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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

tigervw78 10-17-18 08:40 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20620121)
At least if you switch back to a smaller cog, you can just shorten the chain and not buy a new one...
P.S. I'm proposing a new PBS segment on local TV.
Cog Talk
15 minutes a week
Phone in show
w /special guests.
Hopefully prizes (cogs)

I"d listen to that...

Dan Burkhart 10-17-18 08:50 AM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 20620502)
youtube is amazing. On youtube, I learned how to braid round challah bread, how to snake out a clogged sewer line, and how to make a heat tolerant gasket. I've watched Dan's videos on IGHs, and I haven't needed them, but I just plain enjoy them.

OMG I just saw that Dan has his videos in French, too! Quelle vrai Canadien!

Thanks Tom. My wife is fluently bilingual, that's her doing the voiceover. Hopefully some day, we will get around to doing more of them.

PeterLYoung 10-17-18 09:48 AM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 20620374)
I'm trouble shooting a hub of that model right now. Pretty sure I've identified the issues with it and will be posting a youtube video when I'm done, likely in a day or two.

Dan: Here is my 'Spare' BSA 3 Speed Hub Stripped, had hell of a job getting L/H End Plate (left hand thread) undone, used WD 40 + heating it up, eventually it gave in and came undone. I have stripped it as far as I needed to ascertain condition of parts so it is 90% dismantled. L/H Hub Cone is badly pitted, must have been run for some time in dry condition, also one of its ball bearings had escaped the cage and was inside the body of the hub. Rest of it looks OK after I cleaned all the dirt out (there was a lot). Although you cannot see them in this picture all the Pawls & Springs are working OK.
Look forward to your video.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...902417123b.jpg

BSA 3 Speed 'X' Type Hub 90% Stripped

Dan Burkhart 10-17-18 09:57 AM


Originally Posted by PeterLYoung (Post 20620744)
Dan: Here is my 'Spare' BSA 3 Speed Hub Stripped, had hell of a job getting L/H End Plate (left hand thread) undone, used WD 40 + heating it up, eventually it gave in and came undone. I have stripped it as far as I needed to ascertain condition of parts so it is 90% dismantled. L/H Hub Cone is badly pitted, must have been run for some time in dry condition, also one of its ball bearings had escaped the cage and was inside the body of the hub. Rest of it looks OK after I cleaned all the dirt out (there was a lot).
Look forward to your video.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...902417123b.jpg

BSA 3 Speed 'X' Type Hub 90% Stripped

You may be able to fit a new cone if you can find one of a similar radius profile. The axle is a 3/8 x 26, so your chances are pretty good. Unlikely that the shield that presses on to the cone would fit though, so you would have to figure out another way to shield the bearing.

PeterLYoung 10-17-18 10:45 AM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 20620766)
You may be able to fit a new cone if you can find one of a similar radius profile. The axle is a 3/8 x 26, so your chances are pretty good. Unlikely that the shield that presses on to the cone would fit though, so you would have to figure out another way to shield the bearing.

Dan: I am not planning to use use this hub other than for spare parts for my BSA Roaster 3 Speed Hub when I get to overhaul it so the worn cone will not be an issue but thanks for the suggestion.

F.Bacchus 10-17-18 11:23 AM

New Hudson Sports
 
Hello everyone,
I was wondering if anyone here could help me date my New Hudson sports. I got the frame in an extremely pitiful state so the only things that are original to the bike are the crank, fenders, and seat post; this has made dating it a bit more difficult. I know that the bike originally came with a single speed coaster brake bsa rear hub. The lack of a white stripe on the back of the fender places it as pre-war but I'm very curious about getting a more exact date.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cf9399cae8.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0a3a6a150e.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dc7098b070.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...fa79fa63c2.jpg
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9fc7d81398.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...410a4a9cec.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...b9d0fd1990.jpg

PeterLYoung 10-17-18 02:35 PM


Originally Posted by JaccoW (Post 20620469)
If you want the matching BSA dynohub, there is one for sale here: Sturmey Archer Vintage (BSA Front Hub Dino In Full Working Order Approx 1955 - Ebay.co.uk

Just ask the seller if he is willing to ship to the US

EDIT: Nevermind I see the bike has a front brake hub.

Kind of you to suggest this BSA Dyno Hub, which must be a rare thing, unfortunately my Roadster has hub brakes which are fairly rare and prelude me as you say fitting a Dyno Hub.

But Thanks anyway!!!

PeterLYoung 10-17-18 03:00 PM


Originally Posted by F.Bacchus (Post 20620953)
Hello everyone,
I was wondering if anyone here could help me date my New Hudson sports. I got the frame in an extremely pitiful state so the only things that are original to the bike are the crank, fenders, and seat post; this has made dating it a bit more difficult. I know that the bike originally came with a single speed coaster brake bsa rear hub. The lack of a white stripe on the back of the fender places it as pre-war but I'm very curious about getting a more exact date.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cf9399cae8.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0a3a6a150e.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dc7098b070.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...fa79fa63c2.jpg
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9fc7d81398.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...410a4a9cec.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...b9d0fd1990.jpg

1956 is the last year a catalogue is published on the UK's Veteran Cycle Club Website. Your bike looks similar to the one I extracted from the 1954 Catalogue below.https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...39a6a92848.png

This is all the information/documents on New Hudson in the VCC Library. You need to be a member to access these documents.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3d2f3ace91.png

From New Hudson 1956 Catalogue on Veteran Cycle Club Library, Last year they have a catalogue for.


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...84a8f2104d.png

The top Sports Model looks very similar to yours, this is from the 1954 Catalogue.

PeterLYoung 10-17-18 03:21 PM


Originally Posted by F.Bacchus (Post 20620953)
Hello everyone,
I was wondering if anyone here could help me date my New Hudson sports. I got the frame in an extremely pitiful state so the only things that are original to the bike are the crank, fenders, and seat post; this has made dating it a bit more difficult. I know that the bike originally came with a single speed coaster brake bsa rear hub. The lack of a white stripe on the back of the fender places it as pre-war but I'm very curious about getting a more exact date.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...cf9399cae8.jpg
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0a3a6a150e.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...dc7098b070.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...fa79fa63c2.jpg
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9fc7d81398.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...410a4a9cec.jpg
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...b9d0fd1990.jpg

A brief History of the New Hudson Company:-

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e8eb837ba4.png

Velo Mule 10-17-18 03:32 PM

Wow, the chrome on the fenders and the fenders (ehem, mudgards) themselves look great. The cranks too. It looks like the chainring was done a separate from the cranks or maybe the setting need to be different from the cranks? I wouldn't think that would be the case thought.

Nice bike. It is interesting to note that there is no roller for the 3 speed cable. Only cable housing. Does it shift smoothly. I imagine it does as long as the housing is nice and lubed.

clubman 10-17-18 03:36 PM


Originally Posted by F.Bacchus (Post 20620953)
Hello everyone,
I was wondering if anyone here could help me date my New Hudson sports.

The white fender rule doesn't apply here. Yours is a Raleigh made New Hudson and is therefore 57 or later. Serial numbers are only useful to a point since Raleigh lost most records in a fire. US frames of this timeframe usually had an RA prefix, Canada had an RC prefix but hard dates are impossible. Usually the 3 speed hub indicates the year or year before assembly. What's your numbers?

F.Bacchus 10-17-18 03:55 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20621333)
The white fender rule doesn't apply here. Yours is a Raleigh made New Hudson and is therefore 57 or later. Serial numbers are only useful to a point since Raleigh lost most records in a fire. US frames of this timeframe usually had an RA prefix, Canada had an RC prefix but hard dates are impossible. Usually the 3 speed hub indicates the year or year before assembly. What's your numbers?

Serial number is on the top of the seat lug, 2003027.
I was an idiot and threw out the original wheelset because they were almost literally made of rust and I didn't realise the value of the hub. Current wheels are replacements. The original was a single speed bsa coaster brake going off memory.


Originally Posted by Velo Mule (Post 20621325)
Nice bike. It is interesting to note that there is no roller for the 3 speed cable. Only cable housing. Does it shift smoothly. I imagine it does as long as the housing is nice and lubed.

The bike came with no hardware/fittings for a three speed shifter so I got an old sturmey shifter and bottom cable stop, then bought a new sturmey archer cable from the lbs. I assume that because it's modern its like a regular plastic lined brake cable, shifting is super smooth.

clubman 10-17-18 03:57 PM

I might add that your bike has unusual features. The fork has a non Raleigh standard headset, which happens on occasion. It could be your fork was old stock when Raleigh assembled it and therefore had the older British standard thread. Or the steerer was re-threaded at a later date. Not common but I once had a Nottingham Sports with a campy headset. The decals do look pre Raleigh but the rear mudguard stay location behind the axle is a Raleigh giveaway. That and the Raleigh stamped parts.

clubman 10-17-18 04:01 PM


Originally Posted by F.Bacchus (Post 20621360)
Serial number is on the top of the seat lug, 2003027.
I was an idiot and threw out the original wheelset because they were almost literally made of rust and I didn't realise the value of the hub. Current wheels are replacements. The original was a single speed bsa coaster brake going off memory.

Don't beat yourself up. These are fun, quality bikes and many have interesting stories but original rusty wheels aren't going to give it any real value. It's a good utilitarian bike and you should enjoy the ride.

F.Bacchus 10-17-18 04:03 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20621363)
I might add that your bike has unusual features. The fork has a non Raleigh standard headset, which happens on occasion. It could be your fork was old stock when Raleigh assembled it and therefore had the older British standard thread. Or the steerer was re-threaded at a later date. Not common but I once had a Nottingham Sports with a campy headset. The decals do look pre Raleigh but the rear mudguard stay location behind the axle is a Raleigh giveaway. That and the Raleigh stamped parts.

Ah forgot to say, the fork is a replacement taken off a torpado I believe, the original fork literally fell apart at the seams so I had to make do.

Edit: decided to look at the rear reflector to see who it was made by. Unfortunately it's broken but the text that remains reads "B.S.A.U 40 LI LIC.2628 FAIRYLITES BRITISH MADE I 32".
I think a Raleigh made bike would have a sturmey reflector?
Could the I 32 be a date code for January 1932?
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1a93082ec1.jpg

BigChief 10-17-18 08:39 PM

The Raleigh frame is post1963 since there is no lug on the drive side chainstay for an enclosed chain case. There's no lug for the 3 point chainguard which was added in the late 60s. So, from what I see, I'll call the frame 1963- 1967.

Dan Burkhart 10-18-18 12:56 PM


Originally Posted by PeterLYoung (Post 20620744)
Look forward to your video.

Here it is. Quite lengthy. I will try to edit it down a bit when I get a chance. Also don't have the closed captioning edited yet, so it will be the always comical voice to text version for now.

BigChief 10-18-18 05:55 PM

Great job!!! I really appreciate your work on this. I wish I had a video like this back when I did the S5. These videos are a wonderful asset for our hobby. Hope to see more.

gster 10-19-18 05:16 AM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 20622725)
Here it is. Quite lengthy. I will try to edit it down a bit when I get a chance. Also don't have the closed captioning edited yet, so it will be the always comical voice to text version for now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvKyiajpTEo

Excellent tutorial.
Thanks

butch50 10-19-18 08:57 AM


Originally Posted by agmetal (Post 20620558)
I have the headlamp working with an LED bulb (I got one with a 3000K "warm white" color, so it actually looks similar to an incandescent when lit up), but haven't been able to find a suitable bulb for the rear yet. A friend and I are discussing how to reduce the flicker, and whether the smoothing/standlight(?) circuit can be built into a form small enough to fit inside the housing of the light.

Try looking here: reflectalite dot com


He has lots of useful information on the website.

butch50 10-19-18 09:04 AM

There are several simple circuits on that website for using either capacitors, for a short standlight, or nicad cells. Also how to recharge nicads,from a Dynohub or generator, also simple voltage regulators that mount on Dynohub terminals. (probably zener diodes).

BigChief 10-19-18 11:26 AM


Originally Posted by butch50 (Post 20623901)
There are several simple circuits on that website for using either capacitors, for a short standlight, or nicad cells. Also how to recharge nicads,from a Dynohub or generator, also simple voltage regulators that mount on Dynohub terminals. (probably zener diodes).

Or you could just use the bulbs. The red LED tail light bulb is quite bright. Handy that it's a red LED since the once red plastic lens on mine faded to a pale amber over the years. The strobe effect smooths out once you reach 10mph or so.

agmetal 10-19-18 07:35 PM


Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart (Post 20622725)
Here it is. Quite lengthy. I will try to edit it down a bit when I get a chance. Also don't have the closed captioning edited yet, so it will be the always comical voice to text version for now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvKyiajpTEo

One thing I've always been curious about with these...how does the cable pull on the shifter compare to an AW hub? Would the shifters be interchangeable?

BigChief 10-19-18 08:06 PM


Originally Posted by agmetal (Post 20624759)
One thing I've always been curious about with these...how does the cable pull on the shifter compare to an AW hub? Would the shifters be interchangeable?

That's a good question. Can you "flick" instead of "snap"? Of course, I don't know, but the BSA hub does seem to be an exact copy of the SA X hub. Here's a picture of the SA X hub shifter. Same as the BSA and looks similar to the later quadrant shifter. I have seen people use quadrant shifters on AW hubs. That's a lot of ifs, but there's a chance it might work. edit..Looks like Low Normal and High would be backwards though.
SA X hub shifter

agmetal 10-19-18 08:33 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20624796)
That's a good question. Can you "flick" instead of "snap"? Of course, I don't know, but the BSA hub does seem to be an exact copy of the SA X hub. Here's a picture of the SA X hub shifter. Same as the BSA and looks similar to the later quadrant shifter. I have seen people use quadrant shifters on AW hubs. That's a lot of ifs, but there's a chance it might work. edit..Looks like Low Normal and High would be backwards though.
SA X hub shifter

I've even got a quadrant shifter controlling a modern X-RD3 hub!

gster 10-20-18 05:50 AM

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1430cf310e.jpg
Speaking of BSA, this bike may join the fleet today.
I've contacted the seller and hopefully I can get him to ride it over to my house..
Listed as a 1956.

Dan Burkhart 10-20-18 05:54 AM


Originally Posted by agmetal (Post 20624759)
One thing I've always been curious about with these...how does the cable pull on the shifter compare to an AW hub? Would the shifters be interchangeable?

This bike is equipped with a Sturmey Archer compatible Brampton shifter. It works fine, except the low/high markings are reversed for this hub.
In first gear, the cable is slack, as it should be, the adjustment indicator is in the proper place in second, and it pulls far enough to fully engage third.
The two piece spring loaded indicator rod passes through the shift key rather than threaded into it in modern Sturmey Archer hubs. This means there is no hard stop for the indicator, and when the mechanism reaches full travel and third gear is fully engaged, the indicator can continue to travel, compressing the spring until the shifter clicks into the shift detent.

http://i63.tinypic.com/2uzyplf.jpg

BigChief 10-20-18 08:55 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20625070)
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1430cf310e.jpg
Speaking of BSA, this bike may join the fleet today.
I've contacted the seller and hopefully I can get him to ride it over to my house..
Listed as a 1956.

Nice! Pre Raleigh. Dyno too. 56 sounds right from the looks of it. Already has a riser stem. Maybe it will already fit you if you raise the saddle. Looks like you'll have a chance to use one of those shifters you rebuilt.

gster 10-20-18 10:38 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20625243)
Nice! Pre Raleigh. Dyno too. 56 sounds right from the looks of it. Already has a riser stem. Maybe it will already fit you if you raise the saddle. Looks like you'll have a chance to use one of those shifters you rebuilt.

Thanks.
Spoke to the owner and he's dropping it off at my house today...
$80.00 (CDN)
He says it's a sturmey hub so we'll see.
I should have a proper stem in stock as well as a leather saddle and we'll see about the rest of it when it arrives.
I had said no more small bikes but I couldn't resist a BSA at that price.

gster 10-20-18 03:37 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20625070)
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1430cf310e.jpg
Speaking of BSA, this bike may join the fleet today.
I've contacted the seller and hopefully I can get him to ride it over to my house..
Listed as a 1956.

The bike did arrive today and it's a little rougher than it appears in the photo...
they always do.
The Good
Vintage frame in reasonable shape (straight)
BSA chain ring
Decorative front forks
Dyno hub
Newish front tire
1961 SA hub
one good caliper
Faint "Tour of Britain" decal
Cranks are straight

The Bad
paint is rough (I will leave as is)
back tire needs replacing
Cables and brake pads crap
vinyl saddle
Cheap grips
modern trigger
weird modern stem
Chrome fenders from an Eatons Glider
crappy brake levers
cranks are mis aligned
cotters driven in from same side
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c400da0db0.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...496fe9c8b3.jpg
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...024dc5113b.jpg



Somebody has clearly messed this up a bit.
Not surprising for a bike 60+ years old.

So I think this one's a good candidate for a semi-scorcher.
I have most of the parts I need in the garage


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