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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

Chaser95 06-04-18 03:29 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 20376450)
I've used Testors enamel with good results. I would keep darkening white with black until I had a good match. If you see a hint of primary color you can play around trying to mix that in also. If it's got a metallic look, you could use silver as a base instead of white. I try my best to make the newly painted part fit in with the rest of the old paint by using a more coarse compound like rubbing compound to polish after hardening so the finish isn't so glossy. +1 on the reflector. I'd dump that too. While you have the headset apart, you could replace that reflector with a traditional heron lamp bracket too.Might as well get some 5/32" ball bearings before you take it apart.These bearings are known to have magical properties. You hear them hit the floor then they vanish into nonexsistance. I wonder if there's a parallel dimension somewhere where some guy is wondering why ball bearings keep showing up on his shop floor.

Actually that is the Heron lamp bracket turned upside down which might explain the headset problems, I think many of those bearings have gone to that dimension you mentioned,

Chaser95 06-04-18 03:31 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 20376575)
I have an extra half-dozen Sports chainguards but it appears you have the two frame braze-ons on the down/seat tube? That was usually reserved for the Superbes. Pretty sure a regular guard will work with a hole drilled for the top mount. I'll look at what I've got.

Thanks! You can PM if you like.

thumpism 06-05-18 05:30 AM

Here's an oldie for the Rudgists out there.

https://richmond.craigslist.org/bik/...607790211.html

Rudge Whitworth Sports 3-Speed Bicycle - $200 (Midlothian)

https://images.craigslist.org/00303_...Qw_600x450.jpg
https://images.craigslist.org/00q0q_...B9_600x450.jpg
I'm selling this for my mother, who hasn't ridden this in 40-50 years. The bike dates back to a least the 50s, maybe late 40s, as she used to take it on big trips up in New England way back. I understand it's fairly valuable in great condition, but obviously this needs a lot of TLC. Since I don't know how to price this I'm throwing a price out there. I make no assertions about serviceability or function. Obviously, at a very minimum would need new tires, a thorough cleaning and lube. I don't know if the corrosion on the wheels is bad enough to weaken them. One handlebar has a replacement grip that is half off, which is why it looks so much longer on that side.

I am two hours from her house, but come to Richmond at least once a week and could meet up with someone seriously interested.

noglider 06-05-18 07:26 AM

There are several old Raleigh 3-speeds that have been locked up for years outside near my workplace. They are abandoned and rusty. What a shame.

BigChief 06-05-18 07:55 AM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 20377587)
Here's an oldie for the Rudgists out there.

https://richmond.craigslist.org/bik/...607790211.htmlRudge Whitworth Sports 3-Speed Bicycle - $200 (Midlothian)

https://images.craigslist.org/00303_...Qw_600x450.jpg
https://images.craigslist.org/00q0q_...B9_600x450.jpg
I'm selling this for my mother, who hasn't ridden this in 40-50 years. The bike dates back to a least the 50s, maybe late 40s, as she used to take it on big trips up in New England way back. I understand it's fairly valuable in great condition, but obviously this needs a lot of TLC. Since I don't know how to price this I'm throwing a price out there. I make no assertions about serviceability or function. Obviously, at a very minimum would need new tires, a thorough cleaning and lube. I don't know if the corrosion on the wheels is bad enough to weaken them. One handlebar has a replacement grip that is half off, which is why it looks so much longer on that side.

I am two hours from her house, but come to Richmond at least once a week and could meet up with someone seriously interested.

Another nice one! Looks complete, except of course for grips. Hard to tell from the small picture if that rust spot on the rear rim ruins it or not, but the fenders seem to be good, the chaincase is all there, the Brooks saddle, original rear carrier and maybe even the cable housings. A good 50s stepthrough and a worthy project.

johnnyspaghetti 06-05-18 08:51 AM


Originally Posted by thumpism (Post 20377587)
Here's an oldie for the Rudgists out there.

https://richmond.craigslist.org/bik/...607790211.html

Rudge Whitworth Sports 3-Speed Bicycle - $200 (Midlothian)

https://images.craigslist.org/00303_...Qw_600x450.jpg
https://images.craigslist.org/00q0q_...B9_600x450.jpg
I'm selling this for my mother, who hasn't ridden this in 40-50 years. The bike dates back to a least the 50s, maybe late 40s, as she used to take it on big trips up in New England way back. I understand it's fairly valuable in great condition, but obviously this needs a lot of TLC. Since I don't know how to price this I'm throwing a price out there. I make no assertions about serviceability or function. Obviously, at a very minimum would need new tires, a thorough cleaning and lube. I don't know if the corrosion on the wheels is bad enough to weaken them. One handlebar has a replacement grip that is half off, which is why it looks so much longer on that side.

I am two hours from her house, but come to Richmond at least once a week and could meet up with someone seriously interested.

I would love to be a Rudgist this one is too far away

thumpism 06-05-18 11:39 AM


Originally Posted by johnnyspaghetti (Post 20377870)
I would love to be a Rudgist this one is too far away

If you're serious it can be arranged. I have facilitated before.

noglider 06-05-18 12:50 PM


Originally Posted by mtb_addict (Post 20377921)
Hey yall!

I have a Dutch Oma, which I believe is a close cousin to the English 3spd. I notice the English have low handlebars (near saddle height), while my Dutch has extreme tall handlebars.

So I tried to make it more English by dropping the handlebars much lower (but still much above saddle height). I riding it around like that, and I notice the bar end and the brake lever would hit my knee when turning at low speed. I feel like I can't make tight turns anymore...and it feels frustrating. The first time it hit my knee, I almost fell.

Is this also happen on the English bikes?

Yes it sometimes happens on English bikes but not as much. If you don't like the super tall handlebars, maybe you don't like Dutch bikes. If you post a picture, we might be able to think of a solution. Maybe you can get a stem with a bigger forward extension.

Chaser95 06-05-18 03:24 PM


Originally Posted by Chaser95 (Post 20376682)
Actually that is the Heron lamp bracket turned upside down which might explain the headset problems, I think many of those bearings have gone to that dimension you mentioned,

Now I have to print a retraction. Big Chief, my sincere apologies, that is most definitely NOT a heron bracket upside down on the silver bike. In my mind I was certain that it was. Reagan was right, "Trust but, verify"

I have a line on another pair of Raleigh Sports. A light blue ladies with 19 1/2 frame and a coffee men's 21. Seller is the original owner. Said they bought the blue in 74 and the coffee in 75. I see them on Friday.

gster 06-05-18 05:05 PM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20375593)
Also, as much as I like them I try to keep in mind they were mass produced by the many tens or hundreds of thousands. Although Sheldon wrote somewhere that Ford Model Ts were once so numerous that when they were superseded by newer models you could drive an old one away at a yard sale price. Not exactly like that today. I still think about that guy on eBay a few years ago asking, I think it was $6,000, for a detailed mint his/her pair of 50s black Raleigh Sports. No idea what they might have sold for. I once read that the price of 50s and 60s British tube hifi equipment was driven sky high by a crazy demand for it in Japan. I wonder if the Japanese like old British bicycles?

OT.
A few tears ago, walking down the street I saw an old tube amp in the garbage. I took it home and after some research found out
it was an old PYE mono amp from the mid fifties.
I found several buyers on line looking for it and sold it to a dealer in England for $800.00.
The original Mullard power tube was worth $100.00 on it's own.

Cute Boy Horse 06-05-18 06:31 PM


Originally Posted by mtb_addict (Post 20377921)
Hey yall!

I have a Dutch Oma, which I believe is a close cousin to the English 3spd. I notice the English have low handlebars (near saddle height), while my Dutch has extreme tall handlebars.

So I tried to make it more English by dropping the handlebars much lower (but still much above saddle height). I riding it around like that, and I notice the bar end and the brake lever would hit my knee when turning at low speed. I feel like I can't make tight turns anymore...and it feels frustrating. The first time it hit my knee, I almost fell.

Is this also happen on the English bikes?

If you look at period advertising the English bikes also had their handlebars much higher than the saddle, exactly like the dutch do. However when you look even closer, you notice that's achieved by putting the saddle fairly low, compared to how modern day people set them up. Older English are much shorter than younger English people or I would say most foreigners, because food poverty was a constant problem. Those who were children in the great depression are the worst off for that, having spent most of it eating out of the rubbish, they're all 4 foot 10 midgets. Then it gets a bit better with children born into WWII rationing as they were finally guaranteed a bare minimum of healthy nutrition, and back to modern standards for those born in the post-rationing boom.

What this means simply is that you're seeing bikes owned by people who don't fit them properly, so it looks different.

The biggest thing about not banging your knees on the brakes is how wide the bars are, and if you pedal properly. You might be sticking your knees out all funny, I've seen that before. The handles should be wider apart than your legs.

BigChief 06-05-18 08:26 PM

Can't say definitively without measuring, but it looks like this Raleigh DL-1 has more reach than the Dutch roadster.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...1a626e8103.jpg

Cute Boy Horse 06-06-18 06:29 AM

They're within an inch of each other in real life. I still say mtb_addict is riding with his knees too far apart, there's no way someone's knees should be banging into rod brake levers, which are underneath the grips towards the outside. We're talking serious manspreading going on to not fit in the 45-50cm gap inside the bars.

paulb_in_bkln 06-06-18 09:16 AM


Originally Posted by Cute Boy Horse (Post 20378986)
However when you look even closer, you notice that's achieved by putting the saddle fairly low, compared to how modern day people set them up. Older English are much shorter than younger English people or I would say most foreigners, because food poverty was a constant problem.

There's a vivid passage in one of James Herriot's All Creatures books where he describes an adult who's originally from Glasgow and is of small stature and Herriot talks about the clear signs of childhood hunger--starvation is more accurate, I guess, That's stayed with me.

paulb_in_bkln 06-06-18 09:18 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 20378843)
OT.
A few tears ago, walking down the street I saw an old tube amp in the garbage. I took it home and after some research found out
it was an old PYE mono amp from the mid fifties.
I found several buyers on line looking for it and sold it to a dealer in England for $800.00.
The original Mullard power tube was worth $100.00 on it's own.

Fifties Raleighs, old tube amps, the things you guys find in the trash! I keep my eyes open but... no. This doesn't happen here, at least, not to me.

paulb_in_bkln 06-06-18 09:25 AM


Originally Posted by mtb_addict (Post 20377921)
riding it around like that, and I notice the bar end and the brake lever would hit my knee when turning at low speed. I feel like I can't make tight turns anymore...and it feels frustrating. The first time it hit my knee, I almost fell.

Is this also happen on the English bikes?

It's not happened on my Sports. I have an old Trek where I've changed to some big wide handlebars from Nitto called albatross handlebars and they are so wide and sweep so far back that maneuvering can sometimes be difficult the way you describe. But never when I'm actually riding, this can happen when I'm kind of shuffling with my feet on the ground. It's not an agile bike for the city exactly for this reason, but it is comfortable for long days on an open road.

Cute Boy Horse 06-06-18 10:22 AM


Originally Posted by paulb_in_bkln (Post 20379820)
There's a vivid passage in one of James Herriot's All Creatures books where he describes an adult who's originally from Glasgow and is of small stature and Herriot talks about the clear signs of childhood hunger--starvation is more accurate, I guess, That's stayed with me.

I shouldn't forget the scots had it too, but the only thing holding Britain together is English chauvinism. It's difficult not to slip back into that mindset.

BigChief 06-06-18 10:37 AM

Finally stopped raining so I got a ride in on my Rudge in today. Funny, I've been riding so long that things have become second nature and not in the front of my mind. I made note of a couple things today. Riding straight ahead, my knees are a good 3 inches away from the handlebar. It's only when I make a sharp turn, like a U turn on a narrow road where my knee coming up would hit the handlebar that I instinctively tip my leg (on the inside of the turn) out to the side to clear the handlebar.

ddeand 06-06-18 05:56 PM

Woo Hoo!
I just finished the 1979 Raleigh Sports women's bike for my daughter. I got the bike free and ended up putting about $35 into it (tires, used rack, bearings, brake pads), and I think it turned out quite nice. My daughter and I are going to ride the ABCE (and Gentlemen's Tour) in September here in the Twin Cities - she's excited about getting her kit together. Here are two pics of the bike - the darker photo has more definition, but the sunshine pic shows the color better (plus it has the rack on it). Thanks to everyonefor all the help and advice with my projects - I appreciate it!
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f6203eda5b.jpg

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...980815fe08.jpg

BigChief 06-06-18 08:53 PM

@ddeand Good job! looks great. Very pretty bike.

SirMike1983 06-06-18 08:57 PM

With the English roadsters, "knee knocking" with the handlebar ends is not at all uncommon on roadsters that use the old-style "narrow" pattern handlebars. The narrow bars were very common from the early days of rod brake roadsters of various brands through the 1960s (Raleigh kept putting them on 'export' spec roadsters even later - into the 1980s). The most common rod brake bike in the US - the US spec DL-1 from the 1970s era, uses a wider type of handlebar which is much less of a problem when turning. But the narrow bars were common for a long time and bikes with them still turn up. My 1978 DL-1 has standard wide bars, whereas my 1962 export DL-1 has narrow bars. My 1935 Hercules had narrow bars as well. My 1963 Danish market Raleigh Dawn Tourist had wide bars.

thumpism 06-07-18 06:02 AM

Area flipper offers a nice ladies' Sport among the road bikes.

https://richmond.craigslist.org/bik/...609582464.html

Racing And Touring Road Bikes- Specs And Prices Below! - $1 (Chesapeake)

https://images.craigslist.org/00707_...7X_600x450.jpg

High quality Racing and touring bikes, Prices and Specs Listed in Order of Pictures

1973 Ladies Raleigh 3-speed Sturmey Archer $100

paulb_in_bkln 06-07-18 07:16 AM


Originally Posted by ddeand (Post 20380814)
Woo Hoo!
I just finished the 1979 Raleigh Sports women's bike for my daughter. I got the bike free and ended up putting about $35 into (tires, used rack, bearings, brake pads), and I think it turned out quite nice. My daughter and I are going to ride the ABCE (and Gentlemen's Tour) in September here in the Twin Cities - she's excited about getting her kit together. Here are two pics of the bike - the darker photo has more definition, but the sunshine pic shows the color better (plus it has the rack on it). Thanks to everyonefor all the help and advice with my projects - I appreciate it!
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...f6203eda5b.jpg

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...980815fe08.jpg

Shiny! The offspring must be absolutely delighted.

paulb_in_bkln 06-07-18 07:25 AM

A local bike shop closed but still keeps a presence on FB. Bragging they are about this Lenton; it doesn't seem to be for sale. Nomad Cycles.
https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...3a&oe=5BC4CCAB

nlerner 06-07-18 11:58 AM

^ Lenton Grand Prix from 1960-61 (earlier models had a rod-operated FD). I've owned at least three, but felt like they rode like a bag of bricks and moved 'em on. What's with the fender chop on that one?!


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