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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

BigChief 11-24-18 05:28 AM

Oh good. Didn't know you had all the good tools. I don't usually remove the fixed cup for a BB servicing, but it's really nice to have Mark's tool handy if you want to. It usually takes me a few times of loosening and re tightening before I'm happy with the adjustment. Such a tiny turn of the cup makes the difference between perfect and too tight. I go by that binding feeling. I keep backing off the cup until just after it spins freely. Sometimes, I think I have it perfect and I give the lock ring a last tightening only to feel it binding and I have to start all over again. It's fussy.

nlerner 11-24-18 07:12 AM

One more thought: Did you replace the bearings? A fresh set would rule out any deformities.

wahoonc 11-24-18 07:44 AM

From the look of that spindle you either have something that was cross threaded in the past or the BB faces aren't quite parallel.

Aaron:)

gster 11-24-18 08:37 AM

Fussy is right.
I find that adjusting by the book, i.e no play in the spindle, that it often feels
a little tight, i.e. some resistance. But when the cranks and pedals are installed, the
added momentum/centrifugal action corrects this.
It's difficult to explain on paper...
Once adjusted, you should be good for 10-20 years.
How long do those sealed cartridges last?

A modern day classic...
Raleigh Tourist.
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9b0f3e9cf4.jpg
The kick stand looks good....

jamesj 11-24-18 11:36 AM


Originally Posted by wahoonc (Post 20675717)
From the look of that spindle you either have something that was cross threaded in the past or the BB faces aren't quite parallel. I also came across this thread too, same problems Iím having. Think Iíll just build it and ride it. https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...ket-issue.html

Aaron:)


Aaron, I feel like the BB Faces are not parallel which is causing the spindle to bind at certain spots. this might be the case. On my 1979 sport that bottom bracket adjusted perfectly. This one is giving me so much trouble.

dweenk 11-24-18 01:29 PM

Raleigh Sprite 5 Speed
 
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5ad84cb43f.jpg
I just can't decide what to do with this 1969/1970 Sprite. It is a large step-through frame (green) with the original Presstube rack. It must have been stored near pool chemicals or fertilizer since the head badge is corroded a bit. The original downtube shifters were donated to another BF member (left shift lever broken). The rest of the bike is in good condition.I put used trigger shifters on the bars, and worked on getting the bell crank side functional. Now I am thinking that:

I could move the 5 speed rear wheel to a Raleigh Sports that I currently use; and move the 3 speed wheel to the Sprite, and sell it. (that would make the Sprite less desirable)
I could sell the Sprite as it is with a 5 speed rear hub. (that would keep the value)
I could part it out. (probably make the most money, but I hate doing that)

BTW: I have a perfectly good step through frame Raleigh Sports for my dotage; I bought this one because it was there.

BigChief 11-24-18 03:03 PM


Originally Posted by dweenk (Post 20676086)
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5ad84cb43f.jpg
I just can't decide what to do with this 1969/1970 Sprite. It is a large step-through frame (green) with the original Presstube rack. It must have been stored near pool chemicals or fertilizer since the head badge is corroded a bit. The original downtube shifters were donated to another BF member (left shift lever broken). The rest of the bike is in good condition.I put used trigger shifters on the bars, and worked on getting the bell crank side functional. Now I am thinking that:

I could move the 5 speed rear wheel to a Raleigh Sports that I currently use; and move the 3 speed wheel to the Sprite, and sell it. (that would make the Sprite less desirable)
I could sell the Sprite as it is with a 5 speed rear hub. (that would keep the value)
I could part it out. (probably make the most money, but I hate doing that)

BTW: I have a perfectly good step through frame Raleigh Sports for my dotage; I bought this one because it was there.

I think the S5 is a bit wasted on a roadster. That medium ratio spread with the bell crank disengaged is pretty sporty. It would go nicely on a club or scorcher build. Me, I'd swap in an AW and find the stepthrough a new home.

dweenk 11-24-18 03:09 PM

@BigChief You have reinforced my first choice.

BigChief 11-25-18 11:02 AM

Haven't had a ride in weeks, no projects going, this is awful. Got to thinking about converting this 70s Sports to a 5 speed with the S5.2 hub I have. Somebody before me laced a CR18 rim onto the 36H AW hub. Done incorrectly, the spokes cross over the air valve. Bugs me. I need to take it apart anyway. Might as well install the S5. Might not be permanent, but a S5 on an alloy rim is always a good thing to have around.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...362ea1331c.jpg

mirfi 11-25-18 02:14 PM

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...81c411c361.jpg
NOT a three speed, but of interest nonetheless. Plus $20

https://baltimore.craigslist.org/bik...752103086.html

arty dave 11-25-18 09:05 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20676916)
Haven't had a ride in weeks, no projects going, this is awful. Got to thinking about converting this 70s Sports to a 5 speed with the S5.2 hub I have. Somebody before me laced a CR18 rim onto the 36H AW hub. Done incorrectly, the spokes cross over the air valve. Bugs me. I need to take it apart anyway. Might as well install the S5. Might not be permanent, but a S5 on an alloy rim is always a good thing to have around.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...362ea1331c.jpg

You definitely should BC... they're such a cool hub to ride with. I've finally started on my S5 project bike. I found an alloy 40 hole AW hub shell locally, and picked up a Resilion front brake as the project bike has no brake drillings. I'm doing this as low budget as possible, so parts collecting has taken a while. I'll post an image once there's a bit more to show; at the moment it's in partly painted pieces.
For the shifting I'd like to do bare cable through a pulley to the hub, so I'm thinking of making a double pulley - has anyone done this for the 2 cable S5 hubs? I've never seen any reference to Sturmey Archer having made one, maybe they did?

jamesj 11-25-18 09:11 PM

Found a super crappy Sport for $20 bucks. I wasn’t going to buy it but the old lady was nice. And I figured I could just save the parts in case I ever needed them. Rear hub was a shimano coaster laced to RigidaChromage Superchromix 26x1 3/8 rim front is original Sturmey Archer hub and rim. It had a stuck seapost and stuck stem. The stem came out pretty easy but I noticed it was bent. Seatpost was super stuck but I was able to get it out. It is missing fenders, chainguard, and has mismatched brakes. Everything else looked pretty good. Bottom bracket and the headset came apart easily.



Im not sure what im going to do with the frame isn’t bent or anything really wrong with it.


https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5414fa8a14.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b51756731.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...621096ed17.jpg

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...569bb0eaa7.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0de5e1d0dc.jpg

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e5ac80b4d9.jpg

BigChief 11-25-18 10:09 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20677656)
You definitely should BC... they're such a cool hub to ride with. I've finally started on my S5 project bike. I found an alloy 40 hole AW hub shell locally, and picked up a Resilion front brake as the project bike has no brake drillings. I'm doing this as low budget as possible, so parts collecting has taken a while. I'll post an image once there's a bit more to show; at the moment it's in partly painted pieces.
For the shifting I'd like to do bare cable through a pulley to the hub, so I'm thinking of making a double pulley - has anyone done this for the 2 cable S5 hubs? I've never seen any reference to Sturmey Archer having made one, maybe they did?

I never liked the idea of running a fully housed cable all the way down to a stop on the chain stay for 3 speed hubs. The top tube stop and guide wheel feels so much more responsive and precise. A sprite I have originally had two top tube mounted stick shifters with full housed cables to a stop on the seat stays on both sides. I changed the right side 3 speed to the usual top tube stop and guide wheel and handlebar mounted 3 speed trigger. For the left side bell crank, I used a handlebar mounted SunTour power shifter, fully housed cable along the top tube to the original stop on the seat stay. Works well, but now that I look at it, I think the top tube looks too cluttered with all those cables. This time, I think I'll route the bell crank cable along the down tube to a stop on the chain stay. I am satisfied with a fully housed cable to operate the bell crank.

arty dave 11-25-18 11:00 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20677731)
I never liked the idea of running a fully housed cable all the way down to a stop on the chain stay for 3 speed hubs. The top tube stop and guide wheel feels so much more responsive and precise. A sprite I have originally had two top tube mounted stick shifters with full housed cables to a stop on the seat stays on both sides. I changed the right side 3 speed to the usual top tube stop and guide wheel and handlebar mounted 3 speed trigger. For the left side bell crank, I used a handlebar mounted SunTour power shifter, fully housed cable along the top tube to the original stop on the seat stay. Works well, but now that I look at it, I think the top tube looks too cluttered with all those cables. This time, I think I'll route the bell crank cable along the down tube to a stop on the chain stay. I am satisfied with a fully housed cable to operate the bell crank.

That was another option I was contemplating - and you're right, with a rear brake cable there might be too much action on the top tube. I have a bike set up with a Sachs 3 speed coaster hub, and that's running bare cable from a stop on the down tube through a pulley at the bottom of the seat tube. I've read that some people don't like this routing as you can snag your heel on the bare cable, but I've never experienced this. A chain guard would easily take care of this if it was an issue.

BigChief 11-26-18 08:13 AM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20677778)
That was another option I was contemplating - and you're right, with a rear brake cable there might be too much action on the top tube. I have a bike set up with a Sachs 3 speed coaster hub, and that's running bare cable from a stop on the down tube through a pulley at the bottom of the seat tube. I've read that some people don't like this routing as you can snag your heel on the bare cable, but I've never experienced this. A chain guard would easily take care of this if it was an issue.

The hub I have is a S5.2 from the early 80s. It doesn't have a bell crank. The left side has an indicator spindle and chain like the right side, so it operates the other way around. Medium ratios are with the cable tight and wide is slack cable. I hope it works as well as the bell crank, we'll see. It came with the top tube shifters, but I won't use them. Back in the day, the convenience of handlebar shifting was unique to IG hubs and is something I always appreciated about these bikes. TT shifting seems awkward and unnecessary to me.

Stenavpix 11-26-18 12:20 PM

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...28c595b071.jpg
https://denver.craigslist.org/bik/d/...757531064.html

Craigslist Denver, CO - For sale in Longmont, CO

VERY RARE 1954 Rudge-Whitworth 3-speed bicycle - $350

(Not my CL posting, just sharing in case anyone here is interested)

clubman 11-26-18 01:17 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20677778)
I've read that some people don't like this routing as you can snag your heel on the bare cable, but I've never experienced this. A chain guard would easily take care of this if it was an issue.

The main problem the bottom routing is that an SA hubs finicky gear adjustment will be altered with any axle movement in the dropouts, for instance if you slide the wheel back in the drops to take up chain slack. A top mounted pulley/cable intersects with the axle perpendicular to the the drops so the gears remain more or less unaffected by wheel adjustments. As BC suggests, it tends to stay more precise.

dweenk 11-26-18 01:28 PM


Originally Posted by Stenavpix (Post 20678434)
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...28c595b071.jpg
https://denver.craigslist.org/bik/d/...757531064.html

Craigslist Denver, CO - For sale in Longmont, CO

VERY RARE 1954 Rudge-Whitworth 3-speed bicycle - $350

(Not my CL posting, just sharing in case anyone here is interested)

Seems overpriced to me considering the step through frame and plastic saddle. But is does have a dyno hub.

arty dave 11-26-18 03:29 PM


Originally Posted by DQRider (Post 20667254)

Looking great! Are these the original bars? Flipped north roads or something else? Did you do some ageing to the metal parts of the grips?

arty dave 11-26-18 03:34 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20668543)

Nice progress! That extra bit of chrome bling below the fork crown adds a really nice touch to the look of the bike.

arty dave 11-26-18 03:43 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20678542)
The main problem the bottom routing is that an SA hubs finicky gear adjustment will be altered with any axle movement in the dropouts, for instance if you slide the wheel back in the drops to take up chain slack. A top mounted pulley/cable intersects with the axle perpendicular to the the drops so the gears remain more or less unaffected by wheel adjustments. As BC suggests, it tends to stay more precise.

Good point clubman, I hadn't considered that - I think I'll set up the cabling differently when I move the hub to a new bike - otherwise I'll be fiddling with the cable stop and cable adjustment as you say - each time I move the wheel in the dropouts.

DQRider 11-26-18 03:51 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20678784)
Looking great! Are these the original bars? Flipped north roads or something else? Did you do some ageing to the metal parts of the grips?


Thanks, Dave! That's a Soma Oxford (Northroads style) handlebar, flipped.

As for the grips, well... I paid for the privilege of having them look old and worn:

Part Num 605184
Brooks Plump Leather Ring Grips - Aged

I'll take a Dremel with a polishing disc to them before I mount them for real. This yields a nice, burnished look that fits right in with the age of the bike.


gster 11-26-18 04:16 PM


Originally Posted by jamesj (Post 20677666)
Found a super crappy Sport for $20 bucks. I wasnít going to buy it but the old lady was nice. And I figured I could just save the parts in case I ever needed them. Rear hub was a shimano coaster laced to RigidaChromage Superchromix 26x1 3/8 rim front is original Sturmey Archer hub and rim. It had a stuck seapost and stuck stem. The stem came out pretty easy but I noticed it was bent. Seatpost was super stuck but I was able to get it out. It is missing fenders, chainguard, and has mismatched brakes. Everything else looked pretty good. Bottom bracket and the headset came apart easily.



Im not sure what im going to do with the frame isnít bent or anything really wrong with it.


https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5414fa8a14.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b51756731.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...621096ed17.jpg

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...569bb0eaa7.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0de5e1d0dc.jpg

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e5ac80b4d9.jpg

That stamped eye on the heron dates it to pre 1962 and worth the $20.00 alone.

gster 11-26-18 04:18 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20676916)
Haven't had a ride in weeks, no projects going, this is awful. Got to thinking about converting this 70s Sports to a 5 speed with the S5.2 hub I have. Somebody before me laced a CR18 rim onto the 36H AW hub. Done incorrectly, the spokes cross over the air valve. Bugs me. I need to take it apart anyway. Might as well install the S5. Might not be permanent, but a S5 on an alloy rim is always a good thing to have around.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...362ea1331c.jpg

I DO have an original set of top tube shifters for a 5 speed that you might like....
|I replaced them with the throttle style

clubman 11-26-18 05:05 PM


Originally Posted by jamesj (Post 20677666)

Im not sure what im going to do with the frame isnít bent or anything really wrong with it.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5414fa8a14.jpg

I think that's early 50's and you may have the original deep bars found on the Clubmans and Lenton Sports. Pretty desirable bars.

clubman 11-26-18 05:10 PM

Also, I'd love to have that one in my shed...:thumb:

Alas, I've got three early Sports already in the queue so I can't make you an offer. :(

I think the front wheel should have a Raleigh Industries hub, Sturmey Archers came later.

BigChief 11-26-18 07:06 PM


Originally Posted by jamesj (Post 20677666)
Found a super crappy Sport for $20 bucks. I wasnít going to buy it but the old lady was nice. And I figured I could just save the parts in case I ever needed them. Rear hub was a shimano coaster laced to RigidaChromage Superchromix 26x1 3/8 rim front is original Sturmey Archer hub and rim. It had a stuck seapost and stuck stem. The stem came out pretty easy but I noticed it was bent. Seatpost was super stuck but I was able to get it out. It is missing fenders, chainguard, and has mismatched brakes. Everything else looked pretty good. Bottom bracket and the headset came apart easily.



Im not sure what im going to do with the frame isnít bent or anything really wrong with it.


https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...5414fa8a14.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...2b51756731.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...621096ed17.jpg

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...569bb0eaa7.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0de5e1d0dc.jpg

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e5ac80b4d9.jpg

Great deal for 20 bucks! Looks like the 32 spoke Raleigh pattern rim is decent shape. Nice 48T crank in very good condition, the frame is late 60s, wonder where those drop bars came from. I wouldn't have passed up that deal either.

gster 11-26-18 07:48 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20678794)
Nice progress! That extra bit of chrome bling below the fork crown adds a really nice touch to the look of the bike.

Thx!

BigChief 11-26-18 08:17 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20679184)
Thx!

+1. I really like this one.

clubman 11-26-18 08:27 PM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20679124)
Great deal for 20 bucks! Looks like the 32 spoke Raleigh pattern rim is decent shape. Nice 48T crank in very good condition, the frame is late 60s, wonder where those drop bars came from. I wouldn't have passed up that deal either.

I'm curious as to why you think that's late 60's with that funky font, Lenton green colour and what appears to be birdsmouth lugs? It also appears to have the front mudguard braze-ons are higher up the fork. I've always used the Headbadge to ID these bikes. Better close up pics would help. Looks like this 53 model to me.
Edit The serial number does look like 60's format.


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