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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=623699)

jon.612 07-20-17 11:25 AM

It's a "laid back" bmx seatpost. I'm 6'2" riding a 23" bike, but I've found that the bmx world and old Raleighs have a lot in common in terms of parts dimensions, not so much in attitude (I've never said "RAD, Dude!" while riding my Raleigh). Brakes and other parts are good fits and there are some good performance parts that are cheap (Chinese made, but reasonable quality). This is a chromoly seatpost with good chrome - makes this a great fit.

BigChief 07-20-17 08:33 PM


Originally Posted by nlerner (Post 19732028)
Here's an update on the '68 Sports that I've been re-habbing:

As originally found from a local CL seller:

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4233/...9db1df5b_c.jpg

As of this morning:

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4299/...087002a6_c.jpg

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4318/...77804af2_c.jpg

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4291/...99caf157_c.jpg

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4307/...a98e34c7_c.jpg

That almost bronze-green chain guard was in my stash, and it might not look much better than the black one it came with. Otherwise, I was able to re-use almost everything, including the gear cable and barrel end, chain, and brake cables. I had to pull from the bin the 3-speed trigger, one brake pad, some housing, a matching pair of used tires (the existing rear was shot; front will go back in the bin), and that surprisingly comfortable Schwinn-labeled sprung saddle. The rear wheel isn't particularly round because some spokes are stripped in their nipples, but I actually don't notice it while riding. I also had to straighten the bent steerer on the fork, which wasn't too arduous. And I'm having a heck of a time centering the rear brake (I think the spring has more tension on one side than the other so some judicious bending is in order). Otherwise, the bright parts cleaned up quite well.

That's a nice one. I've always liked the way the bronze green color aged. Has a dignified look.

ascherer 07-21-17 01:54 PM


Originally Posted by jon.612 (Post 19732594)
It's a "laid back" bmx seatpost. I'm 6'2" riding a 23" bike, but I've found that the bmx world and old Raleighs have a lot in common in terms of parts dimensions, not so much in attitude (I've never said "RAD, Dude!" while riding my Raleigh). Brakes and other parts are good fits and there are some good performance parts that are cheap (Chinese made, but reasonable quality). This is a chromoly seatpost with good chrome - makes this a great fit.

I'm a tad taller and that kind of post might be a smart change, I could use my saddle to be a bit further back.

Cute Boy Horse 07-21-17 03:24 PM

After having both a return spring snap and the second lever pivot eyebolt come loose, I decided it was time to finally replace the handlebars altogether.

https://s23.postimg.org/3ncesw5cb/IMG_2348.jpg

I found a shop in Germany which imported a bunch of Atlas bikes from India and split them down into individual parts. What's interesting is the thread dimensions are exactly the same as Raleigh, but the across-the-flats of every nut is much larger, more or less 11mm. I like that, much easier 3/16th whitworth spanner in Holland.

The one thing though is that the quality control is non existent. The first pair of these atlas bars I had, the chrome all peeled off and the pivot bolt came totally loose immediately. The second pair seems fine though.

SirMike1983 07-21-17 03:52 PM


Originally Posted by Cute Boy Horse (Post 19735964)
After having both a return spring snap and the second lever pivot eyebolt come loose, I decided it was time to finally replace the handlebars altogether.

https://s23.postimg.org/3ncesw5cb/IMG_2348.jpg

I found a shop in Germany which imported a bunch of Atlas bikes from India and split them down into individual parts. What's interesting is the thread dimensions are exactly the same as Raleigh, but the across-the-flats of every nut is much larger, more or less 11mm. I like that, much easier 3/16th whitworth spanner in Holland.

The one thing though is that the quality control is non existent. The first pair of these atlas bars I had, the chrome all peeled off and the pivot bolt came totally loose immediately. The second pair seems fine though.

They copied Raleighs. I think Sen-Raleigh was the Indian subsidiary for many years. Eastmans also swap with Raleigh parts. I used Eastman bars for awhile because I also had an eyelet come loose on my 1978 DL-1. I eventually found a set of Raleigh bars that were good and put them on. Don't mess with the eyelets unless you can get them to screw back down on the first try. They just come loose again, unless you really nail tightening them back down. Sometimes they're just too far gone.

Cute Boy Horse 07-21-17 04:00 PM

Yeah I know about the influence of Raleigh in India as well as how much of a bugger the eyelets are when they go wrong, that's why I replaced the bars and chose ones from India.

I did see a dutch market superbe which had the exact same shape north road bars as the UK original, but instead of screwed in pivot bolts it had a big cast section marked prominently "Raleigh stainless" which looked massively stronger. Haven't been able to source a set though, every rod braked Raleigh on marktplaats is the normal type.

Can you guess what the ziptied box does?

BigChief 07-21-17 04:25 PM

Haven't had trouble with loose eyelets yet, but considering what I've heard here about the futility of repairing these and the poor plating of the handlebars from China and India, I think I'd try drilling it through and making a stainless steel eyelet that bolted through the bar.

hillikus 07-22-17 07:46 AM

Not sure if this is in line with current pricing, but this thing looks beautiful. If I didn't already have too many bikes(as if that can happen) for a military family that moves every few years, this might come home with me. This isn't my bike and I don't have a dog in the fight, just love the older 3 speeds and always keep an eye out for them. I could easily facilitate if someone needed the help.

https://omaha.craigslist.org/bik/d/h...170190874.html

-H

SirMike1983 07-22-17 12:37 PM


Originally Posted by hillikus (Post 19737121)
Not sure if this is in line with current pricing, but this thing looks beautiful. If I didn't already have too many bikes(as if that can happen) for a military family that moves every few years, this might come home with me. This isn't my bike and I don't have a dog in the fight, just love the older 3 speeds and always keep an eye out for them. I could easily facilitate if someone needed the help.

https://omaha.craigslist.org/bik/d/h...170190874.html

-H

The Raleigh-AMF Hercules bikes like that generally are not worth much, but I think that higher price is fair, considering the condition. That is near the top end of the universe for AMF Hercules common bikes, but given the condition, I don't think it's out of line.

Dsprok 07-22-17 02:04 PM


Originally Posted by hillikus (Post 19737121)
Not sure if this is in line with current pricing, but this thing looks beautiful. If I didn't already have too many bikes(as if that can happen) for a military family that moves every few years, this might come home with me. This isn't my bike and I don't have a dog in the fight, just love the older 3 speeds and always keep an eye out for them. I could easily facilitate if someone needed the help.

https://omaha.craigslist.org/bik/d/h...170190874.html

-H

The hub is stamped 70 5 yet the ad says 1967 model rode 3 times.

gster 07-24-17 08:01 PM

Rudge Report
 
3 Attachment(s)
Seller in Toronto has this advertised as a 1920's Rudge.
I think it's 50's/ early 60's.
Thoughts?
Attachment 573356

Attachment 573357

Attachment 573358

clubman 07-24-17 08:05 PM

Raleigh bought Rudge in 43 so it's post war. Big deep handlebars and interesting fluted 3 pin cranks with acorn nuts. Fork bend is free? ;)

Wileyone 07-24-17 08:35 PM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19742633)
Raleigh bought Rudge in 43 so it's post war. Big deep handlebars and interesting fluted 3 pin cranks with acorn nuts. Fork bend is free? ;)

The War ended in 1945. So Rudge would have been sold in War Time.

Delboy Avenger 07-25-17 12:53 AM

Rim and hub
 
Came across a Maxim (made in england) hub laced to a Dunlop 26 1 3/8 Westwood rim with nipple washers fitted.
I've never heard of a Maxim hub, no info on the net.

Is this an original combination or a new hub?

Best Regards

BigChief 07-25-17 03:55 AM


Originally Posted by gster (Post 19742623)
Seller in Toronto has this advertised as a 1920's Rudge.
I think it's 50's/ early 60's.
Thoughts?
Attachment 573356

Attachment 573357

Attachment 573358

Wow, that's a good one. Raleigh made. (post war) It has the old style (pre 55) head tube lug shape which would make the bolt on cable guide pre 52-53. The latest feature I see is the shifter. Post 1948.

gster 07-25-17 05:02 AM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19743090)
Wow, that's a good one. Raleigh made. (post war) It has the old style (pre 55) head tube lug shape which would make the bolt on cable guide pre 52-53. The latest feature I see is the shifter. Post 1948.

Good detective work.

arty dave 07-25-17 05:03 AM

I finally got the DL-1 stripped down. I find it really satisfying to break a bike down into its parts. One of the cotter pins broke a g-clamp :( and then the vice popped them both out whole and re-usable.

I found someone to help me with the fork alignment.
I'd like to 're-set' the stance of the bike, as I noticed that the top tube was slanting down towards the front compared to images on here of DL-1's where the top tube looks like it's parallel to the ground. So I think this might mean that there is too much bend in the forks, which might have happened during shipping.
I read somewhere that the rake on a DL-1 fork should be 3 inches - can anyone please take a look at their forks to give me a measurement?
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4311/...6380b25ba8.jpggeometry_fork_rake copy by arty dave armour, on Flickr
I measured mine by placing a straight-edge along the centre line of the forks. From the straight-edge to the drop-out centre on one side was 85mm (3 & 3/8"), and about 90mm on the other (3 & 1/2")

clubman 07-25-17 05:24 AM

The original question was whether the bike from the 20's. Which it's not. It's safe to say it's post war, as Raleigh made armaments and military bikes, not consumer models. We're just ID'ing the era, as Big Chief has done nicely.

BigChief 07-25-17 06:50 AM


Originally Posted by arty dave (Post 19743131)
I finally got the DL-1 stripped down. I find it really satisfying to break a bike down into its parts. One of the cotter pins broke a g-clamp :( and then the vice popped them both out whole and re-usable.

I found someone to help me with the fork alignment.
I'd like to 're-set' the stance of the bike, as I noticed that the top tube was slanting down towards the front compared to images on here of DL-1's where the top tube looks like it's parallel to the ground. So I think this might mean that there is too much bend in the forks, which might have happened during shipping.
I read somewhere that the rake on a DL-1 fork should be 3 inches - can anyone please take a look at their forks to give me a measurement?
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4311/...6380b25ba8.jpggeometry_fork_rake copy by arty dave armour, on Flickr
I measured mine by placing a straight-edge along the centre line of the forks. From the straight-edge to the drop-out centre on one side was 85mm (3 & 3/8"), and about 90mm on the other (3 & 1/2")

It's hard to be very precise getting a centerline on the tapered fork, but both of my DL-1s seem to be 3 1/2".

capnjonny 07-25-17 07:40 AM

has anyone tried using a thumb shifter on a SA three speed?

I find the SA shifter a bit vague and clunky and wondered if there is anything else that works better?

I have a 1969 Sport in the garage stripped down waiting for me to recover from a broken hip so I can touch up the paint and clear coat it. It is going to be a beautiful bike when finished. I will probably leave it all stock except for a 22 tooth cog in back but might do a little customizing just to be different.

noglider 07-25-17 08:42 AM


Originally Posted by capnjonny (Post 19743373)
has anyone tried using a thumb shifter on a SA three speed?

I find the SA shifter a bit vague and clunky and wondered if there is anything else that works better?

I had a thumb shifter on an S3X hub which is a 3-speed fixed gear hub. It was fine. But the regular shifter is not the least bit vague in my opinion. If yours is, maybe some parts in it are worn, or maybe you just need lubrication.

Salubrious 07-25-17 10:00 AM


Originally Posted by capnjonny (Post 19743373)
has anyone tried using a thumb shifter on a SA three speed?

I find the SA shifter a bit vague and clunky and wondered if there is anything else that works better?

Clunky yes vague not at all! you might want to see if your cable sleeves are gummed up.

arex 07-25-17 12:05 PM


Originally Posted by capnjonny (Post 19743373)
has anyone tried using a thumb shifter on a SA three speed?

I find the SA shifter a bit vague and clunky and wondered if there is anything else that works better?

I have a 1969 Sport in the garage stripped down waiting for me to recover from a broken hip so I can touch up the paint and clear coat it. It is going to be a beautiful bike when finished. I will probably leave it all stock except for a 22 tooth cog in back but might do a little customizing just to be different.

S-A (modern-day) makes a nice indexed 3-speed thumb shifter. I put one on my wife's R20, and I have a similar bar-end shifter on my Sports.

clubman 07-25-17 12:21 PM


Originally Posted by Salubrious (Post 19743719)
Clunky yes vague not at all! you might want to see if your cable sleeves are gummed up.

+1 Voted most decisive indexed gearing 10 decades in a row. By someone.

Your shifter may be gummed up as well. Or your hub.

BigChief 07-25-17 12:58 PM


Originally Posted by capnjonny (Post 19743373)
has anyone tried using a thumb shifter on a SA three speed?

I find the SA shifter a bit vague and clunky and wondered if there is anything else that works better?

I have a 1969 Sport in the garage stripped down waiting for me to recover from a broken hip so I can touch up the paint and clear coat it. It is going to be a beautiful bike when finished. I will probably leave it all stock except for a 22 tooth cog in back but might do a little customizing just to be different.

The issue there is that the shifter has to be indexed correctly for the hub. Notice the long gap between 2nd and 3rd on the trigger shifter. That's because there's a neutral that needs to be avoided. The triggers do have a clunk to them, but I've never found them to be vague. Maybe some part of the system isn't working as well as it should.

arty dave 07-25-17 04:15 PM


Originally Posted by BigChief (Post 19743263)
It's hard to be very precise getting a centerline on the tapered fork, but both of my DL-1s seem to be 3 1/2".

Thanks BigChief! Appreciated :)
Are the top bars parallel to the ground?

BigChief 07-25-17 06:30 PM

Yes, to my eye. Here they are

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4305/...f259e716_b.jpgdaily ride by Billy Bones, on Flickr

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4319/...aff3960f_b.jpg73DL1a by Billy Bones, on Flickr

arty dave 07-25-17 06:52 PM

Yes they are :) Big thanks BigChief!
That helps me feel more confident on what I'll ask the bike mechanic to do. I'll be taking the forks to him today & I'll print out your 2 images so he gets a better idea of the fork rake.

arty dave 07-26-17 02:09 AM

Straightened forks woohoo! Took about 15 mins. He had obviously done it before and had a good eye for the necessary manipulations, plus the tools to check the measurements.
I thought I may as well have a go at the drive side BB cup and it actually came out! I didn't think that would happen because it was painted over, usually meaning stuck. Yesterday I took off the non-drive side BB cup and saw what I thought was PVC tubing in the BB, but had no time to look any further. So today after wiping out the old grease (in OK condition but a little gritty) there is definitely a PVC tubing sleeve in there, with a secondary PVC ring with a notch cut out to fit around the BB grease nipple. The whole thing was completely full and overflowing out into the chaincase :) and a really tight fit - I could hammer it out but I might just leave it there.

Cute Boy Horse 07-26-17 02:52 AM


Originally Posted by clubman (Post 19743147)
The original question was whether the bike from the 20's. Which it's not. It's safe to say it's post war, as Raleigh made armaments and military bikes, not consumer models. We're just ID'ing the era, as Big Chief has done nicely.

Raleigh still made bikes for the public during the war, they put out special brochures with patriotic stuff in them


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