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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

SirMike1983 07-31-16 07:24 PM

I owned a rod-drum bike made for the Danish market by Raleigh. It was a'64. I sold it a couple of years ago. The system is interesting, but quite heavy between the rods, bell cranks, and drums.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-XVlWdiv7gT...0/IMG_2951.JPG

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-7c_C0sqNV4...0/IMG_2953.JPG

clubman 07-31-16 07:31 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 18950786)
This Hercules is for sale locally.
It appears to have an A Type 0 or 3 hub.
Any idea on a date?
Thanks

The trigger may help date it. If it has a stamped 'H' badge on the rear mudguard it's likely pre-war. Angles suggest at least early 50's to me.

gster 07-31-16 07:56 PM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by clubman (Post 18951242)
The trigger may help date it. If it has a stamped 'H' badge on the rear mudguard it's likely pre-war. Angles suggest at least early 50's to me.

Thanks for the input. I haven't seen the bike in person but may go out tomorrow.
It appears to have a Hercules hub with a SA 3/4 speed trigger. decals look good as well (from the photo).

BigChief 07-31-16 08:13 PM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 18951300)
Thanks for the input. I haven't seen the bike in person but may go out tomorrow.
It appears to have a Hercules hub with a SA 3/4 speed trigger. decals look good as well (from the photo).

So, it is an original finish. Couldn't tell from the other pic. Beautiful!! I couldn't pass that one up. Really nice.

clubman 07-31-16 08:22 PM

@gster The 3 50's catalogs I have only have green and black finishes but the 1949 catalog shows a red enamel but without a full chaincase. Maybe a restoration or a different model? It looks impeccable!

gster 07-31-16 08:23 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 18951359)
@gster The 3 50's catalogs I have only have green and black finishes but the 1949 catalog shows a red enamel but without a full chaincase. Maybe a restoration or a different model? It looks impeccable!

Well, I'd better go and look at it!

PalmettoUpstate 07-31-16 10:46 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 18919671)
There's plenty of great old 3 speeds in Germany. I'd like a Sachs Torpedo. Or maybe a Gazelle roadster

Not to be a Nimrod, but what's up with a Sachs Torpedo?

I like [love] Sierra Nevada Torpedo...

PalmettoUpstate 07-31-16 11:28 PM


Originally Posted by Stadjer (Post 18937641)
I often ride my bicycle on snow, ice, and sometimes even black ice. And I don't know about motorcycles, but on bicycle with the front wheel locking on a slippery surface, there's no way you can save that. That's where my thinking comes from. So if the leaves start to fall, I screw the front rodbrake a bit looser, the nut is designed to do that by hand so probably the manufacturer had thought about this issue with linked brakes. Also with seperate handbrakes, I disconnect the front when it's slippery, because I applie them both or the one whichever hand is free, and that's not a safe habit in slippery conditions.

It's still about the brake design of an English 3-speed, so I don't think it's that far off topic. :)

Much of what I see here has no basis in experience. You speak truth. I have many miles under my belt on two wheels - 5 times across the contiguous USA before I was 21 - and what you aver about front brakes in ice/snow/wet is spot on.

PalmettoUpstate 07-31-16 11:31 PM

Just to clarify... those trips on motorcycles... twice on a Kawasaki 500 and thrice on a HD Sportster.

The song remains the same; watch those panic/quick stops in inclement weather.

BigChief 08-01-16 03:27 AM


Originally Posted by PalmettoUpstate (Post 18951607)
Not to be a Nimrod, but what's up with a Sachs Torpedo?

I like [love] Sierra Nevada Torpedo...

I can service an AW hub in my sleep. Brampton and Hercules are really just AWs. I'd like to learn something different.

BigChief 08-01-16 03:43 AM


Originally Posted by PalmettoUpstate (Post 18951644)
Just to clarify... those trips on motorcycles... twice on a Kawasaki 500 and thrice on a HD Sportster.

The song remains the same; watch those panic/quick stops in inclement weather.

And even normal stops at traffic lights after a light rain. Especially in the center of the lane.

Stadjer 08-01-16 04:53 AM


Originally Posted by SirMike1983 (Post 18951228)
I owned a rod-drum bike made for the Danish market by Raleigh. It was a'64. I sold it a couple of years ago. The system is interesting, but quite heavy between the rods, bell cranks, and drums.

That's a handsome bike, like the saddle. The drum brakes don't suprise me, as Danes are whole year all wheater cyclists.

It's not a light weight bike, anyway. Rods and drums might add about 1/2 kilo to the weight I guess, but that's only about 2% to the bike, and probably 0.5% to the total weight. Maybe it's more but it doesn't really matter. Either you have a light weight bike to do a lot of climbing, or store it upstairs, or you ride it mainly on flat roads and then the weight is part of the nice ride. A light bike will never have such a ride, it's just different. If you want to save weight you'll have to take all the good stuff off and the saddle has too much metal on it too.

hisownself 08-01-16 05:06 AM

Bought this Armstrong awhile back and recently rebuilt all the mechanicals. SA AW hub marked 1955. Altenburger Brillant brakes. Rixe saddle "made in Japan". And a bottle generator lighting system. Next up are cosmetic improvements. It's clear the bike was originally light blue, then painted red, now black. But evidence is it was painted black probably in the 1960's.

http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/...s/image_1.jpeg

rhm 08-01-16 06:14 AM

I just picked up this 1969 Sports for my wife. She's pretty sure she will like it, but I have put off a complete overhaul until we make sure of that. Somewhat battered condition, but evidently low miles; no brake wear on the rims, and it still has its original Dunlop tires and tubes.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-6...2B20.17.48.jpg

gster 08-01-16 07:01 AM

1975 Raleigh Sports
 
5 Attachment(s)
I picked up this neglected but low mileage Sports last week for a good price. I gave it a good clean/repack and tune up and it's on it's way to a new home with a young woman I work with. She got an old CCM 3 speed from me earlier in the year and I've offered her a straight trade. The Raleigh is a much better bike all around.

madras13 08-01-16 09:03 AM

Hercules hub dating
 

Originally Posted by gster (Post 18950786)
This Hercules is for sale locally.
It appears to have an A Type 0 or 3 hub.
Any idea on a date?
Thanks

I recently picked up a pre Raleigh Hercules and did a bit of research on the hub. Mine is a type B with the number 5.
Here is the article I found about it:

There's a recent thread on Bike Forums that sheds some light on hercumatic hub dating. Start with this post and follow the discussion:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/778645-Yet-Another-Hercules-Thread-)?p=13434506&viewfull=1#post13434506

The gist of it is that A Type started in 1943 with the date code 3, cycling through the digits until they went to the B Type in 1953, so...

A TYPE 3 = 1943
A TYPE 9 = 1949
A TYPE 0 = 1950
A TYPE 2 = 1952
B TYPE 3 = 1953

I'll let you fill in the blanks and extrapolate from there!

Whether this is correct, or not, I offer no opinion. It does, however, follow the same (questionable) logic as Sturmey Archer dating (where AW 9 = 1939 and AW 0 = 1940).

Rudi Mayr

gster 08-01-16 09:31 AM


Originally Posted by madras13 (Post 18952290)
I recently picked up a pre Raleigh Hercules and did a bit of research on the hub. Mine is a type B with the number 5.
Here is the article I found about it:

There's a recent thread on Bike Forums that sheds some light on hercumatic hub dating. Start with this post and follow the discussion:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/778645-Yet-Another-Hercules-Thread-)?p=13434506&viewfull=1#post13434506

The gist of it is that A Type started in 1943 with the date code 3, cycling through the digits until they went to the B Type in 1953, so...

A TYPE 3 = 1943
A TYPE 9 = 1949
A TYPE 0 = 1950
A TYPE 2 = 1952
B TYPE 3 = 1953

I'll let you fill in the blanks and extrapolate from there!

Whether this is correct, or not, I offer no opinion. It does, however, follow the same (questionable) logic as Sturmey Archer dating (where AW 9 = 1939 and AW 0 = 1940).

Rudi Mayr

Good research!
I soke to the seller and the hub is A Type 0 (1950)
Will go see it tomorrow.

bazil4696 08-01-16 11:24 AM

Gster: How much is the herc?

agmetal 08-01-16 11:24 AM

Has anyone here ridden a pre-Raleigh Phillips roadster? How does it compare, in terms of ride quality and handling, to a Raleigh of the same era?

noglider 08-01-16 12:16 PM


Originally Posted by agmetal (Post 18952719)
Has anyone here ridden a pre-Raleigh Phillips roadster? How does it compare, in terms of ride quality and handling, to a Raleigh of the same era?

When you say "roadster," are you referring to the bikes with the rod brakes? @Velocivixen had a pre-Raleigh Philips, but it had caliper brakes and 26" wheels. She put a lot of work into it and then moved it on, if I remember correctly.

agmetal 08-01-16 12:52 PM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 18952858)
When you say "roadster," are you referring to the bikes with the rod brakes? @Velocivixen had a pre-Raleigh Philips, but it had caliper brakes and 26" wheels. She put a lot of work into it and then moved it on, if I remember correctly.

The bike in question has rod brakes and what I think are 28" wheels (although I'm not sure...haven't seen it in person)

gster 08-02-16 04:46 AM


Originally Posted by bazil4696 (Post 18952717)
Gster: How much is the herc?

More than I'd like to pay but will post price after I've bought it.....

Delboy Avenger 08-02-16 08:50 AM

4 Attachment(s)
Another three/four speed has showed up.My brother had it in his shed for the last
15 years.
The Dynohub says its 1960, rear hub date gone as the chrome has peeled just in the wrong place !
However, the lugs on the frame look older to me and the frame number is stamped
on the bottom bracket and reads 911252 although the 1's look like I's.

From Sheldon Brown this frame number is from 1925.

Rear hub says three speed, but the shifter and chain selector is 4 speed.

Rear pannier looks older than 1960 too.

Also comes with wing nuts on wheels, brookes b66,
Looks like green original with black overpaint.

What does the panel think ?

Salubrious 08-02-16 09:26 AM

^^ with a lug like that for the cable pulley, its certainly older than 1960.

rhm 08-02-16 09:38 AM


Originally Posted by Delboy Avenger (Post 18954826)
Another three/four speed has showed up.My brother had it in his shed for the last
15 years.
The Dynohub says its 1960, rear hub date gone as the chrome has peeled just in the wrong place !
However, the lugs on the frame look older to me and the frame number is stamped
on the bottom bracket and reads 911252 although the 1's look like I's.

From Sheldon Brown this frame number is from 1925.

Rear hub says three speed, but the shifter and chain selector is 4 speed.

Rear pannier looks older than 1960 too.

Also comes with wing nuts on wheels, brookes b66,
Looks like green original with black overpaint.

What does the panel think ?

That's a Raleigh Lenton Sports from 1950-1953. The lugs are distinctive, as is the pulley mount in front of the seat lug. Plain gauge 531 frame, green with black undercoat. The black undercoat is pretty tough, the green is not; so by now they are mostly black.

Read about them here.


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