @BigChief photos.

Don't wanna hijack, but the deal with my new SA 2 Speed Kickback w/Coaster hub is that the SA rep will sent new innards to Universal Cycles who will take the old innards out and slide in the new. I had to disassemble my wheel for this. I thought I'd get a new hub. Oh well.

BTW... If you ruin a pin while removing or installing it, a nail with a small head works fine. Just clip it off nearly flush and peen it.

SirMike1983 07-29-17 03:28 PM


Originally Posted by obrentharris (Post 19752728)
I am resurrecting this $20 Schwinn Traveler for the http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...e-100-3-a.html

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Roc...DSC1401-XL.jpg

I have gleaned from the serial number that this bike is a 1955 model. I'm quite sure that most of the parts on it are non original. (The 700c front wheel for instance) I am curious about the rear hub and the shifter. It appears that both are Sturmey Archer clones. Am I correct in this assumption? The hub is marked "JC Higgins 50320 3-speed" and is laced into a 26x1 3/8 EA3 rim.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Roc...DSC1439-XL.jpg


After several baths in penetrating oil then light lubricating oil and the judicious application of emery cloth to the inside surfaces I was able to bring this "Brampton Speedy Switch" back to life.

https://photos.smugmug.com/Other/Roc...DSC1434-XL.jpg

Can any of you help me in piecing together my own less-than-scientific history of this bike by providing some idea of the age of these two components?

Thanks,
Brent

1955 sounds right for that bike - check the Schwinn Serial database. I had a Brampton equipped 1954 Schwinn Traveler that I brought back to life and later sold to make space for an earlier type New World.

The early-mid 1950s Traveler has an electroforged frame generally, but does have a couple fillet brazed joints at the bottom bracket. They're heavy, solid bikes. They actually can be built up into reasonably strong utility bikes. The mid-1950s models and before often have very nice, ornate paint and decal schemes.

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-HcDyEhihv...818_191416.jpg

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-t93PAUow9...818_191429.jpg

BigChief 07-29-17 06:56 PM


Originally Posted by dweenk (Post 19753684)
BTW... If you ruin a pin while removing or installing it, a nail with a small head works fine. Just clip it off nearly flush and peen it.

I think one of the most important tips I can give on reassembly is to make sure the body pins will start to seat in the rear press fit case hole with only finger pressure. You will depend on this. It's best to test they do before you reassemble. If they don't, file off the top edge of the small end of the pins to make a slight lead. It's much easier to install the pawl/spring pin first. That will go in easily. Then, you place the trigger on the cam plate, move it under the pawl. Then comes the hard part. First place the pin through the face plate, top hole of the case and through the hole in the cam plate. Now you need to get the small end of the pin lined up with the press fit hole on the back of the case while it's under spring pressure. I hold the case up against my kitchen table top edge and manipulate the cam with a screwdriver. When I see the pin line up with the hole, I push it in with my finger. It should start go into the hole enough to stay in place while you turn the shifter over, place it on a hard flat surface and drive the pin home. Good luck!

BigChief 07-30-17 11:59 AM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19753673)
@nlerner & @dweenk - OK, thanks. I'll look at @BigChief photos.

Don't wanna hijack, but the deal with my new SA 2 Speed Kickback w/Coaster hub is that the SA rep will sent new innards to Universal Cycles who will take the old innards out and slide in the new. I had to disassemble my wheel for this. I thought I'd get a new hub. Oh well.

I missed this. Your new kick back hub went bad? Sorry to hear that. I hope they sort it out for you. What was wrong with it?

Sixty Fiver 07-30-17 12:48 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I hope everyone is enjoying this beautiful Sunday... the clouds seem to be clearing and I think I need to go for a little ride. My back and hip have been a mess so I have been forced to ride something with a little more power of late.

Attachment 574197

clubman 07-30-17 03:49 PM

Good to hear from you Keith, hope you heal up.

A Passport 90? C&V!

arty dave 07-30-17 04:24 PM

Hope it returns to you quickly Velocivixen! I've heard of them crapping out and I seem to remember something about a dodgy part, and when you are given new innards they include an upgrade to the problematic part. So when you get it back it'll be fun and bulletproof!


Sixty-fiver all the best on your body healing - in the meantime that looks like a fun and zippy ride!

dweenk 07-31-17 10:11 AM

@Sixty Fiver
Cool, is that a Honda 50?

Sixty Fiver 07-31-17 01:52 PM


Originally Posted by dweenk (Post 19757546)
@Sixty Fiver
Cool, is that a Honda 50?

Honda 70 Passport / Super Cub

Sixty Fiver 07-31-17 01:55 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19755926)
Good to hear from you Keith, hope you heal up.

A Passport 90? C&V!

It is a 1982 70cc version... bought it with 2800 original miles and she just rolled over 4800 miles this week.

Gets over 100 mpg in stop and go traffic and cruises nicely at 40 mph which is better than a scooter... on the right day she will flirt with 50 mph.

She's a three speed too. :D

cambiker71 07-31-17 02:43 PM

Just been given this, it's certainly english and three speeds :thumb:

A poor, unloved post bike that seems to have been painted in the dark with floor paint :(

https://s5.postimg.org/useo74czb/post_bike.jpg

BigChief 07-31-17 04:59 PM

Yes, an old English post office bike. How cool. Those round lugs were used to mount a front rack.
1935 CWS ?Federal? Post Office Inspector?s Bicycle | The Online Bicycle Museum

ollo_ollo 07-31-17 09:26 PM


Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver (Post 19758117)
It is a 1982 70cc version... bought it with 2800 original miles and she just rolled over 4800 miles this week.

Gets over 100 mpg in stop and go traffic and cruises nicely at 40 mph which is better than a scooter... on the right day she will flirt with 50 mph.

She's a three speed too. :D

The ad campaign back then was "DON'T WALK"! Riding is always better. Don


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