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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

Sixty Fiver 10-19-10 01:08 PM


Originally Posted by rhm (Post 11645961)
Hey guys, is there really such a thing as an AWG hub, and if not, could we please not talk about them? Presumably you mean an AG, which is the generator version of an AW. I've never heard of an AWG.

You are correct...

It is technically an AG but I always find myself tossing in the "W"... they also made the FG which is the 4 speed version of this hub which is also a "W" in that it also a wide range hub.

The AG was produced from 1946 until 1983 although I have never seen one any newer than the one I have as they seem to have been superceded in popularity by the front Dynohubs.

http://www.sturmey-archerheritage.co...s/pic-66-s.jpg

JJPistols 10-19-10 02:52 PM


Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver (Post 11608159)
Figured I liked my old 3 spd winter bike so much I needed another one so built up a Mavic wheel around a '64 SA-AWG (36 4 cross) and now get to find out why it won't shift into 1st.

Still need to install my rear brake too...

So... not exactly English... and not quite a 3 speed (yet).

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...shasta3spd.JPG


Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver (Post 11619901)
Sorted out the problem with the AWG and it's not finding or slipping out of first right into 2nd... the drive side adjustments were out and with a loose cone it allows everything inside to shift just enough that the planetary gears will not align in first.

Now I need a full chaincase... :)

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikepics/uav3spd2.JPG

I took the hub apart just to take a peek inside and the internals were squeaky clean and it does not look like my 45 year old hub has any mileage on it at all the the dynohub is cranking out the power quite nicely... the AWG seems to have less drag than a front dynohub too.


Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver (Post 11636860)
Here's a little before and after and I was pretty thankful I did not have a derailleur on my bike today... the clay mud along the river is like velcro but had no effect on the AWG and cleaning this up will be easy...

Before... shiny and clean.

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikepics/uavatv7.JPG

After...

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikepics/uavatv2.JPG

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...vatvmudbog.JPG

:D




that is a fantastic machine and it looks like you are gonna ride hell out of it - good for you

wahoonc 10-19-10 05:30 PM


Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver (Post 11646179)
You are correct...

It is technically an AG but I always find myself tossing in the "W"... they also made the FG which is the 4 speed version of this hub which is also a "W" in that it also a wide range hub.

The AG was produced from 1946 until 1983 although I have never seen one any newer than the one I have as they seem to have been superceded in popularity by the front Dynohubs.

I have a couple from the 1970's IIRC one is a 1971 and the other a 1973. I also have an FG that is going to be converted to 5 speed, for my club racer.

Aaron :)

AL NZ 10-19-10 09:43 PM

has anyone fitted modern chromoplastic guards to an old English 3-speeder?
I am wondering if the 700c size will stretch to fit a 28" tyre, and if so, which width guard is best?
Or, alternatively , a set of hammered Honjos!

Any thoughts?

Sixty Fiver 10-19-10 09:49 PM


Originally Posted by JJPistols (Post 11646803)
that is a fantastic machine and it looks like you are gonna ride hell out of it - good for you

Hell is just around the corner... we call it winter.

noglider 10-19-10 09:56 PM


Originally Posted by AL NZ (Post 11649107)
has anyone fitted modern chromoplastic guards to an old English 3-speeder?
I am wondering if the 700c size will stretch to fit a 28" tyre, and if so, which width guard is best?
Or, alternatively , a set of hammered Honjos!

Any thoughts?

I haven't done it, and I haven't heard of it done, but it might work. The size differences are really a lot less than an inch:

700c: 622mm BSD
27": 630mm BSD
28": 635mm BSD

And for reference, one inch = 25.4 mm.

sailorbenjamin 10-19-10 10:18 PM


Originally Posted by fiataccompli (Post 11629504)
This isn't English, but it is a 3 speed. It's a '65 Schwinn Racer (unfortunately the SA hub/wheel was replaced w/ a Shimano setup...but it works perfectly). I've been enjoying this one thoroughly as an office errand or quick lunch break excursionist...very much in the correct spirit of the English 3 speed, eh? I have to say it's a plush ride...perhaps equal or even more plush than my '65 Robin Hood...hmmm.....

I had a Breeze for a little while that I thought compared really favorably with the lady's Sports that I've had. It made me want to find a 23" Racer to try. Haven't found one yet in my size on payday. I got a Sports Tourer but it's not the same animal. I like my Super Course a lot better. I picked up a 23" Continental to try. It needs some grease before I do that, though.
Tonight I replace the normal Northroads bars on my Super Course with the really wide kind off a Schwinn. I like the width and the height a lot. I wish they'd used a gentler curve where they bend from the handgrip part to the center part. I grab that when I'm pulling up a hill and the old NR was more comfy there. Maybe some cork tape will even things out some.

mkeller234 10-22-10 12:39 AM

I made this for another thread. I feel like I should make or do something with it.... any ideas?

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1079/...1f3cf75f_b.jpg

noglider 10-22-10 06:23 AM


Originally Posted by mkeller234 (Post 11661555)
I made this for another thread. I feel like I should make or do something with it.... any ideas?

Wow, Matt, you're good. How did you do that? I think I just might make a poster of that.

Tom

mkeller234 10-22-10 06:54 AM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 11661895)
Wow, Matt, you're good. How did you do that? I think I just might make a poster of that.

Tom

Ha, thank you. I got a little sloppy around the rear wheel because I was in a hurry. I cut a mask in Adobe photoshop and filled it with black on a separate layer.

I did this one of my Gran Sport too in a different style. This one is messy but I think it's a little more interesting since it shows textures.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1259/...d1c61c4e_b.jpg

snarkypup 10-22-10 03:28 PM


Originally Posted by mkeller234 (Post 11661555)
I made this for another thread. I feel like I should make or do something with it.... any ideas?

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1079/...1f3cf75f_b.jpg

T-shirts, clearly. That we can buy.

jedge76 10-22-10 04:02 PM


Originally Posted by mkeller234 (Post 11661957)
Ha, thank you. I got a little sloppy around the rear wheel because I was in a hurry. I cut a mask in Adobe photoshop and filled it with black on a separate layer.

I did this one of my Gran Sport too in a different style. This one is messy but I think it's a little more interesting since it shows textures.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1259/...d1c61c4e_b.jpg

Agreed, t-shirts. I like the added texture. Adds to the vintage nature of the bicycle. Nice work! I never have taken a graphic design approach in CS3--I have a lot of respect for the job you did.

mkeller234 10-22-10 05:47 PM

I never noticed how crooked the pictures were before I made them black and white. I have the ability to print on canvas, that might be cool. The sloppier image would be good for screen printing, I have a simple single frame somewhere. I might dig it out and attempt to make a t-shirt, I haven't done that since high school.

jedge76 10-23-10 07:32 PM

I may have done something stupid. I added several drops of oil to my SA today. The oil is formulated for 4-cycle lawn mowers and seems somewhere in between 10W-30 and 4-in-1 oils. When I went to ride it, the "click--click--click" of the SA hub was no longer there. The shifting also skipped or wouldn't engage when I was at slower speeds. Did I add too much or is the oil too heavy? Not sure what to do.

kingsting 10-23-10 08:30 PM


Originally Posted by jedge76 (Post 11668924)
I may have done something stupid. I added several drops of oil to my SA today. The oil is formulated for 4-cycle lawn mowers and seems somewhere in between 10W-30 and 4-in-1 oils. When I went to ride it, the "click--click--click" of the SA hub was no longer there. The shifting also skipped or wouldn't engage when I was at slower speeds. Did I add too much or is the oil too heavy? Not sure what to do.

Hmmmm. You may have flushed some old goop out that is causing the pawls or something to hang up.

I don't think motor oil that thin would hurt anything. (unless it's real cold out) I used to put 50W Valvoline racing oil in these hubs which worked fine in the summer months... :rolleyes:

A you could try a little WD-40 or Tri-flow to thin out the oil.

jedge76 10-23-10 08:35 PM


Originally Posted by kingsting (Post 11669190)
Hmmmm. You may have flushed some old goop out that is causing the pawls or something to hang up.

I don't think motor oil that thin would hurt anything. (unless it's real cold out) I used to put 50W Valvoline racing oil in these hubs which worked fine in the summer months... :rolleyes:

A you could try a little WD-40 or Tri-flow to thin out the oil.

That sounds plausible. Thanks for the advice. I have a feeling I may have added too much. Is that a possibility and, if so, would WD-40 be a good way to flush some of it out? I really appreciate your advice and all the others who I know will chime in. Man, it was running so smoothly, seemingly, until I added that oil.

Sixty Fiver 10-23-10 08:40 PM

Here is a little known fact about English three speeds... the tick tick tick of the AW attracts chickadees in droves and when this happens you better have some sunflower seeds to give them or it could get ugly.

:)

jedge76 10-23-10 08:41 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Here's the oil I used:

Andrew F 10-23-10 09:02 PM

30 w oil is fine. Chances are there is too much oil in the hub, good news is that if finds it's way out by itself. IMO I'd ride it for a while, the clicking and smooth shifting will return. My experience has been: If shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd hangs up, it is more likely the cable, or the indicator chain, make sure they move freely. You can watch to see if the chain moves smoothly into the hub. If the hang up is from 3rd to 2nd or 2nd to 1st than it might be something within the hub.

jedge76 10-23-10 09:27 PM


Originally Posted by Andrew F (Post 11669317)
30 w oil is fine. Chances are there is too much oil in the hub, good news is that if finds it's way out by itself. IMO I'd ride it for a while, the clicking and smooth shifting will return. My experience has been: If shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd hangs up, it is more likely the cable, or the indicator chain, make sure they move freely. You can watch to see if the chain moves smoothly into the hub. If the hang up is from 3rd to 2nd or 2nd to 1st than it might be something within the hub.

What happens is that I go to shift from say 2nd to 1st, it just won't go. I push on the shifter and it won't go even w/ a little extra push than normal. Like you said, it seems like there's too much oil. Still very rideable so I'll just have another reason to ride the hell out of it! Should I try some WD-40 through the oil port in the hub just to see if it's some dirt, etc. that was loosened up?

Andrew F 10-23-10 09:45 PM


What happens is that I go to shift from say 2nd to 1st, it just won't go. I push on the shifter and it won't go even w/ a little extra push than normal.
Sounds like the bar shifter is hanging up, I'd give that a squirt of light machine oil (wd40 if you really have to) but IMO it's best to keep the WD40 out of the hub.

AL NZ 10-23-10 11:42 PM

4 Attachment(s)
A 4-day holiday weekend here in NZ, spring is sprung, so I did a little spring maintenance on my 4 speed Raleigh, plus swapped a brown B66 for a black Flyer Special on my old BSA, and it looks much better. Goes better, too, with the narrow saddle.

Here are the pics. They could have gone in the 'What are you wrenching?' or 'White tyres' threads, but this is the thread that never dies ..

The Raleigh had decaying but nice Michelins on it, so I bought some Cheng Shins. I quite like the grey, but the quality is not special. They don't quite fit right, so both front and rear have a bit of a flat spot because I don't think the inner diameter is quite right for the stainless Dunlop rims. I deflated and fettled and re-inflated but I cannot eliminate the problem. I would have gone for Delta Cruisers but the NZ agent is apparently hopeless, and about to be replaced by an equally-hopeless new agent, so laments my bike shop guy. the deltas are unavailable.
The sharp-eyed amongst you will also have spotted salmon Koolstops on front and grey on rear. I rang the NZ agent, and he had these as samples and gave them to me! Now that is generous, thank you Mr Philips in Christchurch.
And they are so much better than the generic rubbish I bought in the UK 6 months ago.
My little tyre swap turned into a 2 hour effort in the beating sun, as I took the opportunity to put on a new chain, no small task with a full chain case as many of you will know. It is almost a 2-man job. Anyway, back in the UK I had swapped the rear 18 tooth sprocket for a 21 to improve low ratios for slow rides with the kids, but this pulled the rear wheel too far forward in the dropouts to the point where the chaincase didn't fit properly, so I put in a new chain, 106 links instead of 102, and now the wheel sits more centrally in the rear mudguard, and the chaincase is back to its happy self.
But the 4 speed hub had me flummoxed.
With the bike upside down I foolishly tried to fit the 2 piece indicator on the wrong way. This despite me being a surgeon and being used to thinking which side is which etc, on a daily basis. But in terms of an operation, I had done the hard part, which was the chain swap, so I had got complacent, so cocked this bit up. The 2-part indicator chain wouldn't screw together in the middle of the hub, and when I realised I had it the wrong way around, I sorted it. Then, when back together, it wouldn't engage 4th gear, only 1-2-3. It freewheeled in 4th. So I oiled the hub again and rode around, to no avail. Then I removed the indicator, put it back and now it's all fine! So buggered if I know what gremlin was messing with me.
While I had the wheels off I took the chance to rub 30W Briggs and Stratton mower oil into the slightly rusting inside surface of the mudguards, so hopefully they'll last another 55 years (more than I will).
These bikes are becoming workaday heirlooms. Look out kids, the oldies are going to foist them upon you..

The BSA is going nicely. I oiled the brake and it actually works a little bit now.
I went to a short blast last night, and basing the distance on the fairly accurate mileometer, I averaged 15mph. Not bad for an old bike and an unfit rider.

I am wondering what to do with the BSA. My original plan was to keep developing it as a Pathracer replica. But I have many good bits I collected in the UK, and I am planning another bike.
I think I will turn the BSA back into what it is, a tourer, with the oddity of the 3 speed Sachs Dreigang hub brake that came with it, complete with top-tube gear lever. I will have the silver-sprayed stem properly plated.
I am planning getting a custom lugged frame made in pathracer style with high bottom bracket and no drillings for mudguards, etc. It will probably be dark blue, and have nickel-plated forks, +/- lugs if the frame maker can do that. It will have 28" rims and cream Deltas, and Sturmey hub brakes.I have a Major Taylor stem on an old bicycle which needs nickel-plating.

It should be fun. Any other ideas gratefully considered...

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=175082http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=175083http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=175084http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=175085

PS - in a momentous piece of cycling trivia, I can now tell you that a Sturmey FG dynohub, Dunlop stainless rim and 40 beautiful stainless spokes with brass bits weighs 3.4 kg, and with tyre and tube, 4 kg.
How much do those carbon thingies weigh?

jedge76 10-26-10 05:44 PM


Originally Posted by Andrew F (Post 11669317)
30 w oil is fine. Chances are there is too much oil in the hub, good news is that if finds it's way out by itself. IMO I'd ride it for a while, the clicking and smooth shifting will return. My experience has been: If shifting from 1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd hangs up, it is more likely the cable, or the indicator chain, make sure they move freely. You can watch to see if the chain moves smoothly into the hub. If the hang up is from 3rd to 2nd or 2nd to 1st than it might be something within the hub.

It's shifting fine now...I think you were right about too much oil. Another poster mentioned the dirt and grime that adding the oil may have caused, too. It seems like a decent amount of riding and it will be clean and clicking. Thanks for your responses!

snarkypup 10-26-10 11:09 PM


Originally Posted by mkeller234 (Post 11664848)
I never noticed how crooked the pictures were before I made them black and white. I have the ability to print on canvas, that might be cool. The sloppier image would be good for screen printing, I have a simple single frame somewhere. I might dig it out and attempt to make a t-shirt, I haven't done that since high school.

I remember doing the same thing in high school art class! I wonder what the hell I printed? I don't remember. It wasn't as cool as this. Sign me up, if you do make them, to buy one.

snarkypup 10-26-10 11:14 PM

Al NZ, those are truly beautiful bikes!

AL NZ 10-27-10 01:26 AM

thank you snarkypup, for the compliment.

I think Veloria has the nicest collection of old bikes I have seen here, although others will have beauties I have not seen...

Andrew F 10-27-10 06:49 AM

1 Attachment(s)
AL NZ - I love the BSA with the Cream tires. I'm truly inspired to go with cream on my Raliegh, Thanks for the post.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=175606

noglider 10-27-10 03:50 PM

I consider Veloria to be the foremost "bicycle ęsthetician."

See her blog. http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/

snarkypup 10-27-10 04:14 PM


Originally Posted by noglider (Post 11690505)
I consider Veloria to be the foremost "bicycle ęsthetician."

See her blog. http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/

I agree. I based a lot of what I did to my Sports on what she had done to hers. Must admit, turns out I don't love the Delta Cruisers as much as she does. I think my bike looked just as sweet with the more narrow Kenda gumwalls that were rotting off it when I bought it. Next time, I'll go back to a narrower tire on that bike, because it handles much more swiftly. That said, she got my mind rolling on all this fixin' up of vintage bikes, and I learned a ton about what options are out there from reading her blog. Guess I now finally know enough to make some minor decisions about things on my own! I think Veloria has a particular aesthetic, too, that isn't for everyone. I like it, though :).

ColonelJLloyd 10-27-10 07:52 PM

Even when jury duty is your destination, it's hard not be in a good mood getting there when you're on a Sports.

http://gallery.me.com/justinhughes/1...12880459430001


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