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-   -   Totally Tubular (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=154679)

CV-6 01-15-18 12:14 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20111058)
The tire is marked competition 19 and 19mm. Not marked with a size. Never mounted before. I will keep trying. Maybe it is so old it lost its stretching ability?

I had a similar experience buying at the St Louis swap. Mine were also marked 27 and there was no way I was ever able to stretch them to a tubular rim. Aren't most tubular nominally labeled 28? I was fortunate in that I had bought from a local shop's booth and was able to work out a deal on some tubulars that fit.

DiabloScott 01-15-18 12:32 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20110892)
It's not even close to going on.

I think the next smaller size would be for 26" wheels - do you think it's that small?

Steve Whitlatch 01-15-18 01:01 PM


Originally Posted by DiabloScott (Post 20111121)
I think the next smaller size would be for 26" wheels - do you think it's that small?

Yes I do think they are that small. Lol

Steve Whitlatch 01-15-18 01:05 PM


Originally Posted by CV-6 (Post 20111084)
I had a similar experience buying at the St Louis swap. Mine were also marked 27 and there was no way I was ever able to stretch them to a tubular rim. Aren't most tubular nominally labeled 28? I was fortunate in that I had bought from a local shop's booth and was able to work out a deal on some tubulars that fit.

Yes that is what I think as well. I only paid $10 so I am not out that much. I can put them on eBay for someone that may know what they are and need them. NOS.

ldmataya 01-15-18 04:32 PM


Originally Posted by Steve Whitlatch (Post 20111201)
Yes I do think they are that small. Lol

Yeah if you can find a 650 rim that will confirm it. If so, sell it to someone restoring an old TT funny bike.

Road Fan 01-15-18 08:17 PM


Originally Posted by Salamandrine (Post 18330347)
"Latex glue"? I haven't seen that stuff in years. It used to be sold in bike shops next to the Velox tubular tire repair kit tins. It came in a little plastic jar and claimed to be liquid latex, but it was stickier than the liquid latex sold in art stores for mold making etc. It was a milky white color, water based, with a whiff of ammonia.

You could also use it to replenish the worn off latex of your sidewalls...

Anyhow, you brushed some on the base tape, and some over the sewn up repair, let it flash dry, and pressed them together. So yeah, it was actually contact cement. Offhand I'd say it was more or less identical to the water based contact cement you can buy today.

I'd suppose any good strong contact cement could do the job. Testing first would be a good idea.

Read somewhere in a galaxy far away that contact cement is neoprene, not rubber, and it will be too strong.

daviddavieboy 03-12-18 02:52 PM

This thread is timeless! Thanks to the contributors for making my first attempts at tubulars a success! The only issue I had was the tires were 'bumpy' when I spun them (cheap vittoria rallys using mastik one glue) but working quickly, removing and remounting fixed the issue. Very little mess on the brake track and solid on the rim after setting up overnight. The only problem I can see is that the wheels do not seem balanced. They always settle at the same 'heavy' spot when spun.

jimmuller 03-12-18 03:07 PM


Originally Posted by daviddavieboy (Post 20218894)
The only problem I can see is that the wheels do not seem balanced. They always settle at the same 'heavy' spot when spun.

There are lots of possible reasons for that. The tire mght be mounted funny or it is uneveny made or the wheel has a bit of radial wobble, not counting the valve core. If you don't feel it riding then don't worry about it.

Ex Pres 03-12-18 03:41 PM


Originally Posted by daviddavieboy (Post 20218894)
This thread is timeless! Thanks to the contributors for making my first attempts at tubulars a success! The only issue I had was the tires were 'bumpy' when I spun them (cheap vittoria rallys using mastik one glue) but working quickly, removing and remounting fixed the issue. Very little mess on the brake track and solid on the rim after setting up overnight. The only problem I can see is that the wheels do not seem balanced. They always settle at the same 'heavy' spot when spun.

Not a big deal. Your clincher wheels will do the same.

I actually did buy some [golf] lead tape and balance a set of wheels once. Couldn't tell the difference when riding. You could do the same if you feel the need. The tape is cheap and works well.

daviddavieboy 03-12-18 05:55 PM


Originally Posted by jimmuller (Post 20218922)
There are lots of possible reasons for that. The tire might be mounted funny or it is unevenly made or the wheel has a bit of radial wobble, not counting the valve core. If you don't feel it riding then don't worry about it.


Originally Posted by Ex Pres (Post 20218990)
Not a big deal. Your clincher wheels will do the same.

I actually did buy some [golf] lead tape and balance a set of wheels once. Couldn't tell the difference when riding. You could do the same if you feel the need. The tape is cheap and works well.

I never thought to check the wheels for balance before mounting the tires. I had to spend HOURS cleaning the old glue off and I am sure there is a lot of glue inside the cavity of the wheel. I bought them at a fantastic price used for someone who bought them and never used them. He obviously had no idea how to mount tires as they were a complete mess and the tires were not secure. I peeled both off easily, one had a mess of glue on the tire and the other , the tire was clean with dried gobs on the rim. Note the lack of glue at the stem. On the balance issue, I put a wheel magnet opposite the heavy spot and that helped a bit.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4779/...1e85c055_c.jpg

Lazyass 03-25-18 05:03 AM

Conti has the best tubular prep/mounting video I've ever seen. I do mine the same way, except I stretch my tires for one day, not days.

https://www.continental-tires.com/bi...-tubular-tyres

Peugeotlover 03-25-18 07:02 AM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by daviddavieboy (Post 20219279)
I had to spend HOURS cleaning the old glue off

When you start thinking about it, there is a very quick way to get the old glue off.
If the have a vice to hold the wheel, it is even quicker (place wheel between cushioning agents- like rags or styrofoam or wood strips, etc).
Wear heavy gloves so you don't rip apart your hands.
You can get the wheel looking like new in 10 minutes.

Ex Pres 03-25-18 08:34 AM


Originally Posted by Peugeotlover (Post 20244041)
When you start thinking about it, there is a very quick way to get the old glue off.
If the have a vice to hold the wheel, it is even quicker (place wheel between cushioning agents- like rags or styrofoam or wood strips, etc).
Wear heavy gloves so you don't rip apart your hands.
You can get the wheel looking like new in 10 minutes.

I use my truing stand, and use it when [re-]gluing the rim

ThermionicScott 03-25-18 10:40 AM


Originally Posted by Lazyass (Post 20243981)
Conti has the best tubular prep/mounting video I've ever seen. I do mine the same way, except I stretch my tires for one day, not days.

https://www.continental-tires.com/bi...-tubular-tyres

Anyone else picture a flight attendant miming along to the safety instructions when they watch this? ;)

DiabloScott 03-25-18 11:25 AM


Originally Posted by Peugeotlover (Post 20244041)
When you start thinking about it, there is a very quick way to get the old glue off.
If the have a vice to hold the wheel, it is even quicker (place wheel between cushioning agents- like rags or styrofoam or wood strips, etc).
Wear heavy gloves so you don't rip apart your hands.
You can get the wheel looking like new in 10 minutes.

It's a little hard on the wheels, but it does do a good job on those hard cases:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-c60rEVNthQ...0/P5160009.JPG

DiabloScott 03-25-18 11:40 AM


Originally Posted by ThermionicScott (Post 20244348)
Anyone else picture a flight attendance miming along to the safety instructions when they watch this? ;)

That guy looked more like a diesel mechanic than a wheel jockey. He was clearly German though!

Also disagree with the "get every bit of old glue off first" part. The harder it is to get off, the better it is to leave it on there... unless there's big uneven thick globs of it, or you got the rim used from somebody else who can't be trusted with proper gluing.

Otherwise it was fun.

Salamandrine 03-25-18 02:08 PM

Funny video.

Here's my take, as someone that only rode tubulars for decades. I was never that into Continental or other contact cement type glue. I've only ever used it a shop employee because it was specifically requested by a customer. Otherwise I prefer mastic (ie Vittoria and formerly red Clement), and that's all I've ever used myself. Tried Tubasti once. Don't like it.

With conti and similar glue, you really should clean up the old glue when re-gluing. I guess I'm lazy but I don't have time for that nonsense. With mastic in practice the rims never need cleaning. Usually some glue comes off when an old tire flats or wears out, which sort of balances out the new glue going on. A thin new layer is enough to activate the old glue. If a rim has a lucky life and lives long enough to allow some excessive glue build up, it's pretty easy to take it down a notch with the wire brush drill method shown above. It is not necessary to remove all of it, though that may be appropriate for race wheels. It is this fiction that a rim must be completely cleaned before regluing that turns most people off sew ups, IME. Again for contact cement, that's good advice, for old style traditional red/brown glue, waste of time.

Also, since this is the C&V forum, if rescuing vintage rims with decades old dried up glue on them, I'd say completely cleaning those before re-using is a good idea.

big chainring 03-25-18 07:12 PM

I dont clean chains and I dont clean rims. I have used 3M Fastak from my first bike with sew ups in 1974. All this glueing and rim cleaning is completely foreign to my experience. Just glued up some tires last week. Took maybe 5 minutes per tire including inflating and straightening. And they were rideable in an hour.

crank_addict 03-25-18 08:30 PM

Almost any old glue lifts right of with a very course scuff pad / as used with pot and pan clean-up. Doesn't take long.

Anyways, talk of real vintage here I finally glued these near NOS Pirelli's on N.O.S. (that's correct) Super Champion Mixte rims. First pic is before I laced the wheels and just wanted to see the look.

[IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4486/...8b585155_c.jpgDSC_2313 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4792/...f0ef9660_c.jpgDSC_2516 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4779/...88633715_c.jpgDSC_2519 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

To fill the center recess of these unusual rims, I used two each rubber rim bands plus tape layer. Rubber cement bonded. Then the tubular glue and mount using Continental glue. Sidewalls are preserved with a coating of seam sealer.

[IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4786/...92caa896_c.jpgDSC_2524 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

daviddavieboy 03-26-18 05:45 AM


Originally Posted by Peugeotlover (Post 20244041)
When you start thinking about it, there is a very quick way to get the old glue off.
If the have a vice to hold the wheel, it is even quicker (place wheel between cushioning agents- like rags or styrofoam or wood strips, etc). . .You can get the wheel looking like new in 10 minutes.


Originally Posted by DiabloScott (Post 20244421)
It's a little hard on the wheels, but it does do a good job on those hard cases.

These are the wheels I was gluing. I was more than a little paranoid about damaging them.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/789/2...8fa458ae_c.jpg


Originally Posted by Salamandrine (Post 20244654)
. . .I prefer mastic (ie Vittoria and formerly red Clement), and that's all I've ever used myself. Tried Tubasti once. Don't like it. . . With mastic in practice the rims never need cleaning. Usually some glue comes off when an old tire flats or wears out, which sort of balances out the new glue going on. A thin new layer is enough to activate the old glue.

I reglued with vittoria mastik one with even coats on wheels and tire. It is good to know that a thin coat is used henceforth when replacing tires. The reasons I chose to remove the glue were that the type of glue the previous owner used was unknown to me and because there were literally blobs everywhere and I was able to pull the tires off without much effort.

Peugeotlover 03-26-18 06:47 AM

1 Attachment(s)
For a non-abrasive method to clean fine quality rims,
this ParkTool Chainbrite with a sponge does a good job.
Non-toxic & smells okay.

qcpmsame 03-26-18 07:48 AM


Originally Posted by ThermionicScott (Post 20244348)
Anyone else picture a flight attendance miming along to the safety instructions when they watch this? ;)

:thumb:Darned if I didn't think about that when I first watched their tub mounting vids, in March 2016.:roflmao2: I can see the small section of a tubular rim and fake tire section the attendant would be holding, now.:rolleyes:

Funny thing that caught my attention is the discrepancy between the Conti vids and the instruction sheets included with the tubs. One tells you to stretch the tires by standing on the and pulling them upwards, the other tells you to avoid doing this as it will weaken the cords. Good proofreading there.

Bill

squirtdad 03-26-18 10:27 AM

ok looking for ideas.

As my first experience with tubular, I have been very happy with my Tufo tires and using the Tufo tape.....but popped a spoke and need to remove the tire.

That thing does not want to come off, I have thinking about taking my shop hair dryer to it to warm things up

Any other experience with removing tires from tufo rim tape.

I am happy this did not happen on the road.....

thanks

Salamandrine 03-26-18 02:50 PM


Originally Posted by daviddavieboy (Post 20245541)
I reglued with vittoria mastik one with even coats on wheels and tire. It is good to know that a thin coat is used henceforth when replacing tires. The reasons I chose to remove the glue were that the type of glue the previous owner used was unknown to me and because there were literally blobs everywhere and I was able to pull the tires off without much effort.

Yeah, but be careful not to spread the glue too thin. Thin is relative... Just use less than you would use for a new set of rims. The solvents in the new glue will partially reactivate the old glue. Ideally you want the tiniest hint of squeezout droplets appearing at the base tape all the way around the rim evenly.

Removing mystery glue from an old wheel purchased/acquired used is prudent. Who knows what was on it before.

SJX426 03-26-18 03:10 PM

If I use a wire wheel, it is a brass one, not Stainless or otherwise.

Lazyass 03-26-18 03:44 PM


Originally Posted by squirtdad (Post 20246063)
ok looking for ideas.

As my first experience with tubular, I have been very happy with my Tufo tires and using the Tufo tape.....but popped a spoke and need to remove the tire.

That thing does not want to come off, I have thinking about taking my shop hair dryer to it to warm things up

Any other experience with removing tires from tufo rim tape.

I am happy this did not happen on the road.....

thanks

I don't know but that's why I've always avoided tape. You should buy a cheap heat gun, you can get a decent one for $25 or so. They're handy for all kinds of bike related things.

crank_addict 03-26-18 08:17 PM

You know when Taiwan Vittoria has gone down the tubes when they still label as 28" and the sidewall molding state 'clincher'. LOL

These pair are brand new, out of the wrapper. A portion of the top tread layer is separating and I need to syringe glue to repair. Still usable rubber but jeez....

[IMG]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/881/3...6c09193d_b.jpgDSC_2511 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/820/4...d39d56d1_b.jpgDSC_2510 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

jimmuller 03-26-18 08:51 PM

I think they and others use the same mold for clinchers and sewups. That's why they give both tire pressures on the same tire.

crank_addict 03-26-18 08:56 PM

^Or the attempt to be PC in this day and age. I'm so confused. He or she bike rubber, meh......

Lazyass 03-27-18 08:30 AM


Originally Posted by crank_addict (Post 20247124)
You know when Taiwan Vittoria has gone down the tubes when they still label as 28" and the sidewall molding state 'clincher'. LOL

These pair are brand new, out of the wrapper. A portion of the top tread layer is separating and I need to syringe glue to repair. Still usable rubber but jeez....

[IMG]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/881/3...6c09193d_b.jpgDSC_2511 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/820/4...d39d56d1_b.jpgDSC_2510 by carrera247, on Flickr[/IMG]

Dang, man. I was about to order some Corsa Elite's. I think I'll just go with the Yellow Jersey 3 for fifty bucks. I rack up too many miles to spend a lot of money for poor quality.


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