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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

BigChief 05-26-17 09:59 AM

Must say, the old gent does look mighty dapper on his roadster. And this young fella probably wouldn't get a second glance from the girl in the bikini if it weren't for the vintage Raleigh. Perhaps I should reconsider my hypothesis.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/...1541903795.jpg

markk900 05-26-17 11:27 AM

More likely she just wants to get across the hot pavement to the service station and he's in the process of crashing with his mouth open and tongue hanging out - doubt she's noticed him at all....

Renngrrl 05-26-17 02:15 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19611732)
Gotta grow the beard and get some tats Chief. And live in TO.

Don't laugh but I think I have both those pictures tagged on my "seriously pretty men' pintrest board. Forget the lycra and ride a vintage 3 speed or dutch bike. That's the trendy style now in California :thumb:.

clubman 05-26-17 02:45 PM

I'm glad to hear I've got good taste in men! ;)

I wish I could pull off that Donald Sutherland thing, look at the chain he's using to lock that roadster. He's got the lights, the scarf, the glasses, the hair and above all, the bike. It looks like a daily rider. If that's hipster, I'm all in.

Renngrrl 05-26-17 03:34 PM

@clubman The gentleman's name is Mr. Giulliano Alborghetti. He's rather famous among the fashionista. Style Inspiration: Mr. Alborghetti from Milan | SARTORIALE
Go to The Sartorialist and search for bikes to see what all the hipsters are riding.

BigChief 05-26-17 06:07 PM

I always thought that if I stayed alive long enough, I'd come back into fashion. Maybe it's time to get my Eisenhower era secret service agent suit dry cleaned and start a band again.

arty dave 05-26-17 08:06 PM

Big Chief and the Ironically Hip Roadsters? :)
Pawl and the 3 speeds?

So I realised I had to make a few more posts before I could plant an image here.
On putting together the DL-1, the front wheel was a little reluctant to enter the dropouts. I've straightened these with an adjustable spanner, but the forks are also out of alignment with each other by about 10mm / 3/8". Can anyone recommend a gentle way of tweaking a fork leg back into place? It must be a very subtle bend as I can't see anything majorly bent along either fork.

arty dave 05-26-17 08:14 PM

Oh also I found a local source for a '65 SA front hub on an Aussie bike board.
The seller also has a pair of Westwood rims in 32 and 40 holes that I hope I can stretch for. Spent all my play money on the DL-1 :(
They're the 700A 642mm size rather than the British 635mm, but with the drum brakes I can't see how 7mm will make any difference. Plus I have a brand new pair of tyres in that size. That would be the negative - they're only available in black and 37mm / 1 3/8" wide. But going with 635mm I'm then paying big time for a rim, tyres, and postage to come from the UK.

clubman 05-26-17 08:50 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 19613293)
Oh also I found a local source for a '65 SA front hub on an Aussie bike board.
The seller also has a pair of Westwood rims in 32 and 40 holes that I hope I can stretch for. Spent all my play money on the DL-1 :(
They're the 700A 642mm size rather than the British 635mm, but with the drum brakes I can't see how 7mm will make any difference. Plus I have a brand new pair of tyres in that size. That would be the negative - they're only available in black and 37mm / 1 3/8" wide. But going with 635mm I'm then paying big time for a rim, tyres, and postage to come from the UK.

Don't go for the 700A rim. Tires are hard to get and narrower. 635 may cost you more but you'll have piece of mind. Yes 7 mm makes a big difference. I believe the 700A is 640 mm which shaves the diff a bit.

Many Raleigh Roadsters were delivered in Canada with wide 700C tires...same as the current 29-ers. Go that route. I can find you westwood rims in that size but shipping is still dear. 36 holes are more common

BigChief 05-26-17 09:06 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 19613293)
Oh also I found a local source for a '65 SA front hub on an Aussie bike board.
The seller also has a pair of Westwood rims in 32 and 40 holes that I hope I can stretch for. Spent all my play money on the DL-1 :(
They're the 700A 642mm size rather than the British 635mm, but with the drum brakes I can't see how 7mm will make any difference. Plus I have a brand new pair of tyres in that size. That would be the negative - they're only available in black and 37mm / 1 3/8" wide. But going with 635mm I'm then paying big time for a rim, tyres, and postage to come from the UK.

Westwoods are the big issue with DL-1 projects. If they need replacing, there's usually no way of finding a 32/40H pair on the cheap. I have seen some 36H at reasonable prices. I guess they're from China or India. 36H AW hubs and 6 1/4" AW axles can be found. It's another option, but still no match for the ease of finding 590 rims for a Sports.

arty dave 05-26-17 11:27 PM

Yeah it's just a bit of a money headache and it has left me undecided. I don't want to put it in the cnr of the shed, I really want to ride it :) I was very surprised to come across one in Australia.

To be clear:
700A = 642mm or 28" x 1 3/8"
700B = 635mm or 28" x 1 1/2"
700C = 622mm 'modern standard'

The 642mm tyres are still made and available new in Australia, and at 37mm wide are comparable to 635mm tyre widths, the widest available being 40mm in 635. The bike currently fits the 642mm wheel (non-westwood) with ease under the original front mudguard. I can't buy 635mm tyres easily in Australia, if at all.

So if I want to use an original front drum hub I have to go with a 32 hole. I have a modern SA front alloy drum hub in 36 hole, but thought an original steel drum would look more, well, original :) on the DL-1. Betterer'n'such with it's whole character and function.

OK so 3 options:
Use the modern front drum hub I have & I'd just order a 36 hole 635mm rim & 2 tyres from dutchbikebits.com or classic-cycle.de >Reasonable parts costs but pricey shipping

Buy the '65 front drum and buy a 32 hole 635mm westwood rim from UK Ebay & tyres from somewhere >Pricey rim & pricey shipping

Use the tyres I have, buy the '65 front drum and 2 x 642mm westwood rims from the guy in my own country >Reasonable parts costs & cheap shipping

This may take some financial ponderings and musings, maybe some thoughtful perambulations through grey matter. Maybe I should sell one of my bikes :eek:

clubman 05-27-17 08:37 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 19613571)
Yeah it's just a bit of a money headache and it has left me undecided. I don't want to put it in the cnr of the shed, I really want to ride it :) I was very surprised to come across one in Australia.

To be clear:
700A = 642mm or 28" x 1 3/8"
700B = 635mm or 28" x 1 1/2"
700C = 622mm 'modern standard'

The 642mm tyres are still made and available new in Australia, and at 37mm wide are comparable to 635mm tyre widths, the widest available being 40mm in 635. The bike currently fits the 642mm wheel (non-westwood) with ease under the original front mudguard. I can't buy 635mm tyres easily in Australia, if at all.

So if I want to use an original front drum hub I have to go with a 32 hole. I have a modern SA front alloy drum hub in 36 hole, but thought an original steel drum would look more, well, original :) on the DL-1. Betterer'n'such with it's whole character and function.

OK so 3 options:
Use the modern front drum hub I have & I'd just order a 36 hole 635mm rim & 2 tyres from dutchbikebits.com or classic-cycle.de >Reasonable parts costs but pricey shipping

Buy the '65 front drum and buy a 32 hole 635mm westwood rim from UK Ebay & tyres from somewhere >Pricey rim & pricey shipping

Use the tyres I have, buy the '65 front drum and 2 x 642mm westwood rims from the guy in my own country >Reasonable parts costs & cheap shipping

This may take some financial ponderings and musings, maybe some thoughtful perambulations through grey matter. Maybe I should sell one of my bikes :eek:

We commonwealthers were obsessed with defining ourselves as 'not British' as we developed our bicycle industries. I had jumped conclusions, thinking they were the EA4 647 mm sporting size (Canadian) that seemed to disappear in the 40's never to return.

I'd like love see pics and read more info on the recipient frame for context. Frame spacing, front fork spacing, what SA hubs are being sourced (vintage or modern).

arty dave 05-27-17 11:22 PM

647!!! Far out, I thought 642 was the biggest wheel size in the universe! (..apart from cokers, penny farthings, etc.)

Was Canada the only maker of the EA4 647 size?

I'm leaning towards original front drum and 635mm rim for the DL-1. I'm not a big fan of cream tyres, but in this case I think they really suit the bike, so I'd need the 635 rim. I bought a bike last year that came with cream tyres and had to take them off as they just didn't look right to me.

I'll post some pics as soon as I'm allowed.

Big Chief what kind of music did you play in your bands?

BigChief 05-28-17 04:57 AM

In the States, we had the confusion of Schwinn using an oddball tire size and calling it 26x 1 3/8, but they didn't fit English bikes that also used 26 x 1 3/8 tires. This led to a common understanding of the otherwise unused metric name of 590mm for tires to fit 3 speed English bikes. Other than that, all these different names for tire sizes makes my head spin.
In the early 80s there was a revival of old time horn bands in New England. They played jump and vintage R&B. Went out of fashion by the 90s. Played a lot of different styles over the years, but that was my favorite. Ifit ever comes back, I'll be ready.

Velocivixen 05-28-17 11:20 AM

Built up my 20" drum brake hub for R20 #3. Ordered the 2-speed kickback with coaster brake for rear. Mostly just because I've never used them before. Fewer cables.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4203/3...2e7d9889_z.jpg20" Rhyno Lite laced to Sturmey Archer 70mm drum brake. by velocivixen, on Flickr
https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4197/3...e258b68d_z.jpg20" Rhyno Lite laced to Sturmey Archer 70mm drum brake. by velocivixen, on Flickr
https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4204/3...2c8bdef1_z.jpg20" Rhyno Lite laced to Sturmey Archer 70mm drum brake. by velocivixen, on Flickr

gster 05-28-17 07:33 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19615936)

2 speed kick back is an interesting hub. I've heard they had some trouble with the new SA ones, but the old Bendix and Torpedo Duomotic hubs are quite interesting to ride.
You may quite like it.

Velocivixen 05-28-17 07:59 PM

I read that their initial production of the hub had some issues, but that was years ago. So let's keep our fingers crossed.....
I'm heading over to @gugie's with the fork & rear Hank of the bike to spread the fork/dropout, etc. it's pretty much disassembled at this point.

bwilli88 05-28-17 08:58 PM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19615936)
Built up my 20" drum brake hub for R20 #3. Ordered the 2-speed kickback with coaster brake for rear. Mostly just because I've never used them before. Fewer cables.
https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4203/3...2e7d9889_z.jpg[url=https://flic.kr/p/V7a966]20" Rhyno Lite laced to Sturmey Archer 70mm drum brake.r

How do you like that SA Drum hub, I have an idea for an old Supercourse made up with a set of these front and rear with a dyno/drum up front and a 5 speed drum rear.

gna 05-28-17 09:51 PM


Originally Posted by DQRider (Post 19603222)
It's my pleasure to share them. Definitely my favorite ride of the year. In fact, we had at least one fellow from Texas up here this year. I spoke with him a number of times, although I can't recall his name at the moment.

Mike, perhaps?

I enjoyed the pictures, too.

gna 05-28-17 10:14 PM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 19589268)
How about a nice American English 3-speed?

https://richmond.craigslist.org/bik/6134991559.html

1961 Western Flyer/Raleigh - $150 (Mechanicsville)

https://images.craigslist.org/00U0U_...b_1200x900.jpg

condition: excellent
make / manufacturer: Western Flyer
model name / number: Tourist

This is a 1961 Western Flyer Tourist. It is made in England and it is a rare find. Especially in this good of condition. Not many of this model Western Flyers made. They were produced by Raleigh and badged for Western Flyer stores. Bike looks great for the age! It has the 3 speed Sturney Archer hub and works fine. Still has the original "Davis Deluxe" front tire.
Great rider and well worth the price!

The bike recycler near me had a Lady's Western Flyer. It was blue, smaller frame. I wonder if he still has it...

Velocivixen 05-28-17 10:16 PM

@bwilli88 - I can't install it yet because the Raleigh Twenty has 90 mm fork dropouts & front hub is 100mm. Need to spread forks tomorrow & file ends to accept a wider axle. I'll let you know, once it's done.

arty dave 05-28-17 10:19 PM

I have the x-fdd and an x-rd8(w) I laced into 26" wheels for an 80's mountain bike. Both in the 70mm drum which stops 95kg me plus bike and gear in as short a space as any rim braking bike I own. The nice thing about them is how smooth, quiet and reliable they are in any weather. I would highly recommend using them with longer levers, you won't have to squeeze harder but will have that much more mechanical advantage. I never got around to getting dynamo lights so can't comment on the dynamo output. I've read that the new rotary shifting 5 speed drum hubs (rx-rd5) have stronger internals than the x-rd5. There's also a rotary shifting 4 speed drum hub in the latest line-up.

bwilli88 05-29-17 01:02 AM

Thanks @arty dave I have 2 frames that I would like to use and not sure which one. The previously mentioned Supercourse and a 83 Gazelle town bike
The Gazelle in its state now with a drum front and a 2 speed auto SRAM coaster brake rear and 635 SS rims with Schwalbe cruisers 42x635
http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/i..._162626193.jpg

The Supercourse is now a bare frame in the basement
http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/i...63622175_1.jpg

arty dave 05-29-17 02:23 AM

Both lovely bikes...the Gazelle looks great as it is & it's drum is cool. Is it a 90mm drum?. Do you have too much hill for the 2 speed? That's why I decided on the 8 after borrowing a 5 speed and finding my local hills getting the better of me :) I've moved since then and my 3 speed is fun again.

bwilli88 05-29-17 02:51 AM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 19617146)
Both lovely bikes...the Gazelle looks great as it is & it's drum is cool. Is it a 90mm drum?. Do you have too much hill for the 2 speed? That's why I decided on the 8 after borrowing a 5 speed and finding my local hills getting the better of me :) I've moved since then and my 3 speed is fun again.

The Gazelle has a 70mm drum and regarding the 2 speed, I have ridden 100km here in Cambodia with only 30m of climb. I am thinking of taking this to the States and building it there with the 70mm drum 5 speed rear which would be great for Lancaster, PA.


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