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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

BigChief 04-20-18 05:31 AM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20295652)
It's reassuring to know that solutions are available even if there isn't a problem. I've got to look up "knarp." Where the heck does that word come from? Biggest concern right now is those rims.

CR-18s would be nice! One thing to consider...You may not need to raise the bars. After you raise the seatpost and get the leg extension you want, you may be perfectly happy with the upper body position with the bars where they are now. Raising the bars does give you some more problems to solve. For one, making up custom length cables, but I can say that I am very pleased with the way my 21" Rudge turned out with the tall SunLite stem. Handles beautifully. To me, all this stuff is fun. Not sure how you feel about it. I prefer the Sunlite stem over longer Raleigh stems and stem extenders because the Sunlite has a longer neck to the clamp that makes up for the reach from the saddle you loose as the bars get higher.

Attachment 608158

thumpism 04-20-18 05:47 AM

Looks like they're breaking up the set that was advertised for $150.

https://richmond.craigslist.org/bik/...565325045.html

Vintage Ladies Raleigh City Bike - $50 (Chester, Va)

https://images.craigslist.org/01717_...pj_600x450.jpg

East Hundred Road

condition: good
make / manufacturer: Raleigh
model name / number: Sports 3 speed
size / dimensions: 54cm

Ladies Raleigh Sports 3 speed, very good condition but will need tires for daily use. Frame

measures 54cm and seat and grips are included. Call or text show contact info
for more info.

BigChief 04-20-18 08:07 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20295672)

These projects can be a "Slow Burn".
I found a rounded crank arm last week and installed on a project I
had "finished" 2 years ago.

Yes!! That's part of the fun. I like this Rudge a lot. To me it's very much worth long term touch ups. I would have fun hunting down better rims, pinch bolt brakes if it needed new cables and a period correct shifter. Someday I'd get it a new Brooks B66 and a Carradice bag:love: At first, I think I would just do the normal servicing, clean and touch up rusty spots on the paint, go over the paint with polishing compound and wax and ride it for the summer.

gster 04-20-18 08:42 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20295933)
Yes!! That's part of the fun. I like this Rudge a lot. To me it's very much worth long term touch ups. I would have fun hunting down better rims, pinch bolt brakes if it needed new cables and a period correct shifter. Someday I'd get it a new Brooks B66 and a Carradice bag:love: At first, I think I would just do the normal servicing, clean and touch up rusty spots on the paint, go over the paint with polishing compound and wax and ride it for the summer.

Agreed.
Get it serviced and on the road and then work on the upgrades/improvements etc. as time permits.

markk900 04-20-18 09:20 AM

+1 on the tin foil for the chrome - most of not all of that surface rust will be gone with a little elbow grease. I use WD40 as a bit of a lune when I do the foil trick.

rustystrings61 04-20-18 09:58 AM

The '63 Rudge above is almost identical to the one I had when I was a college student in the 80s - only mine had a front dynohub. It was a wonderful bike and is one of exactly two bikes I genuinely wish I had hung onto. I suspect you will find it to have a special ride quality that I somehow never quite got out of the allegedly identical Raleighs. Maybe it was all in my head.

Beautiful bike, btw.

rhm 04-20-18 10:25 AM


Originally Posted by johnnyspaghetti (Post 20295201)

I don't think so. I suspect the shifter shown is made in England, but not by Sturmey Archer. Brampton made shifters that looked a lot like that --same curve to the trigger, anyway. More than a couple other English companies made Sturmey Archer hubs under license; BSA, Brampton, and Hercules come to mind, and I may be missing something.

rhm 04-20-18 10:33 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20295398)
I hope you don't need to change them. I never do unless they're frayed. I have seen people use cable knarps, but the cleanest method is to silver braze a piece of steel that fits the caliper onto a new cable end. Another method to swap out the calipers for later Raleigh calipers that use a pinch bolt.

+1.

Another way to make a custom cable is to crimp a spoke nipple onto the end of the cable. You need all the correct Raleigh small parts from an old brake cable, as well as new housing, cable, and a spoke nipple. If you use a proper crimper tool, the spoke nipple is virtually impossible to remove. For a crimper, I especially like one made by HPK for Bell Systems, by the thousands, back in the days of land line telephones; available on ebay for $10-$20. If you get it in the wrong place, you need to cut it off and try again.

paulb_in_bkln 04-20-18 10:51 AM

All great suggestions. Thank you all. I hadn't thought of using WD40 with the aluminum foil. This bike is much cooler than what I anticipated. I keep the Sports step thru mechanically perfect because I ride it so much, but looks-wise it's kind of a beater. That won't fly with this Rudge. First thing is straighten the crank so I can spend time on it. It just nudges the chainstay and I want to avoid making a spot in the paint.

johnnyspaghetti 04-20-18 11:06 AM


Originally Posted by rhm (Post 20296296)
I don't think so. I suspect the shifter shown is made in England, but not by Sturmey Archer. Brampton made shifters that looked a lot like that --same curve to the trigger, anyway. More than a couple other English companies made Sturmey Archer hubs under license; BSA, Brampton, and Hercules come to mind, and I may be missing something.

I thought Brampton. It's on a 1959 Schwinn so it's not English but my have English roots to it's gearing.

johnnyspaghetti 04-20-18 11:41 AM


Originally Posted by oldveloman (Post 20294343)
Thanks, Johnny.
So this Triumph Sports must be 1961, 1962, or 1963.
We are getting closer :)

Seems like a bargain, that '61 Raleigh you got there !

Peter

I would say 1960 & pre 1960 is metal spring cover BB oiler which are nice. Post 1960 as in 1961 all 1962's have plastic oilers on the bottom bracket not unlike like 3 speed hubs. I would say all oil ports dissaperred mostly in 1963. This is what I see & not fact. I have a Asian Raleigh a 1985 or 86 TCW SA that actually has a metal spring loaded oiler on the Front hub. That says Phillips in the stamping.

johnnyspaghetti 04-20-18 12:00 PM


Originally Posted by oldveloman (Post 20293416)
Thanks BigChief, that' s a lot of help !

As I said before, this Triumph Sports was a single speed bike when bought 25 years ago and I fitted a '77 3-speed wheel a few years later. So no clue there.
It has alloy Weinmann Type 810 brakes.
The oil port ( with plastic cup ) in the bottom bracket and the full chaincase mounting lug are there, as can be seen from the pictures below.
It has wire mudguard stays front and rear bolted into brazed-on lugs.

Would be nice to find a list of serial numbers too though, as XY8567 doesn' t fit in the Raleigh numbering system as far as I can see.
I have a mid-sixties ladies Triumph that has a normal Raleigh number ( 1915219 ) for that era and I had others that fitted in too...

Peter

I see the nice front hub with chrome nuts that look in excellent shape & will clean up nice. Also, the Threaded hub shaft has a keyway cut into meaning you have washers that have a stop notch in them that slide on the shaft keyway. I could go look but I don't think any Raleigh built bikes had key way cut front threaded axle after 1962

johnnyspaghetti 04-20-18 12:21 PM


Originally Posted by oldveloman (Post 20293416)
Thanks BigChief, that' s a lot of help !

As I said before, this Triumph Sports was a single speed bike when bought 25 years ago and I fitted a '77 3-speed wheel a few years later. So no clue there.
It has alloy Weinmann Type 810 brakes.
The oil port ( with plastic cup ) in the bottom bracket and the full chaincase mounting lug are there, as can be seen from the pictures below.
It has wire mudguard stays front and rear bolted into brazed-on lugs.

Would be nice to find a list of serial numbers too though, as XY8567 doesn' t fit in the Raleigh numbering system as far as I can see.
I have a mid-sixties ladies Triumph that has a normal Raleigh number ( 1915219 ) for that era and I had others that fitted in too...

Peter

The bb I would say is 61-62 Paint scheme is 61 Canada did this too. then it's a Belgium bike so the only odd thing I see is whineemen brakes. I know spell check but aluminium brakes may take a pound off a 36lbs bike.

desconhecido 04-20-18 12:29 PM


Originally Posted by rhm (Post 20296310)
+1.

Another way to make a custom cable is to crimp a spoke nipple onto the end of the cable. You need all the correct Raleigh small parts from an old brake cable, as well as new housing, cable, and a spoke nipple. If you use a proper crimper tool, the spoke nipple is virtually impossible to remove. For a crimper, I especially like one made by HPK for Bell Systems, by the thousands, back in the days of land line telephones; available on ebay for $10-$20. If you get it in the wrong place, you need to cut it off and try again.

A couple years ago, while persuing the SJS listing of SA parts, I happened upon Sturmey Archer front and rear brake cables that look quite siimilar to what's on old Sports bicycles. I bought one of each and think I could find them if I had to, but I never got around to checking if they would work and on which style of brake they would work. They are still on the site: HSK750 and HSK748.

BigChief 04-21-18 07:27 AM

If it was a bit closer, I'd buy this old Norman just for the chainring. It's already set up semi scorcher style with a tall stem.
https://images.craigslist.org/01111_...ov_600x450.jpg

https://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/bi...561259199.html

paulb_in_bkln 04-21-18 07:45 AM

Just saw this sale of an old Rudge. Hmmm.
Wondering about the paint on the black '63. Would this have been a matte finish originally? (It is now.) Also, on my Raleigh the top of the stem is stamped with some sort of crest or escutcheon. Rudge's stem is blank. As it should be? Finally, those rims. Oy. I'll be looking soon at my third set of CR18s, I think. Although, I've just seen that R&R makes chromed steel rims called SEBCOs that look a lot like the originals, and assuming it's possible to actually buy them... Well, I dunno. They wouldn't fool anyone who knew what they were looking at. The CR18s looked good on the Raleigh when they were new and even though they are kind of hacked up now I'd take better care of the Rudge. I could only show my LBS friend a few pictures and describe the bike, but he says I found a deal.

Ballenxj 04-21-18 07:48 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20297803)
If it was a bit closer, I'd buy this old Norman just for the chainring. It's already set up semi scorcher style with a tall stem.
https://images.craigslist.org/01111_...ov_600x450.jpg

https://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/bi...561259199.html

WOW! What a COOL looking chainring which I have never seen the likes of before. :thumb:

paulb_in_bkln 04-21-18 07:50 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20297803)
If it was a bit closer, I'd buy this old Norman just for the chainring. It's already set up semi scorcher style with a tall stem.
https://images.craigslist.org/01111_...ov_600x450.jpg

https://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/bi...561259199.html

That is so cool.

Kilroy1988 04-21-18 07:58 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20297803)
If it was a bit closer, I'd buy this old Norman just for the chainring. It's already set up semi scorcher style with a tall stem.

As a medieval historian, I'd love to have something like that. However, I would be forever bothered by the fact that the men are spinning backwards as I pedaled along... The Normans did not retreat to claim England in 1066!

johnnyspaghetti 04-21-18 08:20 AM


Originally Posted by oldveloman (Post 20294343)
Thanks, Johnny.
So this Triumph Sports must be 1961, 1962, or 1963.
We are getting closer :)

Seems like a bargain, that '61 Raleigh you got there !

Peter

I am not sure of anything, and paid to much for the 61. But I paid. Another winter project postponed. Cost too much to heat garage. Now I have 3 cool spring projects with snow on ground now. Today looks good. Nothing is perfect in Pigseye.

paulb_in_bkln 04-21-18 08:32 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20297803)
If it was a bit closer, I'd buy this old Norman just for the chainring. It's already set up semi scorcher style with a tall stem.
https://images.craigslist.org/01111_...ov_600x450.jpg

https://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/bi...561259199.html

And every knight wondering if coconuts migrate.

BigChief 04-21-18 09:57 AM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20297831)
Just saw this sale of an old Rudge. Hmmm.
Wondering about the paint on the black '63. Would this have been a matte finish originally? (It is now.) Also, on my Raleigh the top of the stem is stamped with some sort of crest or escutcheon. Rudge's stem is blank. As it should be? Finally, those rims. Oy. I'll be looking soon at my third set of CR18s, I think. Although, I've just seen that R&R makes chromed steel rims called SEBCOs that look a lot like the originals, and assuming it's possible to actually buy them... Well, I dunno. They wouldn't fool anyone who knew what they were looking at. The CR18s looked good on the Raleigh when they were new and even though they are kind of hacked up now I'd take better care of the Rudge. I could only show my LBS friend a few pictures and describe the bike, but he says I found a deal.

Yours is a whole lot nicer. I suspect this one is over painted. The downtube transfer is barely visible. I have no idea what that number stamped into the BB is. Raleigh stamped serial numbers on the top of the seat tube lug at this time. It does have the hand chainring and this is the shifter yours should have, but I like yours much better. The original steel guide wheel has been replaced with a later plastic one.That stamp on the top of the stem is Raleighs "Sir Walter" Raleigh Industries logo. It shows the legendary tale of him laying his cloak over a mud puddle for the Queen. You'll also see it on crank arms. I've never seen it on older stems.
The enamel paint oxidizes over time. A fine polishing compound can bring back some luster and helps hide any touch up spots. Some people clear coat the paint which will put a like new gloss on it, but I prefer the patina of an old finish so I don't do anything more than a polish and wax.

paulb_in_bkln 04-21-18 10:06 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20295933)
Yes!! That's part of the fun. I like this Rudge a lot. To me it's very much worth long term touch ups. I would have fun hunting down better rims, pinch bolt brakes if it needed new cables and a period correct shifter. Someday I'd get it a new Brooks B66 and a Carradice bag:love: At first, I think I would just do the normal servicing, clean and touch up rusty spots on the paint, go over the paint with polishing compound and wax and ride it for the summer.

Bike shop friend says he might have the right shifter "in the basement," where I've been and just about anything could be down there. I favor the B72 but I think that would be as period correct as the B66. Carradice's bags are darn nice. It seems to me Rivendell had much to do with the revival in those. Possibly tomorrow I can get the bike over to the shop so Mike can straighten that crank and I can ride around a bit.

Edit: Sat and Sun are work days for me, hence my bike collecting expedition on a Thursday.

paulb_in_bkln 04-21-18 10:21 AM

1 Attachment(s)
In case you have not seen it, this sensational letter Jack Thurston received and then tweeted about. Not that I've anything against cruises, per se.

Chaser95 04-21-18 12:07 PM

2 Attachment(s)
The last time you saw my 72 Raleigh Sports it had a broken Brooks B-72 on it. (page 640) Big Chief suggested I contact RHM on this board as he recovers saddles. I did and I am so grateful for the suggestion. I had contemplated buying a new B-66 but when I contacted Rudi I was intrigued by his pictures and the way he described his work. What I have now is a recovered B-66 and it is my new favorite. This saddle is double layered where my B-72 broke. I have had little experience with leather saddles but, my backside knows what it likes! This makes riding a pleasure and I love the look. Check him out! Thanks Big Chief and RHM. I will be out riding!

bmc5733946 04-21-18 01:49 PM

Looking for clips for light cable/brake cable. I have two Raleigh Superbes and both are missing some of the combined brake and lighting cable clips and one or two of the wire clips for the front fork. Can anyone point me to a parts list that shows them or perhaps a source for them?


Brian

clubman 04-21-18 02:11 PM


Originally Posted by bmc5733946 (Post 20298378)
Looking for clips for light cable/brake cable. I have two Raleigh Superbes and both are missing some of the combined brake and lighting cable clips and one or two of the wire clips for the front fork. Can anyone point me to a parts list that shows them or perhaps a source for them?


Brian

That's a tough one, I can't find a reference to any of the wiring clips. Every other component, yes.
The only great source for these are other bikes unfortunately. Some folks are using some high tech clear tape on the inside of the fork, it's in one of the Dyno threads on this forum, somewhere.

paulb_in_bkln 04-21-18 03:24 PM


Originally Posted by Chaser95 (Post 20298240)
What I have now is a recovered B-66 and it is my new favorite. This saddle is double layered where my B-72 broke. I have had little experience with leather saddles but, my backside knows what it likes! This makes riding a pleasure and I love the look. Check him out! Thanks Big Chief and RHM. I will be out riding!

!!!! I tossed two B72 frames because I couldn't find any information about recovering them. Oh well. (I assume the charge is favorable compared with a new one?)

johnnyspaghetti 04-21-18 04:04 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20297803)
If it was a bit closer, I'd buy this old Norman just for the chainring. It's already set up semi scorcher style with a tall stem.
https://images.craigslist.org/01111_...ov_600x450.jpg

https://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/bi...561259199.html

You know I would.

markk900 04-21-18 04:29 PM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20298505)
!!!! I tossed two B72 frames because I couldn't find any information about recovering them. Oh well. (I assume the charge is favorable compared with a new one?)

Yes...and quality is superb (no pun intended).....


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