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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

4funbikes 02-27-11 08:42 AM

Does anyone know if the numbers stamped on a dynohub are a year indication? I've got a Rudge with a 12 60 stamped on the front hub, 61 stamped on the rear sturmey hub, and b 60 stamped under the Brooks saddle. I can only imagine this means I have an early '60s Rudge?
Also do the serial numbers have any rhyme or reason?

wahoonc 02-27-11 09:14 AM


Originally Posted by 4funbikes (Post 12286376)
Does anyone know if the numbers stamped on a dynohub are a year indication? I've got a Rudge with a 12 60 stamped on the front hub, 61 stamped on the rear sturmey hub, and b 60 stamped under the Brooks saddle. I can only imagine this means I have an early '60s Rudge?
Also do the serial numbers have any rhyme or reason?

Sounds like you have a 1961 model. Yes the 12 60 is the date, it means that hub was made in December 1960. As far as I know no one has a Rudge serial number database. Pictures would be nice :innocent:

Aaron :)

rhm 02-27-11 09:24 AM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 12286324)
2030 isn't heavier by nature. Chrome-moly is stronger and therefore, they can make it thinner. That is what makes it lighter, i.e. they can use less of it to achieve the same strength.

Right. In fact they can use quite a bit less and still make it a whole lot stronger. I've straightened bent hi-ten steel frames more than once, and it's pretty easy. I tried to straighten a bent 531 by the same method, and it just laughed at me.

4funbikes 02-27-11 10:47 AM


Originally Posted by wahoonc (Post 12286488)
Sounds like you have a 1961 model. Yes the 12 60 is the date, it means that hub was made in December 1960. As far as I know no one has a Rudge serial number database. Pictures would be nice :innocent:

Aaron :)

Hopefully I will have pics up later today. I just took it apart last week, and plan to have it built back up today.

kingfish254 02-27-11 06:54 PM

Here is a great notstalgic 1950s dutch video with ton of Dutch 3 speeds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HgLqts3qJs&NR=1

Schwinnsta 02-28-11 09:00 PM

With strength steel you sacrifice ductility. Does any one know the yield of Hi-ten, Chromoly, and 531. Here is some stuff posted frome here http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...eeds.../page56

-------------------------------------------------
Steel Alloys

Steel is a combination (an alloy) of iron and other elements designed to improve upon the material properties of pure iron. The alloying elements make up a small fraction of the material by weight (iron is 97% or more of most steel alloys) and don't significantly alter the density (weight) and stiffness of the material, but they can have a significant impact on the strength, weldablity, corrosion resistance and expense of the material.
While there are dozens of steel alloys, only a few are commonly used in bike construction and only two--high tensile and chromoly steel--are used in most mass produced bicycles today.
High-Tensile (Hi-Ten) Steel

High-tensile or carbon steel is a common and inexpensive alloy comprised of iron mixed with 0.2% to 2.0% carbon. (Of note, when iron is mixed with more than 2.1% carbon it is no longer "steel", it goes by the name "cast iron".)
High-tensile steel is an inexpensive but relatively weak alloy. Although it has essentially the same density as other steels, manufacturers working with hi-ten steel are forced to use thick walled tubes to ensure adequate strength, and rarely use butting. For this reason, high-tensile frames are much heavier than their chromoly counterparts.
Today, high-tensile steel frames are primarily used for children's bikes and are sometimes found on inexpensive adult bikes.


4130 ChroMoly (CRMO) Steel

ChroMoly is a steel alloy composed of iron combined with chromium (roughly 1% by weight), molybdenum (roughly 0.2%), carbon (roughly 0.3%), silicon (roughly 0.2%), manganese (roughly 0.04%) and sulphur (roughly 0.04%). 4130 is actually just one of a family of chromoly alloys, but it is the one used for bicycle frames. ChroMoly steel is also used in the construction of airplanes, and is sometimes known as "aircraft tubing".
Chromium is the component that makes stainless steel rust proof, but the chromium level of chromoly steel is not high enough to provide corrosion resistance. (Stainless steel is 10% to 11% chromium.)
Chromoly is frequently used to build mid-to-high-range steel framed bikes. A well made butted chromoly frame is typically only marginally heavier than an aluminum frame, and quite strong and durable.


Reynolds Steel

In 1953 the Reynolds Cycle Company began manufacturing a steel tube composed of proprietary manganese-molybdenum steel alloy they branded Reynolds 531. This alloy was strong and for its time, relatively light. It was once the preferred tubing for steel racing bikes (as well as British aircraft).
Over the years, Reynolds has introduced a number of branded steel tubes, the brand name indicating both the specific alloy and heat treatment but also the wall thickness and butting of the tubes. These include Reyolds 453 (a single-butted tube made of a manganese-titanium alloy), Reynolds 501, 520, 525 and 725 tubes (using 4130 chromoly steel), Reynolds 753 (high-end tubes made of a manganese-molybdenum alloy, essentially a better Reynolds 531), Reynolds 853 (4130 chromoly made stiffer by air hardening) and Reynolds 953 (a lightweight rust-proof maraging stainless steel introduced in 2006).
Reynolds steel is less common in bike frames today than it once was, but some of these alloys are still in use. The Reynolds 520 family is a well made class of 4130 chromoly tubes. You'll pay a bit more for the brand name, but you'll know you're getting a well manufactured tube. Reynolds 853 is a higher quality chromoly, made stiffer than usual by the way it is manufactured. Reynolds 953 is perhaps the best steel available for bikes today: Reynolds 953 frames are stronger than titanium, no heavier than high end aluminum and rust proof.

old's'cool 03-01-11 06:12 PM

This is getting a little off topic, but while most of the information in the excerpted post above is correct to my knowledge, there are some statements that are incorrect or misleading. I'm neither a metallurgical engineer nor a historian of Reynolds 531, so I hope that the better informed will chime in to confirm or refute my take on the following:
  • (Of note, when iron is mixed with more than 2.1% carbon it is no longer "steel", it goes by the name "cast iron".)
I don't dispute that cast iron contains 2.1% or more carbon, however, it doesn't follow that all such alloys are necessarily "cast iron".
  • In 1953 the Reynolds Cycle Company began manufacturing a steel tube composed of proprietary manganese-molybdenum steel alloy they branded Reynolds 531.
I always thought Reynolds 531 was developed before WWII. Maybe just a typo on the year?

Sixty Fiver 03-01-11 11:35 PM

Wow... just realized that this thread got started on Feb 22 / 10 and don't think it has skipped a beat... much like those wonderful SA AW hubs we are all so fond of (among others).

For the number crunchers that is an average of 4 posts a day for more than a year running and I have to thank everyone for contributing so much love and checking in so often.

I was able to get out and enjoy a beautiful spring like ride last year but it is looking like we're going to be stuck in this deep freeze for at least a few more weeks... at least my winter bike is equipped with a 3 speed even though it isn't English and it has earned it's stripes this winter.

I did spend the last 6 weeks in Portland and got to enjoy another favourite 3 speed... :)

Onegin 03-05-11 11:59 PM

First post on this thread, but I loved reading about all the different bikes here.

Anyway, here's a before and after photo of my '71 Raleigh Tourist. It was a fortuitous Craigslist find last year. The original owner was just a little bit too tall to comfortably ride the bike and this one happens to be a bit unforgiving with adjustments. I was happy to oblige and take it off her hands. ;)

I have a couple of things left to do, namely adding the rear rack and a few other miscellaneous whatisits but it's mostly done. Having spent the better part of winter puttering around indoors, I'm dying for the temperatures to get above zero so I can get out and ride!

http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/7793/dsc0005d.jpg

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/7631/dsc0090vs.jpg

old's'cool 03-06-11 09:06 AM

Klasse!

LuckyChow99 03-06-11 09:11 AM

Beautiful bike. What kind of rack are you going to use?

Onegin 03-06-11 03:19 PM

There's actually a gentleman in Virginia that makes custom racks specifically to suit the Raleigh roadster:

http://redbarnbike.blogspot.com

For a long time I considered purchasing a commercially available rack (or trying to retrofit an Electra Amsterdam rack) but, in the end, the prices end up about the same and, in my opinion, this one is much more beautiful. :)

hobbes62 03-08-11 09:24 PM

Beautiful Tourist!, you did a great job on it!

x136 03-08-11 11:23 PM

I finally wrapped something around this:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...s/IMG_7119.jpg

And here it is, a 1978 Raleigh Super Course:

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...h/IMG_7313.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b3...h/IMG_7320.jpg

It's... immensely fun.

Sixty Fiver 03-08-11 11:42 PM

x- classic !

sekaijin 03-09-11 04:18 AM


Originally Posted by hobbes62 (Post 12333559)
Beautiful Tourist!, you did a great job on it!

+1, beautiful!

From the brakes I would have guessed older than '71.

sekaijin 03-09-11 04:22 AM


Originally Posted by x136 (Post 12334039)
I finally wrapped something around this:

And here it is, a 1978 Raleigh Super Course:

It's... immensely fun.

Very nice! Beautiful bike, fun conversion and the twine on the cable housing is a nice touch.

noglider 03-09-11 04:49 PM

Well done. What kind of front hub is that?

x136 03-09-11 07:59 PM


Originally Posted by sekaijin (Post 12334351)
Very nice! Beautiful bike, fun conversion and the twine on the cable housing is a nice touch.

Thanks. I bought the twine, then ended up wrapping the bars in such a way that none was required, so I had to use some somewhere.


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 12337352)
Well done. What kind of front hub is that?

It's the cheapie Novatech dynamo hub VO has on sale. Nothing hooked up to it yet. I still have to figure that stuff out.

noglider 03-09-11 08:05 PM

Well, I've been riding three speeds a bit lately, after a long time of not riding them. My main bikes are not in running order, so it was time to get at least something working. I was very pleased to acquire a Rudge last year but hadn't done anything with it. It's running great now except for the need for a pedal, which is on its way. It's lovely. I always wanted a Rudge even more than a Raleigh.

The Kool Stop brake pads don't fit on the left side of the front brake, because the caliper is so close to the fork blade. I'll have to get the short kind there. So I have three Kool Stops and one generic pad. The brakes work very well, at least in the dry.

And today I fixed my Raleigh Twenty so that I could take a bike on the train. I don't know which kind of headset it has. I know some (or all?) of them came with a plastic sleeve bearing, but this looks like it might be a traditional ball bearing. I stupidly left the bike outside all winter, and now it's worse than ever. The bike rides almost as if it has a flat front tire. I'll take a look and see. And the brakes suck, big time. I'll get some Kool Stop brake pads and see if they help.

I rode to the train station, carried the bike on the train, and rode in Manhattan. As you can imagine, riding in Manhattan is grueling and very dog-eat-dog. It's a bit harrowing with a sluggish bike, a stiff headset, and gawdawful brakes. But I survived. It was fun anyway.

Schwinnsta 03-09-11 08:54 PM

On my R20 I had to go a front V-brake to get good stopping ability. Even with Kool Stops the original brakes are just too long. I also went to AL rims and Schwalbe Marathon tires. The original rims were pitted and the tires were shot.

If I were to going to replace the tires again I would not go with the Marathons.

wahoonc 03-10-11 05:15 AM


Originally Posted by Schwinnsta (Post 12338497)
On my R20 I had to go a front V-brake to get good stopping ability. Even with Kool Stops the original brakes are just too long. I also went to AL rims and Schwalbe Marathon tires. The original rims were pitted and the tires were shot.

If I were to going to replace the tires again I would not go with the Marathons.

I use Marathons 1.75" on mine, when they wear out I am going with Marathon Supremes in the 1.5", should be a better fit and ride.

Aaron :)

noglider 03-10-11 09:35 PM

How did you put a v-brake on?

Sixty Fiver 03-10-11 10:11 PM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 12344030)
How did you put a v-brake on?

There are a few ways to do this... you can change the fork to one that has the right bosses or modify the existing fork by adding them.

My P20 got cantis to allow for fender clearance and compatibility with road levers... an upgrade like his might run you $80.00 to have the bosses added front and rear.

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...rest21side.JPG

Built this up for a friend... used linear pull levers to handle the v brake up front and added a drop bolt for the rear caliper although we will probably add some new bosses in the rear for another v brake.

The stopping power is awe inspiring and the suspension fork really makes bad roads a non issue... and it is still an English three speed (with a lot of mods).

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikepics/gracedrop8.jpg

ahson 03-11-11 08:43 AM

Will any of you have a spare Raleigh crank 46t in clean working condition? I need it to complete my Superbe restore project.

That's the type of crankset I am looking for, 46t.

http://img.auctiva.com/imgdata/1/2/2...37866624_o.jpg


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