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-   -   Totally Tubular (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=154679)

godspiral 07-17-06 09:17 PM


Originally Posted by lotek
$15 per tire if more than one.

Am I in a hot dry area? like Texas? it was 104 (41) today.

the regular glue never sets, it created a sticky gummy mess that oozed out
from under the tires, picked up all sorts of road debris (but it held, I got
blood blisters removing the tires). In addition to that it was a gawdawful
mess to clean the rims after.
whatever you do just get the extreme tape.
Jantex box looks the same to me as it always did.

marty

thanks very much for your help.

So the part that sucked was taking it off and replacing afterwards?
Am I dreaming if I think I can set it once, and then get 5000 miles over 5 years out of it? I'm in Toronto, so when its hot, its swampy humid too. I've had no flats after about 700 miles on clinchers.
Tufo makes a thinner version of their tape that is road tire only. It would probably do a better job at not gathering gunk.

The tubular on my front wheel has been in storage at least 2 years, maybe 10. Does it have to be reglued to be safe? reglued every season/year? If that's the case, and tape stays on for years, then I'd lean even more towards it. Btw, lighter fluid should make getting tape off easy.

OLDYELLR 07-17-06 09:57 PM


Originally Posted by godspiral
The tubular on my front wheel has been in storage at least 2 years, maybe 10. Does it have to be reglued to be safe? reglued every season/year? If that's the case, and tape stays on for years, then I'd lean even more towards it. Btw, lighter fluid should make getting tape off easy.

Tearing a tire off and reglueing it would do more harm than good in my opinion. TUFO suggests acetone (or "paint thinner" - I think he means laqueur thinner) for removing tape residue. There's probably better solvents. I glued my tires on with Panaracer Pana Cement, which had a distinct aroma of toluol, which is a potent solvent.

godspiral 07-18-06 08:09 AM


Originally Posted by OLDYELLR
Tearing a tire off and reglueing it would do more harm than good in my opinion.

I thought you mentioned that you reglue twice per year. Is it exlcusively based on mileage? I don't understand why you reglue then.

lotek 07-18-06 09:51 AM

The only reason I reglue a tire is if I think its beginning to loosen.
Easy way I check this is push tire across rim, if it moves it needs reglue.
I've had tires on bike for multiple years without problem.

The problem with the Tufo tape (IMHO) was not taking it off but the
sticky oozy mess the entire time I had the tires mounted. Cleaning the goo
off was just the icing on the cake.
Mineral Spirits was the best thing to remove it from rim. For removing
excess from tire you have to scrape it off. No solvents as they will damage
the base tape.

OLDYELLR 07-22-06 02:27 PM


Originally Posted by godspiral
I'm assuming your spares have no glue at all... wussyfoot means 10mph tops corners? -- It wouldn't be a huge deal if the setup had a 15mph max cornering speed, as long as it was totally safe at that speed. Did the old crappy tape at least allow for that?

I just came across this in an archive. It sort of confirms what has been my gut feeling all along.

"I've seen enough tires that had been ridden
that had as good as no glue on them and they stayed on. The center of
pressure of a tubular at 45 degrees lean is still within the width of
the rim. That would be 0.707 of the distance between the central
plane of the tire and the cross sectional diameter. For a 22mm tire,
that's 7.777mm on a 20mm wide rim or 10-7.777=2.223mm inside the edge
of the rim. This is not a good practice without glue but it explains
why there it doesn't take a large disturbing load to roll the tire.

Jobst Brandt"

cyclotoine 07-26-06 04:49 PM

there are lots of gommitlaia champion and clement futura (or something close to those names) comming up on ebay... They seen to sell pretty cheep. Are these low quality tubulars? What is the clement hierarchy?
thanks
anthony

USAZorro 07-26-06 08:05 PM

Clement Futurox - Not bad, but probably lower end. I've been riding some for the past year, and they've done reasonably well. I actually got some of mine because my LBS couldn't get me the Gommitalia's that a friend of mine recommended. Never rode them yet, so I can't give my first-hand impression.

godspiral 07-26-06 08:24 PM


Originally Posted by OLDYELLR
I just came across this in an archive. It sort of confirms what has been my gut feeling all along.

"I've seen enough tires that had been ridden
that had as good as no glue on them and they stayed on. The center of
pressure of a tubular at 45 degrees lean is still within the width of
the rim. That would be 0.707 of the distance between the central
plane of the tire and the cross sectional diameter. For a 22mm tire,
that's 7.777mm on a 20mm wide rim or 10-7.777=2.223mm inside the edge
of the rim. This is not a good practice without glue but it explains
why there it doesn't take a large disturbing load to roll the tire.

Jobst Brandt"

The very last sentence is contradictory to what leads upto it. Is there a typo in the last sentence? should it read
"... but it explains
why it does take a large disturbing load to roll the tire." ?

OLDYELLR 07-27-06 07:20 AM


Originally Posted by godspiral
The very last sentence is contradictory to what leads upto it. Is there a typo in the last sentence? should it read
"... but it explains
why it does take a large disturbing load to roll the tire." ?

I pasted the text directly from "Tubulars" here: http://yarchive.net/bike/index.html and you're right. But you do understand the principle; a large part of the cornering force is resolved intothe plane of the wheel, pressing the tire onto the rim, not tearing it off sideways. It's not as bad as it would be on a car wheel with no negative camber.

godspiral 07-27-06 12:01 PM

I ordered some tubulars and the velotec tape. I imagine the reason you got gunk around the edge of the tire is that it is too wide. I'll consider trimming the edges before applying.

mattmelcher 08-07-06 07:27 AM

I went 'old school' this weekend and it was quite interesting...

About 30 miles into my ride i noticed my rear tire was looking kinda low. Checked it out and discovered a slow leak from a puncture. Since I was going 'old school' I didn't have any spares, so I put some more air in the tire and went on for about a mile and checked it again. Needed more air so I figured I would have to stop every mile or so until I got back home. I was about 5 miles from nowhere when this happened. So on I went and all of the sudden 'PSSSSSSST'...The front tire was flat. It took about 10 seconds and that was it...I checked it out and it wouldn't hold any air...CRAP! I rode VERY SLOWLY (less than 5 miles an hour). For the next hour - stopping constantly to put air in the rear and walking whenever the road got rough. I Finally made it home and pulled the tires off. The rear tire is relatively new and I could easily find the leak; I'll fix that sometime in the near future. The front tire was a different story. I first put it on the rim about 12 years ago, and it hasn't been ridden for 10 years. I could barely get it off the rim. When I did, I found out the sewed up part was coming apart, and I had a pinch flat...I couldn't believe it. I also discoved the sidewall was falling appart. It's time for some new tires...I don't think I'll ride old shool next time...

godspiral 08-19-06 06:20 PM

Velotec tape was extremely easy to put on. Seemed to match the width of my rim exactly (20mm or so). Definitely something you can get right on your first try. Seemed a little tricky getting tire on exactly centered, but doesn't seem to be any riding impact.

caloso 08-23-06 01:06 PM

http://sacramento.craigslist.org/bik/197567536.html

$20 for a set of tubular wheels. I have no idea if these are any good, but a double sawbuck for anything is a deal these days.

bejay 08-24-06 02:17 PM

sealent, who makes the best one
 
hey did a search...but wondering if people's opinions have changed, so which is the best tubular sealant and how many psi can you use it up to before it begins to leak

thanks

j.

lotek 08-24-06 03:13 PM

I hear very good things about the Vittoria pit stop (or something like that).
Slime, Tufo, and Tube Spooge (rock n' roll) are all good to about 100psi
anything higher than that will leak (or spew all over you). Of course
depends on size of cut/puncture, I would imagine that wire (from
auto belted tires) at about the size of a staple would seal effectively
to higher psi than small cut.

Marty

peripatetic 08-24-06 11:52 PM


Originally Posted by godspiral
The very last sentence is contradictory to what leads upto it. Is there a typo in the last sentence? should it read
"... but it explains
why it does take a large disturbing load to roll the tire." ?

Just about every linked post I've read by Jobst Brandt was contradictory in some way. For being such a conceited, prickly know-it-all, his writing borders on remedial. I've read, re-read and re-read again his quoted post on Sheldon Brown's site about tire sizes, and I have yet to parse out the exact reason for different tire sizes, even though the final line is something like, "So you see, there is a good reason tires have changed in size." I find his writing obtuse, inconsistent and generally irksome. If only one of those posters on rec.bicycles.net would actually point this out to him, instead of arguing with some point he's made in one of his impenetrable posts: his vagueness serves his purpose, and he often responds to people with "No, what I said was..."

USAZorro 08-25-06 07:18 AM


Originally Posted by peripatetic
Just about every linked post I've read by Jobst Brandt was contradictory in some way. For being such a conceited, prickly know-it-all, his writing borders on remedial. I've read, re-read and re-read again his quoted post on Sheldon Brown's site about tire sizes, and I have yet to parse out the exact reason for different tire sizes, even though the final line is something like, "So you see, there is a good reason tires have changed in size." I find his writing obtuse, inconsistent and generally irksome. If only one of those posters on rec.bicycles.net would actually point this out to him, instead of arguing with some point he's made in one of his impenetrable posts: his vagueness serves his purpose, and he often responds to people with "No, what I said was..."

Agreed. I don't understand why he has the reputation of being an expert. He does not come off as articulate - at least not in English.

peripatetic 08-25-06 09:19 PM

Just curious: any company manufacture a tubular snow tire, say with studs?

Second, I just did a quick browse of Biketiresdirect.com; do the Conti Gatorskins only come in 22c widths, or can one get them wider?

intron 12-27-06 05:17 PM

who makes some tubulars that are pretty good against flats? i don't think im ready to be unstitching and sewing up casings. so, a tire that will keep that to a minimum would be nice. the rims are Mavic GP4

el twe 12-27-06 05:23 PM

Maybe Tufo? Plus, they make that sealant stuff.

onetwentyeight 12-27-06 08:54 PM

continental makes gatorskin tubulars now. i am a fan.

intron 12-27-06 11:12 PM


Originally Posted by onetwentyeight
continental makes gatorskin tubulars now. i am a fan.

i run gatorskin clinchers, and i love them, where is the cheapest place to get the tubular version?:D

el twe 12-28-06 09:59 PM


Originally Posted by onetwentyeight
continental makes gatorskin tubulars now. i am a fan.

I gotta say, I'm pretty excited for these.

vxpro 12-29-06 01:53 PM


Originally Posted by intron
i run gatorskin clinchers, and i love them, where is the cheapest place to get the tubular version?:D

$44.95 from biketiresdirect.com was the best price I found but didn't search very hard.

onetwentyeight 12-29-06 02:37 PM

i got mine from bike tires direct, too.


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