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-   -   Totally Tubular (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=154679)

Wildwood 08-16-18 01:52 PM

As stated, best to remove the glue, and +1 for use of a brass wire wheel. :thumb:
I also subscribe to the theory of 'diminishing returns'; and it may be better for the rim if a small amount of hard, dried glue remains rather than grind away to get the hardest glue spots off. For rims with excessive dried glue, I use wire wheel then a solvent. But for a wheel with minimal glue and zero flaking, I have glued over it without an issue. With so many tubular wheelsets (8), I check them regularly for issues, both adhesion and tread condition.

Many people glue to excess - probably me!!!

63rickert 08-16-18 02:30 PM

The red glue in Patriot's photo up above is pre-historic mastice gutta. Comes off easy and quick with paint thinner. Which we used to do when it got on side of rim or wherever.

I can remember removing tape from other people's used rims. Only worth it if the rim is something rare. Otherwise 51 years on tubulars and don't think I ever removed glue. Wouldn't breathe solvent fumes just for that.

Peugeotlover 08-16-18 03:13 PM

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d61f89de6e.jpg

I gave up on stinking, messy chemicals. An electric drill with wire brush or abrasive attachment wheel will clean a tubular rim quickly, thoroughly and without damage.

Do wear gloves, because when it slips the spinning wire wheel hurts. Goggles a good idea, too.

Vince Hoffmann 08-20-18 07:45 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20314074)
The glue I removed with Goo Gone was red. I am not sure the Goo Gone did much besides act as a lubricant and keep the glue form just moving to another spot and sticking. As the glue comes off with the steel wool it gets coated with goo gone oil. That is my guess anyway. Those glue remover chemicals never worked for me very well. The Goo Gone made it easy and cut the time in half. :)

I don't use solvents, they're too messy. I use a brass wire wheel on my bench grinder. Turn it on to slow rotation and go to work on the glue. Works great and does not damage the rim but the best part is there is no nasty glue residue to clean up.

squirtdad 09-11-18 03:09 PM

has anyone tried these? I know I got the original link from C&V?

Mavic Reflex CD Ultegra Tubular Wheel Set

Mavic Reflex CD Ultegra Tubular Wheel Set


Steve Whitlatch 09-14-18 10:36 PM

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...99e039a147.jpg
I picked up a box of glue from a shop going out of business. Never tried this glue but the price was right. Anything I need to know?

smontanaro 09-15-18 04:58 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20566877)
I picked up a box of glue from a shop going out of business. Never tried this glue but the price was right. Anything I need to know?

I don't know quite how much information you want, but here's how I do it. Mount new tires to clean rims and inflate to pre-stretch them for a day or two. When applying glue, I use paste brushes (get 'em at your local -- or not so local -- art supply store) and wear disposable gloves. I inflate the tire enough that it holds its shape, then stand it up on the workbench leaning against the peg board. In my case, I have a 250gr can, but with a tube it's similar. Get a little blob of glue on the brush, press enough with it on the base tape that the brush fans out and unload the glue. Then lightly spread it out all the way to the edge of the base tape on both sides. Lather, rinse repeat. Application to the rim is similar. You want full contact between the rim and the base tape so make sure you get the glue to the edges of both the rim and base tape. I find that having the wheel in my truing stand makes rim application much easier. Assuming you are starting with clean rim and tire, one application on tire and rim, wait overnight, then a second application. After 10 minutes or so, install the tire, inflate enough so the tire holds its shape, then adjust the tire to center it properly. When you're happy you've got the tire perfectly straight (or as straight as your patience allows), pump to 100+ psi so the base tape is fully engaged with the rim and let it sit for awhile (overnight is best) before using the wheel.

I know it sounds involved and very slow, but it's one of those things I find kind of therapeutic, so I don't mind the time or process. HTH...

steelbikeguy 09-15-18 06:35 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20566877)
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...99e039a147.jpg
I picked up a box of glue from a shop going out of business. Never tried this glue but the price was right. Anything I need to know?

other than the fact that it looks like Juicy Fruit gum... the one thing that I remember about Tubasti is that it stays tacky.
By comparison, stuff like Conti glue will get properly firm when it cures. In fact, you could say that it gets hard to the touch.
Tubasti, IIRC, stays rather sticky and will stick to anything. Possibly handy when it comes to a spare tubular, and perhaps nice to have on the rim when you need to install a spare.
The only thing I recall is that when the tube leaks, it gets all over anything nearby and is tough to clean up! :)

well, there's also the poem that Aldo Ross on the Classic Rendezvous list wrote:

Tubasti on the sidewalls
Tubasti on the spokes
Tubasti on my workbench
Sticking to the nuts and bolts

Tubasti on my fingers
Tubasti on my arms
Tubasti on my chin and cheeks
I hope it won't cause harm

Tubasti on the light switch
Tubasti on the cat
Tubasti on my shoes and socks
And on my car's floor mat

Tubasti on the carpet
Tubasti in my hair
I tried to glue just one damn tire
Now Tubasti's everywhere!

don't say you weren't warned. ;)

Steve in Peoria

Homebrew01 09-15-18 06:39 AM


Originally Posted by squirtdad (Post 20508609)

Challenge Criterium Tubular (320TPI) black and white $31.93


https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/chall...0tpi/#pid=6584

Good tires ??
Never tried them.

jcb3 09-15-18 07:23 AM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20566877)
I picked up a box of glue from a shop going out of business. Never tried this glue but the price was right. Anything I need to know?

I really like tubasti - totally old school and most appropriate for C+V. It does get all over the place, but that is part of its charm - a Saturday afternoon with tubasti everywhere: priceless!.

Mineral spirits (aka thinner or coleman fuel) works well for cleanup, the secret appears to be only use the rag for a wipe or so then replace, otherwise the glue on the rag just spreads.

As far as applying, instructions says rim only. I'm not usually comfortable with that so will apply to the basetape as well then let it dry for an hour before mounting. You will need a thick coating for it to work. I apply a blob and spread with an acid brush - usually two segments between spoke holes per blob - try to keep it off the outside of the rim. I wipe the top edge of the rim with a rag and mineral spirits before mounting, otherwise the tire sticks while pushing the tire over the edge.

Take a slow spin around the block to even out the tire. I'll glue up a tire and then couple days later deflate it and test the hold. If it comes off easily, I didn't put enough on. Rip the tire off and put more on the rim. A quick rub of mineral spirits on the tire softens up that glue for mounting. Agreed it stays tacky.

If all this scares you, I'll be glad to take the tubasti off your hands.

Joe

Steve Whitlatch 09-15-18 02:57 PM

Thanks for the heads up on Tubasti being messy. I will wear throw away painters clothes and cover the area with drop cloths when I glue with it. I got a bit of the stuff on my pants and hands when I opened one up to check if it was still good. I wish I had seen this before I did that. LOL

It seems to be a bit thin and wet compared to Continental glue. I will figure it out. I`m sure the first tire I glue will not look very pretty when I am done. By the third tire I will be a pro. :)

CV-6 09-15-18 05:57 PM

One disadvantage (IMO) of Tubasti is its color. White.

Classtime 09-15-18 06:46 PM


Originally Posted by jcb3 (Post 20567184)
I really like tubasti - totally old school and most appropriate for C+V. It does get all over the place, but that is part of its charm - a Saturday afternoon with tubasti everywhere: priceless!.

Mineral spirits (aka thinner or coleman fuel) works well for cleanup, the secret appears to be only use the rag for a wipe or so then replace, otherwise the glue on the rag just spreads.

Joe

A bit of thread drift but.... Coleman fuel is Mineral Spirits?! In California, "paint thinner" has replaced Mineral Spirits on the shelves at the paint and hardware stores so the s is good news to me. I think we still have white gas.

Colnago Mixte 09-15-18 06:49 PM

Not sure what Coleman fuel is, but "mineral spirits" "paint thinner, and "white gas" are all the same thing:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_spirit

Steve Whitlatch 09-15-18 06:53 PM


Originally Posted by CV-6 (Post 20568108)
One disadvantage (IMO) of Tubasti is its color. White.


White? Mine looks the same color as Continental glue. Maybe mine is an older or newer formula?

CV-6 09-15-18 07:55 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20568181)
White? Mine looks the same color as Continental glue. Maybe mine is an older or newer formula?

I am guessing a newer formula as I have not used Tubasti in 20 years.

jcb3 09-15-18 08:04 PM


Originally Posted by Classtime (Post 20568174)

A bit of thread drift but.... Coleman fuel is Mineral Spirits?! In California, "paint thinner" has replaced Mineral Spirits on the shelves at the paint and hardware stores so the s is good news to me. I think we still have white gas.

Coleman fuel is petroleum naphtha - which is what paint thinner is supposed to be. I believe the california paint thinner has quite a bit of acetone.

I get Crown Camp Fuel for gasoline lanterns at Walmart - for about half the price of coleman fuel.

jcb3 09-15-18 08:06 PM


Originally Posted by CV-6 (Post 20568266)
I am guessing a newer formula as I have not used Tubasti in 20 years.

The tubasti I've been getting is white - but it still gets all over the place.

jcb3 09-15-18 08:11 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20567849)

It seems to be a bit thin and wet compared to Continental glue. I will figure it out. I`m sure the first tire I glue will not look very pretty when I am done. By the third tire I will be a pro. :)

Thin and wet doesn't sound right. maybe separated? The stuff I've used is a bit thick - and you can spread a pretty thick layer, definitely not runny.

Salamandrine 09-15-18 08:58 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20566877)
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...99e039a147.jpg
I picked up a box of glue from a shop going out of business. Never tried this glue but the price was right. Anything I need to know?

FWIW this was considered by many people to be the tourist glue, at least by the racing set. It stays sticky, so it's convenient if you get a flat. Still, I knew some good racers who preferred it. It is a lot thinner than Clement red was.

I used it once and rolled a tire, which soured me on it permanently. I only ever happened to me that one time. Given that I was 15 and not an experienced mechanic, improper application was at least partly to blame.

In retrospect, I think I'd put at least 3 coats on a new rim, maybe 4, and let the first two dry before the final sticky coat. Also put a coat on the tire. Let dry for longer than it says to on the tube. I'd physically test it by pulling on the tire to see how stuck it is.

Steve Whitlatch 09-16-18 02:29 PM


Originally Posted by Salamandrine (Post 20568325)
FWIW this was considered by many people to be the tourist glue, at least by the racing set. It stays sticky, so it's convenient if you get a flat. Still, I knew some good racers who preferred it. It is a lot thinner than Clement red was.

I used it once and rolled a tire, which soured me on it permanently. I only ever happened to me that one time. Given that I was 15 and not an experienced mechanic, improper application was at least partly to blame.

In retrospect, I think I'd put at least 3 coats on a new rim, maybe 4, and let the first two dry before the final sticky coat. Also put a coat on the tire. Let dry for longer than it says to on the tube. I'd physically test it by pulling on the tire to see how stuck it is.

I will try it out and post my findings here when I am done. I have 20 tubes of this stuff. LOL

squirtdad 11-13-18 03:49 PM

Got to keep this thread going :)

OK as usual for me, I get a great bike cheap or free and then obsess over the build (in this case I was justified because the crankset was to small for me :) )

It is a an '84 team miyata and I am trying to bring it back to close to it's original appearance if not specs

In this case original means gum wall tubular.

I probably should bite the bullet. be done with it, etc and get the Corsa G+, but this is not my prime rider and I want to save some bucks.....

I would like to put a a little (or lot) less expensive tire on it.

Would prefer to have a removable valve core for sealant

or can sealant be forced in through a non-removable valve core? or just not bother and as they are cheap just get extra tires?

Any way the usual suspects at the low end with gumwall seem to be

Vittoria Rally
Continental Giro
Yellow Jacket 3 for 50

Thoughts, experience, invective?

thanks

speedevil 11-13-18 04:06 PM

YJ tubulars 3 for $50 have been surprisingly good. Mount straight, no lumps. Not as good a ride as the pricier tubs (like the Corsa G+) but for the price, hard to beat.

UPDATE: the YJ tubs are 23mm

steelbikeguy 11-13-18 04:20 PM

I've used the Conti Giro and the Yellow Jersey sew-ups, and they've been functional. The Giro is probably a better tire, though.
Currently, I've got a Yellow Jersey tire as my spare.

Are the Conti Giro's still gumwall? I'm using the Sprinter on one bike, and it's progressed from dark brown sidewall (previous generation) to black sidewall. Too modern looking for my tastes.

Steve in Peoria

Wileyone 11-13-18 04:20 PM


Originally Posted by squirtdad (Post 20661834)
Got to keep this thread going :)

OK as usual for me, I get a great bike cheap or free and then obsess over the build (in this case I was justified because the crankset was to small for me :) )

It is a an '84 team miyata and I am trying to bring it back to close to it's original appearance if not specs

In this case original means gum wall tubular.

I probably should bite the bullet. be done with it, etc and get the Corsa G+, but this is not my prime rider and I want to save some bucks.....

I would like to put a a little (or lot) less expensive tire on it.

Would prefer to have a removable valve core for sealant

or can sealant be forced in through a non-removable valve core? or just not bother and as they are cheap just get extra tires?

Any way the usual suspects at the low end with gumwall seem to be

Vittoria Rally
Continental Giro
Yellow Jacket 3 for 50

Thoughts, experience, invective?

thanks

The Challenge Elite Pro Tubular is in the same ballpark price as the ones you have listed but no one has reported on them...
I have tried the Vittoria Rally and the Continental Giro and was less than impressed/

crank_addict 11-13-18 04:22 PM


Originally Posted by squirtdad (Post 20661834)
Got to keep this thread going :)

OK as usual for me, I get a great bike cheap or free and then obsess over the build (in this case I was justified because the crankset was to small for me :) )

It is a an '84 team miyata and I am trying to bring it back to close to it's original appearance if not specs

In this case original means gum wall tubular.

I probably should bite the bullet. be done with it, etc and get the Corsa G+, but this is not my prime rider and I want to save some bucks.....

I would like to put a a little (or lot) less expensive tire on it.

Would prefer to have a removable valve core for sealant

or can sealant be forced in through a non-removable valve core? or just not bother and as they are cheap just get extra tires?

Any way the usual suspects at the low end with gumwall seem to be

Vittoria Rally
Continental Giro
Yellow Jacket 3 for 50

Thoughts, experience, invective?

thanks

All budget tubulars have negatives. I have and use all the above but two not listed and my preference are:

Panaracer Practice 270 black/tan. Three for $90 should be the ballpark retail discount.

I've been getting them for less through a LBS (wholesale and when they place large restock orders)

Also consider Tufo S33 pro when on sale. Seem as if they were machined on a lathe. Butyl tube.

smontanaro 11-13-18 04:45 PM

Kinda hard to beat tubulars at $0.06 a pair. Even if I have to fill them to the gills with Orange Seal. That's me, your friendly neighborhood bottom feeder. ;)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/173622247985

DiabloScott 11-13-18 04:46 PM

The YJ tires do have a vintage kind of look to them - they're narrow and intended for high pressure and ride hard... but I remember thinking that was cool in 1984.

And IME, they fail less than V or C brand cheapies.

Chombi1 11-14-18 10:46 AM

Cheapies are good to just start with and get used to mounting tubs on rims and have an idea what the difference in ride is between most clinchers and tubs. But after graduating to higher quality tubs, I now just relegate my Rallys and Giros to spare tire duties, just to get me through a ride after a flat. The whole point of tubular tires is to get the best ride, and the cheapies just don't provide enough of an improvement over clinchers to make them worth it in the long run.

squirtdad 11-14-18 11:40 AM

well I pulled the trigger.....trying the Challenge Elite Pro 25mm/removable core/black and tan at $28.99 from probike will report out

meanwhile I have a set of corsa g+ clinchers to installs

damn this addiction :)


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