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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

BigChief 03-22-19 08:10 PM

As far as I know, Raleigh never marketed a model with that name. Or do you mean a bike badged Royal that you figure was made in Nottingham by Raleigh? That could be. Raleigh made many custom badged bikes for customers and I'm learning of new ones all the time. Never saw a Royal though. That would be one more new one to me.

clubman 03-22-19 08:25 PM


Originally Posted by sd5782 (Post 20850726)
Needing a bit of help from the experts. I am going to be in contact with someone with a Raleigh Royal Roadster. I haven’t talked to him yet, but from the limited info I have it was purchased in Europe or England and is in “beautiful” shape.

My limited research would point me to the later version that I have seen pictured that was made in the late 70s. I couldn’t believe it would be a great survivor from the 50s. Is that late 70s version desirable? They look nice in picks with all the extras.
it has the rod brakes, enclosed chain, pump, basket, rack, new tires. What is a fair price for a nice one? $250-$300 maybe.

They were Euro models, maybe Danish and Dutch and I wouldn't think earlier than mid 70's.
One for sale on ebay right now. Royale Roadsters to be specific.
https://www.benl.ebay.be/itm/Beautif...-/273102955034

BigChief 03-22-19 08:34 PM

Ah yes, the danish Raleighs. Still being made. look like nice bikes.

https://www.raleigh.dk/

gster 03-22-19 08:54 PM


Originally Posted by Chr0m0ly (Post 20850589)
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...bde77a0c9.jpeg
Turns out, mines Canadian too! lol, there's a Canadian shop sticker on the seat tube!

I checked my hub, it was made in June of 1980, so need than I had thought. I've oiled the hub, and the BB. I now have two speeds, and "neutral"! My tires look to be original, but I still aired them up to 50psi, and totted around my block a little. First ride!
Reactions:
1) New wheels, brake calipers, and headset will be essential to making this feel like a real bicycle.
2) The cranks are a tiny bit warped, not a ton, but it's there.
3) Sweet JEBUS is this thing heavy! Put it up on my shop table to lube it, and I think a popped a rib out of place! 😆
4) That frame is awesome. I think the diet will do wonders to wake up the ride.
5) The stock saddle needs to be buried where it can't harm anyone.
6) It's really fun, VERY different from any of my other bikes, I like it a lot already, and I'm excited to see what is possible with the frame!

Maybe these are the original BMX bikes,

gster 03-23-19 05:58 AM

Another Superbe on Kijiji, Toronto
Seller is asking a reasonable $159.00
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...763fab0474.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e0ee088253.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e9ebccb629.jpg

clubman 03-23-19 07:03 AM


Originally Posted by sd5782 (Post 20850726)
What is a fair price for a nice one? $250-$300 maybe.[/left]

FWIW, depending on your market, $300 is likely fair. Remember that newer models tend to have less robust chrome, more galvanized nuts and bolts adding up to a slightly less overall build quality than older models. Asking 2K is unethical but that's nothing new for ebay.

gster 03-23-19 12:10 PM

19?? Hercules
So I did buy the bike.
$70.00 (CDN) and the guy delivered it
to my house.
Single speed and very complete.
28" rims.
Not to sure what I'll do with it.
Obviously a good cleaning first!
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...05cc221485.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...05c9929965.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...79a16a0297.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1d0c616181.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...11aad38ee1.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7547eb664a.jpg

gster 03-23-19 12:18 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851444)

Serial # is WC1885
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ac670613b0.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e58d1a38c3.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7ca71ed63d.jpg

browngw 03-23-19 12:57 PM

Good grab @gster! A unique long term project.

dweenk 03-23-19 01:25 PM

I hope that some of the stuff that looks like rust is only dirt and crud. Nice find, and a good price.

3speedslow 03-23-19 03:30 PM

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f793c0ba6.jpeg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...41c68d853.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e14e54144.jpeg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cbb22cccb.jpeg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ac9a83026.jpeg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d295562bf.jpeg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f848084da.jpeg
Mine for 70$! 1979 March Raleigh Twenty folder Canadian. Wheels 451 20 X 1 3/8 sized. Coffee colour.


backstory on this... mans cousin bought these( two, I bought one) in Canada when he sailed the Great Lakes. When it was time to go salt water, he did not want to bring them along. He sold them to Alan who used them with his wife touring in their RV. They liked full cruiser bikes so put them in the shed and let them sit. Wife died and he decided it was time to start unloading. Put new tires and such on them but still wanted to sell again. I found them on CL a week after I started work on the Cinzia.


They just sat there so I finally called. My sister drove me up there and I picked what I considered the best out of the two. Both were in great condition. Barely a hint of rust anywhere! Visit to the LBS left it with a bad cable nipple at the brake line, front fork stop put on wrong and a lousy rear kickstand installed.


When I get over the car ride(nausea and imbalance) and drug to minimize, I will do a clean and fit.

Bike visit done by the PO, not me.
As now home pics:

clubman 03-23-19 04:21 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851444)
19?? Hercules
So I did buy the bike.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...05c9929965.jpg

Nice. I really like the curved brake bridge and the flared seat stays. My wife's Eatons-Herc re-brand has the same. I think her bike was post war with the Eadie hub and rolled fenders with lips. Your fenders do look pre-war, as BigChief suggested, maybe even as early as the twenties. The saddle may be your best clue. The crank looks like a Williams but it could easily be a replacement.

Eatons Commander

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...57ce84761d.jpg

BigChief 03-23-19 05:15 PM

Wow, what an exciting find! Here's that crank in the 1930 catalog. I know it's a big project and long term, but it's a great one. Breathing new life into this grand old roadster would be a fantastic achievement.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...35eaa959c8.jpg

sd5782 03-23-19 05:22 PM

Waiting for pics
 

Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20851074)
FWIW, depending on your market, $300 is likely fair. Remember that newer models tend to have less robust chrome, more galvanized nuts and bolts adding up to a slightly less overall build quality than older models. Asking 2K is unethical but that's nothing new for ebay.

i am waiting for pics on this bike at this time to see what it is. Certainly not the quality surely as the older ones, but still could have quite a bit of “mojo” as it would still be 40 yeats old. It would be interesting as they weren’t imported to the USA.

Buellster 03-23-19 06:25 PM

Interesting find today. A 81 Voyageur 11.8 someone converted into a 3 speed. Thought it was my size but mismeasured at purchase. May be able to make it work, I've ridden 23" before but it is often a squeeze.
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...a13572a79f.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2de3b27294.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5a9422e474.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...021c417fe0.jpg

SA hub says 62
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...bed5626234.jpg

Notch cut in to accomadate chainring. Why not just get a longer spindle?

clubman 03-23-19 06:44 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Apart from the chainstay clearance, what's with this 2 bolt bracket and why is it there other than to interfere with the gear cable?

Otherwise a nice effort.

BigChief 03-23-19 07:06 PM

Here's an image from the Hercules parts catalog of 1931. Now we have the HERCULES chainring. So, from period catalogs at least, the style chainring on your bike would suggest a date of 1930 or earlier. Notice the black painted centers on the rims. Nice touch.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e9494b8808.jpg

gster 03-23-19 07:12 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20851807)
Wow, what an exciting find! Here's that crank in the 1930 catalog. I know it's a big project and long term, but it's a great one. Breathing new life into this grand old roadster would be a fantastic achievement.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...35eaa959c8.jpg

Thanks for the vote.
I looked through the catalogues and this was the closest match that I found as well.
I can't find any serial # cipher but someone knows...
WC1885...
The tyres are made in Canada Dunlops.
The hubs are stamped Hercules and I'll examine the remains of the saddle
for any clues.
The listing states gold and red striping
The red is there.
I'll look for evidence of the gold.
I'm sure is was quite impressive when it was new.
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7c95e0d28e.jpg

gster 03-23-19 07:27 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20851935)
Here's an image from the Hercules parts catalog of 1931. Now we have the HERCULES chainring. So, from period catalogs at least, the style chainring on your bike would suggest a date of 1930 or earlier. Notice the black painted centers on the rims. Nice touch.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e9494b8808.jpg

I think you'd make a good detective..
This model does NOT have a stamped H on the headlight bracket unlike
the previous year.
Another clew (old spelling)...

markk900 03-24-19 04:43 AM

Had a chance finally to road test the Humber yesterday. Getting nicer but apparently more snow than Toronto here still! Shake down ride went extremely well other than the annoying bang of the rear calliper into the seat stays when using the back brake - any ideas how to curtail that? https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c1bc7b6ff.jpeghttps://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...95bb77713.jpeg

markk900 03-24-19 05:03 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20846843)
Brilliant! Excellent work. So nice to see. I love projects like this. That reflector looks to be the same 1 3/4", measured including the rubber case, type that was used for a long time on English roadsters. I'll bet with some careful Exacto knife work, one could remove the lens from a Lucas reflector and replace it with that original one.

Just catching up- @PeterLYoung: lovely job! As to the reflector I just did this on the Humber - the black rubber was almost completely disintegrated. Bought one of those repros on EBay with the funny Red R in the reflector - completely wrong but the rubber outer is almost an exact match (if you don’t worry about the missing lettering) and the moulding is not bad for the price. The reflector/lens moved right over. Btw: the “reflector” looked uncannily like a piece of tin foil folder over....almost certain it was original though!

BigChief 03-24-19 06:13 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 20852227)


Just catching up- @PeterLYoung: lovely job! As to the reflector I just did this on the Humber - the black rubber was almost completely disintegrated. Bought one of those repros on EBay with the funny Red R in the reflector - completely wrong but the rubber outer is almost an exact match (if you don’t worry about the missing lettering) and the moulding is not bad for the price. The reflector/lens moved right over. Btw: the “reflector” looked uncannily like a piece of tin foil folder over....almost certain it was original though!

That Humber is stunning. Great job. My Rudge has the same frame and here's what the rear brake looks like. I don't hear a clunk, but the caliper spring contacts the seat stay as it flexes forward.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f753334104.jpg

BigChief 03-24-19 06:28 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851957)
I think you'd make a good detective..
This model does NOT have a stamped H on the headlight bracket unlike
the previous year.
Another clew (old spelling)...

I learned something new researching this one. I always thought Raleigh came up with the idea of using the brake stirrup as a return spring. Apparently, that was an idea they borrowed from Hercules. From the looks of them, the rear axle stand and chainguard were added to this bike early on. I have seen those stands on 30s American bikes and very early motorcycles, but there's no sign of them in any of the English catalogs I've seen from that time. They always had a clip on the mudguard to hold them up. I don't see one on yours.

PeterLYoung 03-24-19 06:37 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20851444)

That has to be at least early 1950's, possibly pre war. A great acquisition and because that generation were made from high quality materials I think you will be surprised at its condition as you dismantle. I see quite a few Hercules parts are of ebay, a nice crank set currently. You did very well!!!!

sd5782 03-24-19 06:39 AM

Raleigh Royal Roadster disappointment
 
Got some pics of a European model Raleigh that I was considering. Turns out it is a women model. Not trying to be sexist, but I would guess that would knock the collector value down considerably. Thought I would post particulars in case others here are interested. I talked to the seller on phone, and he seemed very pleasant. He got the bike many years ago while living in Europe. It is very pretty in pics. He is near Ann Arbor and the northern Detroit suburbs he said.

https://detroit.craigslist.org/okl/b...835323203.html


https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e6e9852080.jpg

Raleigh Royal Roadster
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...a5f6fda555.jpg


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