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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 04:59 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20295672)
These projects can be a "Slow Burn".

Yes. For this one, it's have the bike in a condition where I can ride it around, then relax. Not least because I have another bike in pieces that got delayed from last spring. That one I'm kind of desperate to pull together.

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 05:00 AM


Originally Posted by Dean51 (Post 20301263)
I used OA for the handlebars, stem, brake calipers, brake levers, and small fasteners. The handlebars and stem were in the worst condition for rust. The other bits would have polished up nicely with a buffer and compound, but it was easier to throw them in to the bucket of oxalic acid as long as I had it going

Just one more question about the oxalic acid bath. Does it smell bad, or give off fumes? I am somewhat limited what I can get away with--apartment living.

BigChief 04-24-18 05:11 AM

An interesting thread going on over at Cycle Chat. Back around the time I and some kids I knew in the States were emulating road racers with our old beat up 3 speeds, Kids in England were inspired by dirt track racers. Nicknamed Trackers. Same idea. Stripped down with rat trap pedals, but with wide dirt track bars and knobby tires.
https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/tr...-bikes.216983/

gster 04-24-18 05:59 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20303482)
An interesting thread going on over at Cycle Chat. Back around the time I and some kids I knew in the States were emulating road racers with our old beat up 3 speeds, Kids in England were inspired by dirt track racers. Nicknamed Trackers. Same idea. Stripped down with rat trap pedals, but with wide dirt track bars and knobby tires.
https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/tr...-bikes.216983/

I guess it's just human nature to constantly fiddle and modify our machines.

clubman 04-24-18 06:17 AM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20303477)
Just one more question about the oxalic acid bath. Does it smell bad, or give off fumes? I am somewhat limited what I can get away with--apartment living.

Toxic. Use outdoors, wear good outer protection and a face shield, especially when diluting pure OA. I ususally use discarded turtle pools but many have created custom wooden forms lined with plastic to maximize efficiency. There are lots of forum threads on OA.

BigChief 04-24-18 06:53 AM

There is a middle of the road choice that I'm fond of. I've been using Evapo-Rust for most of my derusting jobs. No mixing and it's not nasty to work with. It is much faster working than vinegar, but it usually takes an overnight soak to remove light rusting. You can reuse it quite a few times before it gets too weak.

Dean51 04-24-18 08:47 AM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20303477)
Just one more question about the oxalic acid bath. Does it smell bad, or give off fumes? I am somewhat limited what I can get away with--apartment living.

I use it indoors, a garage/workshop environment. I have not found it to smell bad or give off substantial fumes. Having said this, please know my tolerance for this kind of thing is rather high after 35+ years of working in the pulp/paper and petroleum refining industries.

I'd suggest you search online for an MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for OA and use that as a guide for personal protective equipment, ventilation, etc.

Dean

johnnyspaghetti 04-24-18 10:19 AM

Starting bid $50 matching ladies starts bid $50 in Maryland. They look mid 70's

https://www.invaluable.com/auction-l...7-c-c9f486bbad

https://image.invaluable.com/housePh...L142025831.jpg

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 10:35 AM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20303550)
Toxic.

I am going to have to pass on the oxalic acid.

browngw 04-24-18 10:36 AM

1 Attachment(s)

Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20303477)
Just one more question about the oxalic acid bath. Does it smell bad, or give off fumes? I am somewhat limited what I can get away with--apartment living.

I don't use chemical bathes for rust much anymore. If the parts can be disassembled completely its fine but always messy. If you get rust removing chemicals on zinc or some other metals it ca turn black or gray. A combination of foil and steel and brass small brushes will always get the job done. I did a lot of parts while watching TV with the Missus this past cold winter. Old towel in my lap and a plastic container of coffee sticks, wire brushes, tooth brushes etc. Even full wheelsets.

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 10:38 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20303596)
I've been using Evapo-Rust for most of my derusting jobs. No mixing and it's not nasty to work with.

This sounds like something to check out.

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 10:43 AM

I look at johnnyspaghetti's gleaming rims and now am not feeling another set of CR18s.

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 04:11 PM


Originally Posted by browngw (Post 20304170)
I don't use chemical bathes for rust much anymore. If the parts can be disassembled completely its fine but always messy. If you get rust removing chemicals on zinc or some other metals it ca turn black or gray. A combination of foil and steel and brass small brushes will always get the job done. I did a lot of parts while watching TV with the Missus this past cold winter. Old towel in my lap and a plastic container of coffee sticks, wire brushes, tooth brushes etc. Even full wheelsets.

Gorgeous. Plus a reminder that I have to print out some bike art and put it up on the bike rack at work.

johnnyspaghetti 04-24-18 05:23 PM

The acids work good on chrome if it's not flaking. The zinc plated parts will turn off brightness if soaked but I have got some good results with the chemicals using them more as a topical application with brass brushes & elbow grease but it is messy brushing harsh chemicals to clean up the zinc plate which will come off if you work it too far.

johnnyspaghetti 04-24-18 06:08 PM

ScocthBrite Gray is good for zinc if used in a easy manner, ScotchBrite red is twice as abrasive. These are tools. Same as acids.

paulb_in_bkln 04-24-18 06:27 PM

It's been ages since I've used auto polishing compound, which I've been considering for the paint on the Rudge. Keep it away from the decals, right? Is it any use on the chrome?

johnnyspaghetti 04-24-18 08:03 PM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20305242)
It's been ages since I've used auto polishing compound, which I've been considering for the paint on the Rudge. Keep it away from the decals, right? Is it any use on the chrome?

The varnish decals will go away. I'v been working on an epic touch up to top tube gashes and other black lac & build up clearcoat trying to preserve old decals on a 64 sports. So far so good but this is hard work. Nothing is done until it's finished.

BigChief 04-24-18 08:15 PM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20305242)
It's been ages since I've used auto polishing compound, which I've been considering for the paint on the Rudge. Keep it away from the decals, right? Is it any use on the chrome?

I go a bit more lightly over the transfers, but I still polish them. Polish is very fine and doesn't remove much paint. I like to use retired terrycloth bath towels cut into strips for polishing. I use an artists brush to cover bare steel and rusty spots with gloss black Rustoleum. I find it's easier to tone down gloss from a gloss paint than to add gloss to a flat paint. Besides adding some luster to the faded paint, polishing helps hide the touch ups. At first, the touch ups stand out because the gloss doesn't match. I wait a week or so then polish all the paint. You can still see the touch ups, but since the gloss matches, they don't jump out at you. You have to look closely to notice them. Then I apply liquid wax and polish that. Makes a big difference. You can use the polish on chrome. Once chrome gets surface rust, it will never be as rust resistant as it was originally. It needs an occasional coat of wax.

johnnyspaghetti 04-24-18 08:52 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20305458)
I go a bit more lightly over the transfers, but I still polish them. Polish is very fine and doesn't remove much paint. I like to use retired terrycloth bath towels cut into strips for polishing. I use an artists brush to cover bare steel and rusty spots with gloss black Rustoleum. I find it's easier to tone down gloss from a gloss paint than to add gloss to a flat paint. Besides adding some luster to the faded paint, polishing helps hide the touch ups. At first, the touch ups stand out because the gloss doesn't match. I wait a week or so then polish all the paint. You can still see the touch ups, but since the gloss matches, they don't jump out at you. You have to look closely to notice them. Then I apply liquid wax and polish that. Makes a big difference. You can use the polish on chrome. Once chrome gets surface rust, it will never be as rust resistant as it was originally. It needs an occasional coat of wax.

I strip down old towels because she throws them out if there tattered. I get them through every bend on the frame.
Then you have to use your arms jockey it thru back & forth back up/down this way that way and with good results how ever tiring.

browngw 04-24-18 09:13 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20305458)
I go a bit more lightly over the transfers, but I still polish them. Polish is very fine and doesn't remove much paint. I like to use retired terrycloth bath towels cut into strips for polishing. I use an artists brush to cover bare steel and rusty spots with gloss black Rustoleum. I find it's easier to tone down gloss from a gloss paint than to add gloss to a flat paint. Besides adding some luster to the faded paint, polishing helps hide the touch ups. At first, the touch ups stand out because the gloss doesn't match. I wait a week or so then polish all the paint. You can still see the touch ups, but since the gloss matches, they don't jump out at you. You have to look closely to notice them. Then I apply liquid wax and polish that. Makes a big difference. You can use the polish on chrome. Once chrome gets surface rust, it will never be as rust resistant as it was originally. It needs an occasional coat of wax.

Well said @BigChief ! That same process has served me well on scores of bikes. Even spray metallic touch up paint is used the same way with the artist brush and later hand compounding. Never had it damage a decal if care was used and the whole bike gets a coat of wax when complete.

johnnyspaghetti 04-24-18 10:48 PM

I would say. I have worked with many paints. I have seen more than rustolium. Urethane with a I said wow. you could kill yourself from the cyanide. A nice paint to work with.

BigChief 04-25-18 04:40 AM

Since the original paint is enamel I figured Rustoleum enamel would be a good choice. I've never done any other color than black. I do have a green 70s Sports to experiment with. Might try touching up rusty spots by mixing Testors sign paint enamel. I have a project coming up with rather good black paint, but for some reason, the front tip of the front fender is badly rusted. It needs to be reinforced underneath and I'm going to fill the pitting on top and try to blend it in. Going to be tricky to make that repair look good. We'll see how it goes.
edit:
Forgot to say. Sometimes the polish works like magic. A light polish brings up a nice gloss to the finish. Other times, with bikes that were left outside for years, it doesn't seem to do much at all. I figure this has to do with how deeply the oxidation in the old paint goes. The word oxidation may not be correct, but I'll use it because I don't know another word that would make sense. Most of the time, a fine polish brings up enough gloss to make the finish look nice while still preserving that old look I like so much on these old roadsters. Wax will add a bit of gloss too.

arty dave 04-25-18 05:47 AM

Awesome posts from everyone!
I took the DL-1 for a night ride tonight - I had to exercise my knee, the 'plica' part of it is inflamed but on the mend. The nicest part of the ride was pushing (walking) the bike up the final hill, and a friendly voice in the dark asking if I needed anything to help me get home. I thanked him for asking with a brief explanation of 'crook knee' and continued to the top for the final stretch home. The B33 saddle is finally conforming to my nether regions. For some time I've been considering swapping it out for a B72, but I'm glad I stayed the distance. Definitely my favourite bike to ride.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/832/4...5e9f710e_b.jpgIMG20180425181702 by arty dave armour, on Flickr

There's a modern light strapped to the handlebars but it disappears into the background darkness. I really should revisit the Miller headlight I'd like to use on this bike.

BigChief 04-25-18 06:30 AM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 20305851)
Awesome posts from everyone!
I took the DL-1 for a night ride tonight - I had to exercise my knee, the 'plica' part of it is inflamed but on the mend. The nicest part of the ride was pushing (walking) the bike up the final hill, and a friendly voice in the dark asking if I needed anything to help me get home. I thanked him for asking with a brief explanation of 'crook knee' and continued to the top for the final stretch home. The B33 saddle is finally conforming to my nether regions. For some time I've been considering swapping it out for a B72, but I'm glad I stayed the distance. Definitely my favourite bike to ride.

https://farm1.staticflickr.com/832/4...5e9f710e_b.jpgIMG20180425181702 by arty dave armour, on Flickr

There's a modern light strapped to the handlebars but it disappears into the background darkness. I really should revisit the Miller headlight I'd like to use on this bike.

That is a sharp bike. There's a 300' section of steep road I walk my bike up too even with a 22T cog. It washes out and gets rocky. Even the local kids walk that section so I don't feel too bad and fancy road bikes NEVER go there. I love riding these old roadsters.

noglider 04-25-18 07:26 AM


Originally Posted by johnnyspaghetti (Post 20305512)
I strip down old towels because she throws them out if there tattered. I get them through every bend on the frame.
Then you have to use your arms jockey it thru back & forth back up/down this way that way and with good results how ever tiring.

I call it flossing.


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