Bike Forums

Bike Forums (https://www.bikeforums.net/forum.php)
-   Classic & Vintage (https://www.bikeforums.net/forumdisplay.php?f=181)
-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

3speedslow 03-23-19 03:30 PM

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f793c0ba6.jpeg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...41c68d853.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e14e54144.jpeg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cbb22cccb.jpeg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ac9a83026.jpeg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d295562bf.jpeg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f848084da.jpeg
Mine for 70$! 1979 March Raleigh Twenty folder Canadian. Wheels 451 20 X 1 3/8 sized. Coffee colour.


backstory on this... mans cousin bought these( two, I bought one) in Canada when he sailed the Great Lakes. When it was time to go salt water, he did not want to bring them along. He sold them to Alan who used them with his wife touring in their RV. They liked full cruiser bikes so put them in the shed and let them sit. Wife died and he decided it was time to start unloading. Put new tires and such on them but still wanted to sell again. I found them on CL a week after I started work on the Cinzia.


They just sat there so I finally called. My sister drove me up there and I picked what I considered the best out of the two. Both were in great condition. Barely a hint of rust anywhere! Visit to the LBS left it with a bad cable nipple at the brake line, front fork stop put on wrong and a lousy rear kickstand installed.


When I get over the car ride(nausea and imbalance) and drug to minimize, I will do a clean and fit.

Bike visit done by the PO, not me.
As now home pics:

clubman 03-23-19 04:21 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851444)
19?? Hercules
So I did buy the bike.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...05c9929965.jpg

Nice. I really like the curved brake bridge and the flared seat stays. My wife's Eatons-Herc re-brand has the same. I think her bike was post war with the Eadie hub and rolled fenders with lips. Your fenders do look pre-war, as BigChief suggested, maybe even as early as the twenties. The saddle may be your best clue. The crank looks like a Williams but it could easily be a replacement.

Eatons Commander

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...57ce84761d.jpg

BigChief 03-23-19 05:15 PM

Wow, what an exciting find! Here's that crank in the 1930 catalog. I know it's a big project and long term, but it's a great one. Breathing new life into this grand old roadster would be a fantastic achievement.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...35eaa959c8.jpg

sd5782 03-23-19 05:22 PM

Waiting for pics
 

Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20851074)
FWIW, depending on your market, $300 is likely fair. Remember that newer models tend to have less robust chrome, more galvanized nuts and bolts adding up to a slightly less overall build quality than older models. Asking 2K is unethical but that's nothing new for ebay.

i am waiting for pics on this bike at this time to see what it is. Certainly not the quality surely as the older ones, but still could have quite a bit of “mojo” as it would still be 40 yeats old. It would be interesting as they weren’t imported to the USA.

Buellster 03-23-19 06:25 PM

Interesting find today. A 81 Voyageur 11.8 someone converted into a 3 speed. Thought it was my size but mismeasured at purchase. May be able to make it work, I've ridden 23" before but it is often a squeeze.
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...a13572a79f.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2de3b27294.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5a9422e474.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...021c417fe0.jpg

SA hub says 62
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...bed5626234.jpg

Notch cut in to accomadate chainring. Why not just get a longer spindle?

clubman 03-23-19 06:44 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Apart from the chainstay clearance, what's with this 2 bolt bracket and why is it there other than to interfere with the gear cable?

Otherwise a nice effort.

BigChief 03-23-19 07:06 PM

Here's an image from the Hercules parts catalog of 1931. Now we have the HERCULES chainring. So, from period catalogs at least, the style chainring on your bike would suggest a date of 1930 or earlier. Notice the black painted centers on the rims. Nice touch.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e9494b8808.jpg

gster 03-23-19 07:12 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20851807)
Wow, what an exciting find! Here's that crank in the 1930 catalog. I know it's a big project and long term, but it's a great one. Breathing new life into this grand old roadster would be a fantastic achievement.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...35eaa959c8.jpg

Thanks for the vote.
I looked through the catalogues and this was the closest match that I found as well.
I can't find any serial # cipher but someone knows...
WC1885...
The tyres are made in Canada Dunlops.
The hubs are stamped Hercules and I'll examine the remains of the saddle
for any clues.
The listing states gold and red striping
The red is there.
I'll look for evidence of the gold.
I'm sure is was quite impressive when it was new.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7c95e0d28e.jpg

gster 03-23-19 07:27 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20851935)
Here's an image from the Hercules parts catalog of 1931. Now we have the HERCULES chainring. So, from period catalogs at least, the style chainring on your bike would suggest a date of 1930 or earlier. Notice the black painted centers on the rims. Nice touch.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e9494b8808.jpg

I think you'd make a good detective..
This model does NOT have a stamped H on the headlight bracket unlike
the previous year.
Another clew (old spelling)...

markk900 03-24-19 04:43 AM

Had a chance finally to road test the Humber yesterday. Getting nicer but apparently more snow than Toronto here still! Shake down ride went extremely well other than the annoying bang of the rear calliper into the seat stays when using the back brake - any ideas how to curtail that? https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c1bc7b6ff.jpeghttps://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...95bb77713.jpeg

markk900 03-24-19 05:03 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20846843)
Brilliant! Excellent work. So nice to see. I love projects like this. That reflector looks to be the same 1 3/4", measured including the rubber case, type that was used for a long time on English roadsters. I'll bet with some careful Exacto knife work, one could remove the lens from a Lucas reflector and replace it with that original one.

Just catching up- @PeterLYoung: lovely job! As to the reflector I just did this on the Humber - the black rubber was almost completely disintegrated. Bought one of those repros on EBay with the funny Red R in the reflector - completely wrong but the rubber outer is almost an exact match (if you don’t worry about the missing lettering) and the moulding is not bad for the price. The reflector/lens moved right over. Btw: the “reflector” looked uncannily like a piece of tin foil folder over....almost certain it was original though!

BigChief 03-24-19 06:13 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852227)


Just catching up- @PeterLYoung: lovely job! As to the reflector I just did this on the Humber - the black rubber was almost completely disintegrated. Bought one of those repros on EBay with the funny Red R in the reflector - completely wrong but the rubber outer is almost an exact match (if you don’t worry about the missing lettering) and the moulding is not bad for the price. The reflector/lens moved right over. Btw: the “reflector” looked uncannily like a piece of tin foil folder over....almost certain it was original though!

That Humber is stunning. Great job. My Rudge has the same frame and here's what the rear brake looks like. I don't hear a clunk, but the caliper spring contacts the seat stay as it flexes forward.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f753334104.jpg

BigChief 03-24-19 06:28 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851957)
I think you'd make a good detective..
This model does NOT have a stamped H on the headlight bracket unlike
the previous year.
Another clew (old spelling)...

I learned something new researching this one. I always thought Raleigh came up with the idea of using the brake stirrup as a return spring. Apparently, that was an idea they borrowed from Hercules. From the looks of them, the rear axle stand and chainguard were added to this bike early on. I have seen those stands on 30s American bikes and very early motorcycles, but there's no sign of them in any of the English catalogs I've seen from that time. They always had a clip on the mudguard to hold them up. I don't see one on yours.

PeterLYoung 03-24-19 06:37 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851444)

That has to be at least early 1950's, possibly pre war. A great acquisition and because that generation were made from high quality materials I think you will be surprised at its condition as you dismantle. I see quite a few Hercules parts are of ebay, a nice crank set currently. You did very well!!!!

sd5782 03-24-19 06:39 AM

Raleigh Royal Roadster disappointment
 
Got some pics of a European model Raleigh that I was considering. Turns out it is a women model. Not trying to be sexist, but I would guess that would knock the collector value down considerably. Thought I would post particulars in case others here are interested. I talked to the seller on phone, and he seemed very pleasant. He got the bike many years ago while living in Europe. It is very pretty in pics. He is near Ann Arbor and the northern Detroit suburbs he said.

https://detroit.craigslist.org/okl/b...835323203.html


https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e6e9852080.jpg

Raleigh Royal Roadster
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...a5f6fda555.jpg

PeterLYoung 03-24-19 06:56 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852227)


Just catching up- @PeterLYoung: lovely job! As to the reflector I just did this on the Humber - the black rubber was almost completely disintegrated. Bought one of those repros on EBay with the funny Red R in the reflector - completely wrong but the rubber outer is almost an exact match (if you don’t worry about the missing lettering) and the moulding is not bad for the price. The reflector/lens moved right over. Btw: the “reflector” looked uncannily like a piece of tin foil folder over....almost certain it was original though!

I have been looking on EBay but no luck at present except for one that is too far gone to be worthwhile, will keep looking, if I can get a nice rubber one I can transfer my existing lens which is in good shape. Thanks for the advice.

browngw 03-24-19 06:59 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852223)
Had a chance finally to road test the Humber yesterday. Getting nicer but apparently more snow than Toronto here still! Shake down ride went extremely well other than the annoying bang of the rear calliper into the seat stays when using the back brake - any ideas how to curtail that? https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c1bc7b6ff.jpeg

Very sharp looking Humber! Saddle, tires, that great blue colour all add up to beautiful bike. Job well done!

PeterLYoung 03-24-19 06:59 AM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20851745)
Nice. I really like the curved brake bridge and the flared seat stays. My wife's Eatons-Herc re-brand has the same. I think her bike was post war with the Eadie hub and rolled fenders with lips. Your fenders do look pre-war, as BigChief suggested, maybe even as early as the twenties. The saddle may be your best clue. The crank looks like a Williams but it could easily be a replacement.

Eatons Commander

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...57ce84761d.jpg

The brake is curved to fit the profile of the Fender which is bolted vertically through the brake bridge same as on my 1936 BSA Roadster.

markk900 03-24-19 08:03 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20852269)
That Humber is stunning. Great job. My Rudge has the same frame and here's what the rear brake looks like. I don't hear a clunk, but the caliper spring contacts the seat stay as it flexes forward.

I have identical calipers, same set up. I think the problem is exacerbated by the rims being a little rough and I put new Koolstop Continentals on it...So they do grab a bit on parts of the rim. I know the sound is the caliper flexing forward and hitting the stays; I had previously put some inner tube patches on the stays to reduce the clunk but since I repainted that looked a little shabby chic. I know there were pad holders with the stop on them available but the only set I have are on my wife's 1956 Standard. Perhaps pads glued to the back of the arm would work?

And thanks for the encouragement folks! I *had* to repaint as the old paint really was bad - now I feel much better about riding the bike (and it got a complete redo of all lubrication while it was apart, not that it had been *that* long since the last one a few years back).

markk900 03-24-19 08:06 AM


Originally Posted by PeterLYoung (Post 20852313)
I have been looking on EBay but no luck at present except for one that is too far gone to be worthwhile, will keep looking, if I can get a nice rubber one I can transfer my existing lens which is in good shape. Thanks for the advice.

There are a couple of the Lucas/Raleigh Industry ones in white - at silly money in most cases, and to send to me in Canada shipping is absolutely stupid (not paying $60USD for a reflector!). However there was one I saw (suitable for 50s so maybe too new for you) currently at around $6, and if you send to your US address I bet the shipping wouldn't be too bad. Lens is amber but you wouldn't care about that!

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/VINTAGE-BICY...IAAOSwJYFazA0M

browngw 03-24-19 08:16 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852398)
I have identical calipers, same set up. I think the problem is exacerbated by the rims being a little rough and I put new Koolstop Continentals on it...So they do grab a bit on parts of the rim. I know the sound is the caliper flexing forward and hitting the stays; I had previously put some inner tube patches on the stays to reduce the clunk but since I repainted that looked a little shabby chic. I know there were pad holders with the stop on them available but the only set I have are on my wife's 1956 Standard. Perhaps pads glued to the back of the arm would work?

And thanks for the encouragement folks! I *had* to repaint as the old paint really was bad - now I feel much better about riding the bike (and it got a complete redo of all lubrication while it was apart, not that it had been *that* long since the last one a few years back).

Just had a thought! Scary! How about a nice piece of saddle color matching leather as a brake bumper? Could be laced or sewn on. On a Raleigh ATB to Drop bar a couple of years ago I had to go back to using old pads from my collection, the new ones squealed and jittered too much.

gster 03-24-19 08:42 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20852282)
I learned something new researching this one. I always thought Raleigh came up with the idea of using the brake stirrup as a return spring. Apparently, that was an idea they borrowed from Hercules. From the looks of them, the rear axle stand and chainguard were added to this bike early on. I have seen those stands on 30s American bikes and very early motorcycles, but there's no sign of them in any of the English catalogs I've seen from that time. They always had a clip on the mudguard to hold them up. I don't see one on yours.

I have to agree re: chainguard.
Not original to the bike but it's been on there
a very long time.
The kick stand has a bracket on either side (mis aligned) to
capture the stand.
I may remove it.
I may do a limited restore on this one.
Service the bearings etc., new rubber and pads
new chain and saddle.
The front wheel spins freely and appears true(ish).
I'll leave the paint alone as it's a nice time capsule.
Pedals are somewhat intact with Hercules still
visible on the rubber blocks.
It would be nice to date it accurately.
Your suggestion of 1930 or earlier seems on track.
I'm going to try some of that Evapo Rust you suggested.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...888c550ac4.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...27d0c71ce7.jpg
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f423c63db5.jpg

gster 03-24-19 08:43 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852223)
Had a chance finally to road test the Humber yesterday. Getting nicer but apparently more snow than Toronto here still! Shake down ride went extremely well other than the annoying bang of the rear calliper into the seat stays when using the back brake - any ideas how to curtail that? https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c1bc7b6ff.jpeghttps://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...95bb77713.jpeg

That's a very attractive bike.

gster 03-24-19 08:46 AM


Originally Posted by PeterLYoung (Post 20852292)
That has to be at least early 1950's, possibly pre war. A great acquisition and because that generation were made from high quality materials I think you will be surprised at its condition as you dismantle. I see quite a few Hercules parts are of ebay, a nice crank set currently. You did very well!!!!

Thank you!
Hopefully I can do it justice.

gster 03-24-19 09:18 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20852269)
That Humber is stunning. Great job. My Rudge has the same frame and here's what the rear brake looks like. I don't hear a clunk, but the caliper spring contacts the seat stay as it flexes forward.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f753334104.jpg

Here's the rear caliper in my BSA. The spring is reversed
placing it further from the stay.
I think this is correct..
I'll check my "control" (untouched) Superbe to
see how it's set up.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7200bdde97.jpg
On a positive note.
That spill I took on the BSA a few weeks ago prompted me to make a fuss
with the city and the pot hole of death was repaired....
the seat and the bell took a beating.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...088a745a43.jpg
Despite my bravado, it took me longer to recover
from the fall than I thought.
I'm not 25 anymore.

gster 03-24-19 09:25 AM

Are these perverts trying to look up her skirt???
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...282197f5dd.jpg
And is that person with the ukulele a man or a woman??

PeterLYoung 03-24-19 09:58 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852223)
Had a chance finally to road test the Humber yesterday. Getting nicer but apparently more snow than Toronto here still! Shake down ride went extremely well other than the annoying bang of the rear calliper into the seat stays when using the back brake - any ideas how to curtail that? https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c1bc7b6ff.jpeghttps://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...95bb77713.jpeg

Regarding the banging of the Rear Brakes, 1) one thing is the brake spindle a good fit and properly tight in the frame bridge? 2) you can get brake block holders with a tab that bears against the rear stay, acting as the stop when the brakes are applied, some bikes were fitted with them as standard. Should cure the problem all else being equal!!!

browngw 03-24-19 10:27 AM

Finally got the 23" framed 1972 Raleigh Sports ( Root Beer Express ) out for its first ride since I purchased it last summer. Very pleased with the ride and look of the bike. Saddle needs to be adjusted slightly (nose up) and I did not tighten the bars to the stem enough. The only change in the future might be those pedals which were original to the bike. They feel tiny and delicate under my size 12 feet.
Pretty drab out today and with a brown bike (coffee) but at least the snow is gone and its warmer. I thought the wider than usual bag might be in the way but it works and should be great for errands around town.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c4c8c9dfc3.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...36d520e2cc.jpg

gster 03-24-19 10:52 AM


Originally Posted by browngw (Post 20852626)
Finally got the 23" framed 1972 Raleigh Sports ( Root Beer Express ) out for its first ride since I purchased it last summer. Very pleased with the ride and look of the bike. Saddle needs to be adjusted slightly (nose up) and I did not tighten the bars to the stem enough. The only change in the future might be those pedals which were original to the bike. They feel tiny and delicate under my size 12 feet.
Pretty drab out today and with a brown bike (coffee) but at least the snow is gone and its warmer. I thought the wider than usual bag might be in the way but it works and should be great for errands around town.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c4c8c9dfc3.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...36d520e2cc.jpg

Another classic.

BigChief 03-24-19 10:54 AM


Originally Posted by browngw (Post 20852626)
Finally got the 23" framed 1972 Raleigh Sports ( Root Beer Express ) out for its first ride since I purchased it last summer. Very pleased with the ride and look of the bike. Saddle needs to be adjusted slightly (nose up) and I did not tighten the bars to the stem enough. The only change in the future might be those pedals which were original to the bike. They feel tiny and delicate under my size 12 feet.
Pretty drab out today and with a brown bike (coffee) but at least the snow is gone and its warmer. I thought the wider than usual bag might be in the way but it works and should be great for errands around town.

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c4c8c9dfc3.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...36d520e2cc.jpg

Ole Root Beer Express is looking mighty good. So nice the B67 and 66 saddles have those frame mounted bag loops so you can use bigger heavier bags. Those little eyelets cut into the leather of the B72 aren't very confidence inspiring. I might even get a short ride in today if I stop poking around the internet and get my quick books finished.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:54 PM.


Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.