Question on calculating distance
Hi
I have an old computrainer, and I'm curious how it calculates distance. My wheels are standard 26" (~ 66 cm). My back of the envelope calculation for a 16.1 km time trial that I just did is: 66 x 3.14 x 88 (average rpm). This gives me ~ .182 km/min. I finished the time trial in 32 min. But .182 x 32 is ~ 5.82. What am I doing wrong ? Thanks a lot in advance. |
Could you rephrase your question as a question? you're asking about distance? but you know the distance? are you asking about speed?
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Riding inside on a Trainer is TIME Only. No Miles
Because YOU Really Don't Roll Miles. |
A wheel-on trainer knows how far you went because it can count the revolutions of the pick up wheel and multiply by the circumference of the pick up wheel. It has nothing to do with the wheel size of your bike.
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
(Post 22282786)
A wheel-on trainer knows how far you went because it can count the revolutions of the pick up wheel and multiply by the circumference of the pick up wheel. It has nothing to do with the wheel size of your bike.
2) My confusion is; if I multiply the circumference by the revolutions per minute (my pedaling cadence) and multiply that by the the number of minutes it took me to finish the course, I should get the total distance of the course. But when I do that calculation -- circumference x rpm x minutes to finish the course -- I get ~ 5.84 km. But the length of the course, according to the software is 16.1 km |
3 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by unterhausen
(Post 22282786)
A wheel-on trainer knows how far you went because it can count the revolutions of the pick up wheel and multiply by the circumference of the pick up wheel. It has nothing to do with the wheel size of your bike.
You also have to enter your wheel size when you configure your trainer on Zwift. Though I'm not really sure what the OP is asking so maybe he's referring to something totally different. This is the original guide it came with. |
Originally Posted by coco1854
(Post 22282990)
1) And how does it know the circumference ? I assume it takes the diameter of a standard wheel -- 26" -- and multiplies it by 3.14. That's how you get the circumference of any circle.
2) My confusion is; if I multiply the circumference by the revolutions per minute (my pedaling cadence) and multiply that by the the number of minutes it took me to finish the course, I should get the total distance of the course. But when I do that calculation -- circumference x rpm x minutes to finish the course -- I get ~ 5.84 km. But the length of the course, according to the software is 16.1 km |
Originally Posted by 10 Wheels
(Post 22282754)
Riding inside on a Trainer is TIME Only. No Miles
Because YOU Really Don't Roll Miles. |
Originally Posted by spelger
(Post 22283029)
i love these silly answers. everyone who rides a trainer of any sort knows they are not riding any distance or climbing any elevation. we get that it is all virtual or simulated. but there sure is a hell of a lot of effort going nowhere though.
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Originally Posted by gthomson
(Post 22283000)
Well that's not totally true, based on how bike computers used to calculate distance before GPS existed. So I still have a Vetta bike computer on my old 1980's Peugeot and for it to calculate speed and distance, you need to enter the wheel size which it then does some calculation along with RPM of wheel. I'm no mathematician so won't even attempt to tell you how it all works but I'm sure someone on those forum can.
You also have to enter your wheel size when you configure your trainer on Zwift. Though I'm not really sure what the OP is asking so maybe he's referring to something totally different. This is the original guide it came with. |
If you are riding with a 42 tooth chainring and 15 tooth cog that would be pretty close. Your 66cm dia might be a bit high.
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Originally Posted by coco1854
(Post 22282990)
1) And how does it know the circumference ? I assume it takes the diameter of a standard wheel -- 26" -- and multiplies it by 3.14. That's how you get the circumference of any circle.
2) My confusion is; if I multiply the circumference by the revolutions per minute (my pedaling cadence) and multiply that by the the number of minutes it took me to finish the course, I should get the total distance of the course. But when I do that calculation -- circumference x rpm x minutes to finish the course -- I get ~ 5.84 km. But the length of the course, according to the software is 16.1 km |
Originally Posted by 10 Wheels
(Post 22283048)
Many think they are riding miles
Even though the car wasn't going anywhere, the odometer still changed. |
Originally Posted by grizzly59
(Post 22283254)
If you are riding with a 42 tooth chainring and 15 tooth cog that would be pretty close. Your 66cm dia might be a bit high.
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Originally Posted by coco1854
(Post 22282990)
1) And how does it know the circumference ? I assume it takes the diameter of a standard wheel -- 26" -- and multiplies it by 3.14. That's how you get the circumference of any circle.
Originally Posted by gthomson
(Post 22283000)
Well that's not totally true, based on how bike computers used to calculate distance before GPS existed. .
I agree that the distance on a trainer isn't particularly important, but in this case there is an actual distance traveled and it's measured directly by quantities known by the trainer designer. You could drive it with a penny farthing and it wouldn't matter what the wheel diameter of the bicycle was. I'm not sure if there is anything wrong with the OP's calculation. Maybe there is a lot of slippage. But the distance given by the trainer is the circumference of the friction wheel times the number of rotations that it has made. Simple as that. No bike wheel size needs to be involved at all to know that. |
https://www.cateyeamerica.com/tire-size-calculator/
So just for sport- 26" wheel- I'll estimate a 1.5x26 (40-559) tire, rolling circumference 2005mm per Cateye 88 RPM ave cadence 42 chainring 15 cog = 2.8 ratio (my reasonable guess) 16.1 km TT rate = 2005 x 88 x 2.8 = 494.03 M/min time = 16100 / 494.03 = 32.58 min, in the ballpark If your rolling circumference was 2042 then with the above your time would be 31.99 min |
I once was in a Large Club that tracked Real Miles. Some tried to Add Training Miles.
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Originally Posted by genejockey
(Post 22283275)
You're missing a number, which is the conversion of your cadence to revolutions of the wheel. Even if you rode in a single gear the whole time, turns of the crank do not equal turns of the wheel. What gear did you run, front and rear?
I subsequently realized I had omitted this. I rode the whole time in the highest gear -- 41 (chainring) and the smallest cog on the rear cassette, which is either 14 or 15 (it's a seven cog cassette). So the equation now makes sense. But, of course, the software had no way of knowing the available gear ratios on my bike, let alone which ones I choose to use. Do you know what assumptions about gearing training software usually makes (I'm using an old computrainer)? Obviously for hilly sessions, it will assume a lower gear ratio than for time trials, but it doesn't know my specific bike nor the gear ratio that I choose. Thanks |
Originally Posted by 10 Wheels
(Post 22283048)
Many think they are riding miles
Virtual miles?...sure, call them that if you need. |
Originally Posted by coco1854
(Post 22283871)
Do you know what assumptions about gearing training software usually makes (I'm using an old computrainer)? Obviously for hilly sessions, it will assume a lower gear ratio than for time trials, but it doesn't know my specific bike nor the gear ratio that I choose.
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I am. How can the computer know how far I've gone if it doesn't know my gear ratio or the circumference of my wheel ?
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Excellent caluculation ! My actual time was 32:04. Tbh, I think the final avg cadence was 89 rpm.
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Originally Posted by 10 Wheels
(Post 22283676)
I once was in a Large Club that tracked Real Miles. Some tried to Add Training Miles.
If you don't believe me, put your car on jack stands and run it in gear for 100,000 miles. Then bring it to your dealer for warranty and tell them the odometer doesn't show "real miles". :lol: |
Originally Posted by coco1854
(Post 22284571)
I am. How can the computer know how far I've gone if it doesn't know my gear ratio or the circumference of my wheel ?
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Originally Posted by coco1854
(Post 22284571)
I am. How can the computer know how far I've gone if it doesn't know my gear ratio or the circumference of my wheel ?
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