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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

thumpism 08-12-17 05:11 PM

Looks like my '74. Bike looks identical to mine except you have a pump peg. Steel rims. I'll have to get out the scale and let you know. Mine also has a Pletscher but no seat bag and a different saddle so weights might vary. Your rear fender has been cropped.

BigChief 08-12-17 06:40 PM

73 or 74. I'm leaning toward 73 because it has the older style chainwheel with the V brackets. I think I'm seeing two different rims. This bike came with Raleigh pattern rims. Looks like the rear is original and the front is an Endrick replacement.

Lazyass 08-12-17 07:00 PM

I figure it's a '73 because the '74 has no pump peg. And a matching ladies model is also for sale with it, coffee color, and that color was a '73 option but not in '74. I don't know, the seller is asking $200 for the gents. I like it, but if it weighs 50lbs or something then I'll pass.

clubman 08-12-17 07:33 PM


Originally Posted by Lazyass (Post 19788067)
I don't know, the seller is asking $200 for the gents. I like it, but if it weighs 50lbs or something then I'll pass.

Close to top dollar for a 70's model imo but I don't know your market. The B-72 saddle looks to be in great shape, I love that model. Watch those self adjusting brake levers. Yes, they auto-tighten the cable slack faster than required.

Probably ~35 lbs. They all weigh that much, part of the charm.

Velocivixen 08-12-17 08:00 PM

@thumpism - I had a 19" Raleigh Sport step through that fit me great. However it was silver with sky blue head tube. I don't like neutrals. I would love to have a 19" green step through with thimbles on fork, or maybe coffee or possibly black. Green is my favorite color. I live in western Oregon with trees everywhere. What can I say? ;)

Question: was there a period of years when SA AW 3-speed hub was built better than other years? Or a range of years? So if I was looking for a used one, is there a time frame when they were made exceptionally well? Or poorly? Seems like I've read that after mid '70's the quality declines.

thumpism 08-12-17 08:52 PM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19788153)
@thumpism - I had a 19" Raleigh Sport step through that fit me great. However it was silver with sky blue head tube. I don't like neutrals. I would love to have a 19" green step through with thimbles on fork, or maybe coffee or possibly black. Green is my favorite color. I live in western Oregon with trees everywhere. What can I say? ;)

Question: was there a period of years when SA AW 3-speed hub was built better than other years? Or a range of years? So if I was looking for a used one, is there a time frame when they were made exceptionally well? Or poorly? Seems like I've read that after mid '70's the quality declines.

Sorry, all we have in 19" stepthrough with thimbles is in blue. My coffee 23M is currently on duty and the green 23L is waiting in the wings for my less agile days yet to come.

I don't have vast exposure to SA stuff in heavy use, but in my experience would advise you to grab any one that meets your needs and worry about problems if/when they arise. If I found one that worked I'd expect it to keep working.
Attachment 576001

Velocivixen 08-12-17 09:21 PM

@thumpism - that sure is a pretty shade of blue. I've never seen that shade before.

BigChief 08-13-17 04:57 AM

I have found that some hubs shift more smoothly and run more quietly than others and more attention was paid to details and quality in the 50s and early 60 than later. But for example, the hub on my 73 roadster is just as good as any one I've ever had. So it's hard to say. This is only a guess, but I think you would be less likely to find a problem hub like I did on my 70 roadster if you picked an older hub. I think I found the issue with the sticky down shifting. At least it shifts reliably now, but it's still noisy. I've had it apart 3 times now and can't figure it out. Something's out of spec somewhere so I write it down to just not being a very good hub.

markk900 08-13-17 06:24 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19788510)
I have found that some hubs shift more smoothly and run more quietly than others and more attention was paid to details and quality in the 50s and early 60 than later. But for example, the hub on my 73 roadster is just as good as any one I've ever had. So it's hard to say. This is only a guess, but I think you would be less likely to find a problem hub like I did on my 70 roadster if you picked an older hub. I think I found the issue with the sticky down shifting. At least it shifts reliably now, but it's still noisy. I've had it apart 3 times now and can't figure it out. Something's out of spec somewhere so I write it down to just not being a very good hub.

When I first got my 49 Humber, after a gentle cleanup the only real problem I had was a tendency for it to skip in 1st (L) gear. I had that hub apart numerous times, and replaced most of the small components related to first gear (pawls, springs, clutch etc). It continued to skip at the most inopportune times (climbing hard on low); I was beginning to thing the pawl ring in the hub body itself was worn. Finally I took the entire innards of a NOS hub from 1974 (supposedly in the declining years of SA) and slid them into the 49 shell. Problem solved immediately...

@Velocivixen: surprised you had to rebuild your wheel - did the new innards for your 2-speed not fit in the shell already laced?

thumpism 08-13-17 07:40 AM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19788278)
@thumpism - that sure is a pretty shade of blue. I've never seen that shade before.

You should look up the stock color, a deep royal blue. This one is badly oxidized and looks almost violet and rubbing compound might bring it back but I don't lavish my bikes with that kind of treatment. I found this one twenty years ago for a friend who said she wanted a bike to ride in the neighborhood and this one turned up at a yard sale in absolutely beautiful original condition. Showroom. How it looks now is the result of being ignored for two decades in her back yard. I won't be so diligent next request.

BigChief 08-13-17 09:17 AM


Originally Posted by markk900 (Post 19788575)
When I first got my 49 Humber, after a gentle cleanup the only real problem I had was a tendency for it to skip in 1st (L) gear. I had that hub apart numerous times, and replaced most of the small components related to first gear (pawls, springs, clutch etc). It continued to skip at the most inopportune times (climbing hard on low); I was beginning to thing the pawl ring in the hub body itself was worn. Finally I took the entire innards of a NOS hub from 1974 (supposedly in the declining years of SA) and slid them into the 49 shell. Problem solved immediately...

@Velocivixen: surprised you had to rebuild your wheel - did the new innards for your 2-speed not fit in the shell already laced?

It is true that the hub in my 73 DL-1 is perfect. I replaced all the bearings and cleaned things up. Thing ticks like a clock. Smooth as silk. On the other hand, the 70-72 hub (no date stamp) has some issues. The driver was machined with very dull tools. Looks like somebody chiseled it out of stone. Very coarse with chipped edges. No effort was made to deburr the clutch plate or the slot in the axle for the indicator key. After I softened these edges, the hub would down shift. The indicator was jammed tight when I first got the bike. These parts should have never made it into a finished hub. Also, as the wheel spins, you can hear pressure through the gears change as it rotates. A sort of runch, runch sound that my other hubs don't make. The components aren't being held squarely. I suspect the hub shell isn't exactly true. Combining my experience with this hub with the obvious cost cutting of the external parts of the system is what makes me guess that the older hubs may be of more consistent quality. Still, I admit, it's only a guess.

Velocivixen 08-13-17 10:51 AM

@markk900 - Universal Cycles, where I bought the hub, had never dealt with warranty issues with Sturmey Archer before. They presumed that SA would replace the entire hub - thus telling me that, in order to commence the warranty claim I'd have to unlaced the wheel & bring the hub to them.
As you can imagine, when they said that SA would send new internals I was piss@d. Building a 406 20" wheel is tricky because the tensionometer does not fit. I had to use sound to assess tensions. I am an exacting wheel builder & rely on my tools. I don't like having wheels where I really don't know the tensions....

noglider 08-13-17 02:09 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19787261)
This is my idea of a Scorcher and bike, from 1896, although he is an NY messenger.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/qc...=w1024-h720-no

What a great picture. Look at that kid. He's not just handsome, he's tough. And there is a lot of resemblance between him and today's NYC messenger. Bike messengers didn't come back in style recently. They've been in style here for over a century. I love to ride my bike, but I would never want to take that job.

noglider 08-13-17 02:13 PM

The quality did decline, and they stopped using cyanide hardening at some point. If you have a choice, get an older hub, but don't be afraid of a later hub. Deal with problems when and if they arise. You may not have any.

That dark blue color came out in the mid or late 70s, and it's awfully nice. I'm pretty sure it came on only the ladies' bikes. Blue was for girls, and red was for boys.

gster 08-14-17 05:47 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19787188)
Very, very sharp. Love it! I'll always have a soft spot for scorchers. Nice job on this one.

I second that! Very attractive bike.

gster 08-14-17 05:57 AM

Iverson 3 Speed
 
4 Attachment(s)
I picked this up a few days ago as a gift/payment for a young lady that looks after the pets when we're away. I offered cash or a bike. She chose a bike. It's not British but....
Attachment 576093
This is a made in Japan Iverson 3 speed with a Sturmey Archer hub and shifter. Hub is dated 3/72. Research tells me that Iverson is not a well respected brand but I think those remarks refer to their 10 speeds. The paint and decals are in good shape. This one will get the usual rebuild with some new tires/pads and cables. I'm sure it will be a good commuter.

Attachment 576094

Attachment 576095

Attachment 576096

gster 08-14-17 06:12 AM

Totally Off Topic But....
 
2 Attachment(s)
This weekend I had the opportunity to visit a small hydro-electric power station in the Ottawa Valley.
This station was built in 1907 and is still running the original Westinghouse generators built in 1905!
These were designed by the great Nikola Tesla. I'd like to see something built today that will work continuously for 100+ years!
Attachment 576097

Attachment 576098

1989Pre 08-14-17 06:17 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 19790558)
This weekend I had the opportunity to visit a small hydro-electric power station in the Ottawa Valley.
This station was built in 1907 and is still running the original Westinghouse generators built in 1905!
These were designed by the great Nicola Tesla. I'd like to see something built today that will work continuously for 100+ years!
Attachment 576097

Attachment 576098

Did Tesla ever train his interest toward bicycles?

thumpism 08-14-17 07:09 AM

Iverson was a grand old name American bicycles, dating practically from the dawn of the age. Later ones were "badge engineered" like the cheapo 10-speeds you mentioned and this imported 3-speed. One of the experts here could probably tell you more.

Originally Posted by gster (Post 19790545)
I picked this up a few days ago as a gift/payment for a young lady that looks after the pets when we're away. I offered cash or a bike. She chose a bike. It's not British but....
Attachment 576093
This is a made in Japan Iverson 3 speed with a Sturmey Archer hub and shifter. Hub is dated 3/72. Research tells me that Iverson is not a well respected brand but I think tose remarks refer to their 10 speeds. The paint and decals are in good shape. This one will get the usual rebuild with some new tires/pads and cables. I'm sure it will be a good commuter.


BigChief 08-14-17 07:43 AM


Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19788153)
@thumpism - I had a 19" Raleigh Sport step through that fit me great. However it was silver with sky blue head tube. I don't like neutrals. I would love to have a 19" green step through with thimbles on fork, or maybe coffee or possibly black. Green is my favorite color. I live in western Oregon with trees everywhere. What can I say? ;)

I don't care for the silver gray much myself, but, have you ever seen the dark gray color of the mid 70s? I've seen a couple of step throughs with this color and thought they looked super classy. It would be hard for me to pass up a tall gents frame in that charcoal gray.

clubman 08-14-17 07:47 AM

That's so cool. Tell me that doesn't look like a Sturmey Dyno hub with the armature exposed. 48 holes, tough to get that gauge of spoke these days. Super!
http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...7&d=1502712527

Velocivixen 08-14-17 08:17 AM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19790747)
That's so cool. Tell me that doesn't look like a Sturmey Dyno hub with the armature exposed. 48 holes, tough to get that gauge of spoke these days. Super!
http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...7&d=1502712527

I concur! Is that a turbine?

Ballenxj 08-14-17 08:25 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 19790558)
This weekend I had the opportunity to visit a small hydro-electric power station in the Ottawa Valley.
This station was built in 1907 and is still running the original Westinghouse generators built in 1905!
These were designed by the great Nikola Tesla. I'd like to see something built today that will work continuously for 100+ years!

Proof that things really were built better in the old days?
Nikola Tesla was a great man that was ripped off by a well known person, but that's not a story for here.
Thanks for the photos. Very enjoyable. :thumb:

gster 08-14-17 09:16 AM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by Velocivixen (Post 19790832)
I concur! Is that a turbine?

Strictly speaking, it's a generator when current flows out. Should current flow in, it would be a motor.
There is a double "turbine" connected to the shaft that extends into the water/sluiceway.
Something like this.
Attachment 576115

gster 08-14-17 09:21 AM


Originally Posted by Ballenxj (Post 19790858)
Proof that things really were built better in the old days?
Nikola Tesla was a great man that was ripped off by a well known person, but that's not a story for here.
Thanks for the photos. Very enjoyable. :thumb:

According to the engineer, the coils in these generators were rebuilt in the 70's, not because there was anything wrong with them, they were upgraded to put out more power. So yes, built to last, as were our English bicycles.

bicyclridr4life 08-14-17 09:55 AM


Originally Posted by plympton (Post 19787289)
When I restored the John Deere I had the frame and pan sand blasted at a cemetery monument shop. Great on steel frames not good on sheet metal. There's much talk about glass bead blasting as easier on the metal. When I restored the 56 outboard I stripped every part by hand, long tedious process, bike frame and fenders would be easier. Both paint jobs where from rattle cans. In both cases the rattle cans were job specific; I mean that the John Deere spray can and the Gale outboard can were designed not to sputter at the end. Rustoleum and Krylon spit as the paint runs out. It wasn't necessarily any skill of mine that helped the paint job look nice. When I first posted on this site I asked about Raleigh paint. I'm still asking, I could pick from anyone of a dozen black paints. What is the correct Raleigh Black?

The stripping doesn't bother me. Part of the process. I would have to research the paint and primers and try to build confidence in my skills as a painter.

As an ex-auto body repairman, I can tell you "black is black" the same paint code for black paint was used regardless of what make the car was. The "Black Pearl" they've come up with since I got out of that line of work would be different, of course.
White, on the other hand, had 50 different mixing codes.

johnnyspaghetti 08-14-17 10:53 AM

How does one acquire a key for a 1969 Raleigh Superbe fork?

Salubrious 08-14-17 11:34 AM


Originally Posted by johnnyspaghetti (Post 19791279)
How does one acquire a key for a 1969 Raleigh Superbe fork?

Get the number off the lock and then goto ebay...

johnnyspaghetti 08-14-17 01:15 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 19791393)
Get the number off the lock and then goto ebay...

Thank you very much

Velocivixen 08-14-17 02:02 PM

@clubman & @ gster- so those are for hydroelectric use? If not, what exactly are they used for?
My magnet keeper will definitely not work on that if it were a dynamo hub....;)


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