Survived a Cougar Attack
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Wow. Quite a story.
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whew - some badass gals … fortunately
curious is it better to pin down a Cougar / animal with a steel bike - or is another material preferred ? … titanium … aluminum … carbon … magnesium ? … and if steel - preference on the joining method and tubing … ? … lugged … TIG’d … |
Geez, I know that radio station and know that bike shop, it's my LBS.
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Originally Posted by t2p
(Post 23186526)
whew - some bada$$ gals
fortunately
curious is it better to pin down a Cougar / animal with a steel bike - or is another material preferred ? titanium aluminum carbon magnesium ? and if steel - preference on the joining method and tubing ? lugged TIGd |
Holy moly, I have nothing in my repair kit for that.
Have had but one mtn lion encounter, off-trail in the remote eastern Yosemite backcountry, and it wanted nothing to do with us, appeared out of some cover, ran across a meadow and disappeared back into the bush. Camera in hand I did not even think of raising it in time to take a shot. After that we saw tracks EVERYWHERE as we hiked out, telling ourselves that deer are much more delicious. |
Originally Posted by t2p
(Post 23186526)
whew - some bada$$ gals
fortunately
curious is it better to pin down a Cougar / animal with a steel bike - or is another material preferred ? titanium aluminum carbon magnesium ? and if steel - preference on the joining method and tubing ? lugged TIGd |
Originally Posted by Rick_D
(Post 23188175)
Heh, everybody knows it won't touch you if you have a waxed chain. :-)
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Yes, they prefer cyclists to those on foot. Good to have a group ride.
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Sure chose her friends well.
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy
(Post 23189576)
Yes, they prefer cyclists to those on foot. Good to have a group ride.
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In socal they're prevalent and I've encountered several. They've almost always high tailed it when encountered. I reported one instance to the local Rangers and they discovered three deer kills in its "lair". Yikes, no wonder it seemed reluctant to leave, but I was backing out of there slowly while I hoisted my bike over my head to appear as large as possible.
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Originally Posted by Duragrouch
(Post 23189591)
My guess is the instinct to chase something that is running away from you, just like dogs. If true, stand fast and close together. I think if I ever ride in the hills, I'll want to bring some means of defense; I mentioned this story to locals near that area and they said there was another recent attack earlier than this one. I'd really rather not it be a pistol, I think that would freak out many fellow bikers and hikers, I'm very sensitive to that, not like many. I'm thinking a sheath knife (I recently saw a nice one of good steel and just below the maximum legal carry blade length of 3.5" in many municipalities), or my climbing axe. Somewhere I have some ancient 40 year old pepper spray from a temp job walking through neighborhoods. I guess I should replace that.
Back in the WA pioneer days, cougar attacks were not exactly common, but they happened. They found half eaten children with all their fingers gone. Large animal predators. Black bears mostly eat berries, grubs, insects, and fish if they can get them. Nice folks. Grizzlies are not at all the same. In Alaska a journalist went missing. They found his notebook and pencil. I'm an environmentalist, but I'm not in favor of a large scale reintroduction of grizzlies in the North Cascades. I hike a lot and used to work in the Olympic National Park backcountry. The Park, when I was there, thought there were about 60 cats. I've never seen a cougar, ever, even with at least a 1000 miles of backcountry travel around here. They're not a problem in their own habitat. One was spotted in a parking garage, probably looking for a nice small dog, so they're an issue in human habitat. And then there are all those "Lost Cat" posters that one sees. House cats never get lost. Not funny. |
When I look at other reports of large kitty attacks, they are more so on women and children. Unlike bears the cats are true carnivores. They are stealthy and size up their prey. This makes it very hard to plan any defence against them. The lady survived because of her friends persistence in helping her. Striking the cat in the head with a BFR worked out for them. The use of the knife not so much because the person wielding it had no training and didn't know the vulnerable areas to strike. Slitting the cats throat taking out an artery and the windpipe would work. The only chemical spray that might work is bear spray and it is likely that everybody would have have been affected by it. There was an attack in California north of me more than 5 years ago. A lady and two men from work were riding there mountain bikes and a large cat attacked the lady. The two men turned tail and pedaled away leaving the lady to fend for herself. If it wasn't for a couple of other mountain bikers coming to her aid, she would have been killed. The girls beat the mountain lion back with there bicycles. When the authorities found and put down the cat, it was discovered that the cat was extremely underweight. You by yourself can't 100% be safe from large cats, especially if you are a small child or lady. You and your friends need to work together if their is an attack. As far as a defensive weapon goes, It appears that you need everybody to be wielding things like BFRs, knives, sticks and a very powerful stun gun.
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Tough read, but thanks for posting this.
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I believe the most recent fatal PNW attack was a few miles south-east of that location, around North Fork. Two MTBers; one hurt and fled, the other killed. A little further back, maybe five years ago, a female hiker was killed near me, outside Portland. I hike and bike solo a fair amount, both here and that region of WA. At 6'3" 210 lbs, I might be less attractive prey, but I doubt I'd survive an attack by a full grown cat. They are simply too stealthy and too fast.
Nonetheless, the drive or ride to the trailhead is far more dangerous, due to traffic. The women in the story may not have known the best technique, but they stayed and fought. That's saying a ton. |
Originally Posted by Rick
(Post 23189980)
Striking the cat in the head with a BFR worked out for them. The use of the knife not so much because the person wielding it had no training and didn't know the vulnerable areas to strike. Slitting the cats throat taking out an artery and the windpipe would work.
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Duragrouch Posted: If I recall from the article, they hit it with a BFR multiple times and it did nothing. And yes, that's what I meant, that's exactly how I would use the knife, you can't do much more with a 3.5" blade. I think a windpipe or carotid (neck) artery would not require high skill, if they are in roughly the same place as humans. I would go for the artery first, slit from front to back, I ought to hit it if it's not too deep or shielded somehow. |
Originally Posted by Rick
(Post 23190608)
The effect of striking the cat in the head multiple times. With a rock weighing around 25 lbs did cause it to release the woman.
EDIT: You're right, and the story was not revised, I remembered wrong. The cat did eventually release her, others held a bike on top of the cat, then the officer showed up and shot it. Sincere thanks for the correction. But I will say (which is what I remembered), it took 15 minutes that the cat was clamped to her face, that's a very long time in that situation. I think a knife would have been quicker. |
Duragrouch Posted: I think a knife would have been quicker. |
Originally Posted by Rick
(Post 23190676)
I agree with this but society has changed to the point that carrying things like knives has become offensive and sometimes even a crime.
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Originally Posted by Rick
(Post 23190676)
I agree with this but society has changed to the point that carrying things like knives has become offensive and sometimes even a crime.
As far as legality, that varies with the state or municipality, but here in florida depending on the type of knife it may be covered by the concealed carry laws or exempt from them. The law on what can be carried is pretty generous. In any case there is now permitless carry so anyone can concealed carry. Other states are doing similar things so it would seem that carrying kiives (and other weapons) in at least some states have become more not less likely to be a crime. I generally do not usually carry a knife on my daily mountain bike rides, but sometimes have my Opinel No. 8 Mushroom Knife along if I think I might harvest some chanterelles. It is typically packed away and not handy for use as a weapon since that isn't what I carry it for. |
I doubt there is anyone in this thread who can say with certainly what they would do in such a situation. These ladies didn't run away, which happened in two of the recent big cat stories. They used their hands, fingers shoved in the cat's mouth, a rock, a bike, a tiny knife, their body weight. The cat considered all of them prey, considering their size. I mean, damn.
Armchair quarterbacking that is just silly. |
Originally Posted by downtube42
(Post 23191327)
I doubt there is anyone in this thread who can say with certainly what they would do in such a situation. These ladies didn't run away, which happened in two of the recent big cat stories. They used their hands, fingers shoved in the cat's mouth, a rock, a bike, a tiny knife, their body weight. The cat considered all of them prey, considering their size. I mean, damn.
Armchair quarterbacking that is just silly. |
Originally Posted by Duragrouch
(Post 23191724)
Don't misunderstand some comments. Those women did damned outstanding with the resources they had. Nevertheless, this can be a learning moment, just like many other bike mishaps or breakdowns in the middle of nowhere where you didn't have the right tool or spare and thereafter decided to carry such tool or spare. In this case, I don't want to overreact and recommend heavy artillery, but a 3.5" fixed blade knife might have been helpful, legal to carry, and very light. Also, with the advantage of prior thought and a few seconds between sight and attack, it might be good to lift the bike to put it between you and the cougar, one of the wheels in front of your face. When the local police in my city are standing guard against potential violence (in both directions) alongside protest marches, they are all bike police, standing behind their bikes, and I would bet they are trained to use the bike in a defensive manner.
I do think the amount of fight in a person is critical. I think the best thing for me to have with me, is a friend willing to fight for my life. |
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