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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

arty dave 11-27-18 04:20 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20679747)
Thanks, its' a work in progress with some more details to attend to come spring. I do have a nice set of drop bars that would look good but wouldn't suit my
riding style. The rear wheel/ hub (1961), although rust free and smooth shifting has a terrible warp that has been slightly corrected (by reefing on it).
I've never laced a wheel so that may be part of my continuing education....

I'm with you with the drop bars... I like to think I could do it and I like the look of them on certain bikes. Particularly vintage shaped handlebars - I have some late 30's bars shaped like Velo Oranges Randonneur bars that I may try with a long stem. But generally my neck doesn't like it, I'm fine with the speeds I can get to on non-drop bars, and I just like being able to take in my surroundings as I'm riding. It's part of the happy happy joy joy thing of the whole experience.
Learning lacing is a nice feather to have in your cap - there's some good paint by numbers instructions out there. Actually there's a good Raleigh wheel building manual - I'll see if I can find it. In my current times of thrift I've taken to buying cheap stainless laced wheels from the landfill shop to harvest spokes from. No breakages yet.

efleigh89 11-27-18 04:34 PM

Used to have an old raleigh 3 speed with the thumb shifter and the old collapsed Brooks seat and all, it was creaky a d heavy but really fun to cruise around on.

gster 11-27-18 05:04 PM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20680727)
I'm with you with the drop bars... I like to think I could do it and I like the look of them on certain bikes. Particularly vintage shaped handlebars - I have some late 30's bars shaped like Velo Oranges Randonneur bars that I may try with a long stem. But generally my neck doesn't like it, I'm fine with the speeds I can get to on non-drop bars, and I just like being able to take in my surroundings as I'm riding. It's part of the happy happy joy joy thing of the whole experience.
Learning lacing is a nice feather to have in your cap - there's some good paint by numbers instructions out there. Actually there's a good Raleigh wheel building manual - I'll see if I can find it. In my current times of thrift I've taken to buying cheap stainless laced wheels from the landfill shop to harvest spokes from. No breakages yet.

Yes, aesthetically the drop bars look good. I wish my back and neck agreed.
Lacing a wheel is on my list.
I like the recycling angle.
Good for everyone.

BigChief 11-27-18 05:30 PM


Originally Posted by efleigh89 (Post 20680744)
Used to have an old raleigh 3 speed with the thumb shifter and the old collapsed Brooks seat and all, it was creaky a d heavy but really fun to cruise around on.

You should try it again sometime. Especially if you only rode one as a kid and didn't have the knowledge about setup you have now. They can be very pleasant to ride within their limits.

56ford 11-27-18 08:59 PM

I apologize in advance if this question has been asked and answered but Iím curious about wheels. Can I run an alloy wheel on the front and keep the original steel on the rear? Thanks!

Cute Boy Horse 11-27-18 10:22 PM

I'm afraid not, the polarity is different and so the bike will end up trying to go in two directions at once.

gster 11-28-18 02:10 PM


Originally Posted by Cute Boy Horse (Post 20681222)
I'm afraid not, the polarity is different and so the bike will end up trying to go in two directions at once.

I strongly disagree.
The heavier weight of the rear wheel (steel) will increase the momentum of the spinning wheel through centrifugal force
and therefore cause it to turn at a faster rate than the front wheel.
In time, when riding, (even at moderate speeds) you will find the speed and inertia of the rear wheel
will cause it to accelerate past the front.
This can happen quite suddenly and without warning.
This would be a dangerous situation for all concerned.
Rider and innocent bystanders alike.

Ballenxj 11-28-18 02:47 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20682152)
I strongly disagree.
The heavier weight of the rear wheel (steel) will increase the momentum of the spinning wheel through centrifugal force
and therefore cause it to turn at a faster rate than the front wheel.
In time, when riding, (even at moderate speeds) you will find the speed and inertia of the rear wheel
will cause it to accelerate past the front.
This can happen quite suddenly and without warning.
This would be a dangerous situation for all concerned.
Rider and innocent bystanders alike.

You are both wrong, the reverse polarity can, and might cause levitation at the most inopportune times, but if you learn to control this, you then have an opportunity for a remake of E.T.
Sample of what could happen. --->

gster 11-28-18 03:01 PM


Originally Posted by Ballenxj (Post 20682210)
You are both wrong, the reverse polarity can, and might cause levitation at the most inopportune times, but if you learn to control this, you then have an opportunity for a remake of E.T.
Sample of what could happen. --->http://youtu.be/gTVoFCP1BLg

I've read a NASA research paper on the subject.
You obviously have access to their TOP SECRET,
Area 51 experimental test video.
Is there a Flux Capacitor involved?

Ballenxj 11-28-18 03:05 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20682240)
I've read a NASA research paper on the subject.
You obviously have access to their TOP SECRET,
Area 51 experimental test video.
Is there a Flux Capacitor involved?

Shhh, I cannot divulge that intel. ;)

52telecaster 11-28-18 03:13 PM


Originally Posted by 56ford (Post 20681109)
I apologize in advance if this question has been asked and answered but Iím curious about wheels. Can I run an alloy wheel on the front and keep the original steel on the rear? Thanks!

yes

clubman 11-29-18 11:35 AM

Britain abandoned the guards on export models because of import tariffs based on weight, or so the popular wisdom goes.

Most of the dutch chainguards were and are reasonably light. Usually it's a metal frame with fibrous panels, almost like a leatherette (or plastic) so the weight penalty is minimal. These never went out of style in Holland, where a large segment of the urban population continues to commute by bike.

BigChief 12-01-18 08:35 AM

Nice looking 1950 Humber in N.H.

https://nh.craigslist.org/bik/d/1950...747232601.html

gster 12-01-18 09:00 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20686111)

I would say that it was a fair price @ 275.00
Old
Complete
Good paint/decals
Dynohub
Looks like a 22"

Stadjer 12-01-18 11:48 AM


Originally Posted by mtb_addict (Post 20683303)
Anybody know why the British decide to build so few bikes with full chain cover, unlike the Dutch?

As I understand the Dutch copied the original British Roadster which had a full chain cover. The Dutch kept the full chain cover and became the norm on almost all their bicycles. Looks like the British abandoned the full chain cover for some reason.

The Dutch copied a lot but also made a lot of changes for the Dutch market. The oil bath chaincase was a British invention, but I believe some improvement in chain technology allowed for just a full leather or fabric cover and that's probably when it became standard on Dutch bikes. It's nice if you don't want to do any maintenance like most Dutch, but if you have to anyway it's a pain in the ass. It makes changing a tube quite a job and it's opening them that wears them out quite quickly. It's a fiddly job that most people don't get right.

The main difference is that the Dutch abandon the full chain case if the first one is beyond repair, usually well before the bike has become an old beater. Fitting a new one is an expensive job, especially if you have it done. So often it gets replaces with a small chain guard or a guard that is only fully closed on one side, but on a new bike there shoulde be a full one. On my 40-year old Dutch roadster it's still on, but not perfectly and only after I learned the saddle stitch, used glue and repaired a hole with duct tape. Maybe I can take it off two more times before it's finished, and then it will be very hard to find a replacement in the right colour, seventies brown.

So actually it makes sense to abandon it and just oil and change the chain more frequently, especially if the bike is mainly for touring in nice weather than for a daily commute in suit in Dutch weather.


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20683365)
Britain abandoned the guards on export models because of import tariffs based on weight, or so the popular wisdom goes.

Most of the dutch chainguards were and are reasonably light. Usually it's a metal frame with fibrous panels, almost like a leatherette (or plastic) so the weight penalty is minimal. These never went out of style in Holland, where a large segment of the urban population continues to commute by bike.

I'm pretty sure weight has never been much of a consideration for Dutch bikes. There were a lot of metal full chain cases in the 60's and 70's too, and these days it's more often hard plastic. The fabric ones are mostly for the (black) classic models.

browngw 12-01-18 10:05 PM

No tariffs between Britain and Canada at the time. I guess that's why we got the full chaincase as well. My 1979 DL1 sold in Hamilton ON.https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1da5a1a637.jpg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...ff1c9182da.jpg

clubman 12-01-18 10:27 PM

I think you're wrong. Canada and 23 others were founding members of GATT in 1947, whose job it was to reduce highly protectionist policies that had been in place dating back before the war and into the depression. It took decades to accomplish substantial reductions. The US continued to practice high tariffs with Europe for some time. GATT evolved into the WTO and continued the reduction of tariffs from an average of 40% in '47 to an average of 5% today but can't find numbers on the bike business. I'd assume there was some protectionism across most all sectors. The fact that some bikes made it here with full chainguards is not really important.

BigChief 12-02-18 05:06 AM

I think customer preference is the main reason for the scarcity of enclosed chaincases in the US. I can think of many reasons they would not have been considered a desirable or practical feature in America during the early post war years.

52telecaster 12-02-18 07:45 AM

I maintain a small bike share in peoria illinois. The bikes we use are breezers with a sa 5 speed hub and a chaincase. Its made of plastic and it sucks when you have to fix a flat in back. They are solid bikes but raliegh sports with an aw hub and a dyno upfront would be better in my book. Wouldnt be any heavier either.

JohnDThompson 12-02-18 09:19 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20687223)
I think customer preference is the main reason for the scarcity of enclosed chaincases in the US. I can think of many reasons they would not have been considered a desirable or practical feature in America during the early post war years.

They make fixing a flat rear tire considerably more difficult.

Perhaps the popularity of tubeless tires lately will bring a resurgence of enclosed chain cases?

BigChief 12-02-18 10:27 AM

Yes, flats for one. Also they require extra adjustment to avoid rattles. The advantage was keeping the oily chain away from clothing and road grit. Neither is much of an issue for kids or a recreational bicycle. A utility bike to get you to work and shopping never caught on in America like it did in England. The weather here is more extreme and the distances are too far. In my early childhood, the sight of an adult on a bicycle was very rare. Bicycles were for kids. The English roadsters for older kids, high school and collage students. The hockey stick chainguard was far more practical for them.

gster 12-02-18 11:55 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20687427)
Yes, flats for one. Also they require extra adjustment to avoid rattles. The advantage was keeping the oily chain away from clothing and road grit. Neither is much of an issue for kids or a recreational bicycle. A utility bike to get you to work and shopping never caught on in America like it did in England. The weather here is more extreme and the distances are too far. In my early childhood, the sight of an adult on a bicycle was very rare. Bicycles were for kids. The English roadsters for older kids, high school and collage students. The hockey stick chainguard was far more practical for them.

I have one bike (a '50 Hercules) with a full chaincase that's been apart and back together.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...04b743acd3.jpg
And it really is a pain in the a*s to do any work on it.
Even attaching the chain was an issue...
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0fba97446c.jpg
I had to invert the bike like this.
It still rattles and scrapes a bit but does look good.

Buellster 12-02-18 02:55 PM

Hey guys!
I'm back!
I've picked up something very odd.
It was advertised as a "single speed" but I was pretty sure I spotted an SA hub. Sure enough the ad said "SA single speed hub". I asked him about it and he just said "it's a single speed"
I went out and looked, paid all of 25 for it and found a 68 SA aw hub mounted in a 700c rim!
this bike may be exactly what I've been wanting to plug my 4 speed into!
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...323b6196f9.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e99846b7c9.jpg

The seat was tragically stolen off it, it was a brooks and one of the main reasons I wanted to get it. With the seat gone he cut the price in half and gave the whole thing to me for 25. At 50 the brooks would have been awesome, a 700c SA hub for 25 is still pretty amazing!

gster 12-02-18 04:36 PM


Originally Posted by Buellster (Post 20687791)
Hey guys!
I'm back!
I've picked up something very odd.
It was advertised as a "single speed" but I was pretty sure I spotted an SA hub. Sure enough the ad said "SA single speed hub". I asked him about it and he just said "it's a single speed"
I went out and looked, paid all of 25 for it and found a 68 SA aw hub mounted in a 700c rim!
this bike may be exactly what I've been wanting to plug my 4 speed into!
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...323b6196f9.jpg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...e99846b7c9.jpg

The seat was tragically stolen off it, it was a brooks and one of the main reasons I wanted to get it. With the seat gone he cut the price in half and gave the whole thing to me for 25. At 50 the brooks would have been awesome, a 700c SA hub for 25 is still pretty amazing!

At $25.00 I'd say a GREAT deal.
Extra tall frame.
Looks like originally a 10 speed.
Chromed fork ends are a nice bonus as well

raleighroadster 12-02-18 09:49 PM

1939 time warp Raleigh sports tourist, ,bought todayhttps://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7561a9179.jpeg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6f6be9e52.jpeg
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...65518d22e.jpeg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...830479dcd.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...9541554a5.jpeg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...906be9d71.jpeg
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c0a01c87f.jpeg
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...aa77c61dc.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...86c6c807a.jpeg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...a09f6cc63.jpeg1931 flashlight holder on handlebars!Will replace the aftermarket grips with a pair of original ones I got from England, and will find original style brake blocks. The wheels run true, rear could be touched up. Dunlap steel rims .tangent frame mount shifter works well. Came with owners sheet , original tools, original raleigh pump which still works, 4 spring steel pants clamps, and a really old Sturmey Archer all metal oil can w metal extension tube on top to reach hub oil port. Bought from son, father rode it from new until he died 15 years ago. Stored inside all of its 79 years and hardly ridden. Shiny paint and complete decals. A w 9 on rear 3 spd hub, 1939 , which also agrees w serial number. Will shine it up and get some better photos using the dslr.
owner said after he put new tires , brake blocks and handgrips on it he took it on a 10 mi ride with no issues.


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